Christian Prison

[Sir Rhetor]

http://www.au.org/media/press-releases/ ... rison.html
http://www.drudge.com/news/127323/oklah ... ian-prison

So apparently Christians saved up enough money to build their very own prison. This prison will hire only Christians, which is certainly against the law. Another important piece of information is that it is not a maximum security prison, and it will only be for prisoners at the end of their sentence.

The prison is obviously set up to be primed for proselytizers, who will share the Bible with the criminals.

Is this a good idea, or is it discriminatory, disastrous, and ironic?

[East of Eden]

How great is that?

All the successes you can count for a god you can't show exists.

All the failures you get to blame on some bogeyman you can't show exists.

I'd be curious to know if public funds are used.

I'd say large numbers of dramatically changed lives is evidence for His existance.

Why don't you start your own religion and try to get the same results?

[JoeyKnothead]

From Post 12:

I'd say large numbers of dramatically changed lives is evidence for His existance.

You'd say it. You'd never be able to prove it.

Why don't you start your own religion and try to get the same results?

I'm not a con man.

[East of Eden]

You'd say it. You'd never be able to prove it.

Not to someone who's mind is already made up to reject God. Read the survey with the aforementioned results I posted earlier.

I'm not a con man.

Neither am I.

[Abraxas]

I still would like my question from up the thread answered. Would you support a similar institution built upon Islamic teachings and institutions, that let people go early for accepting the words of the Prophet Muhammad as the word of God or is that a special privilege reserved for those who accept Christ and Christ alone?

[East of Eden]

I still would like my question from up the thread answered. Would you support a similar institution built upon Islamic teachings and institutions, that let people go early

Where does it say they let prisoners go early? The OP says it is for prisoners at the end of their sentences.

for accepting the words of the Prophet Muhammad as the word of God or is that a special privilege reserved for those who accept Christ and Christ alone?

I wouldn't care of Muslims did this, as long as it wasn't controlled by radicals. An alarming number of Muslim prison chaplins are radical. Here is a discussion of this problem: http://www.radicalislam.org/content/rob ... nt-prisons Note the NY prison Iman fired after declaring in one of his 'sermons' that the 9/11 criminals should be considered Islamic martyrs. I guess it's a short step from street thug to jihadist.

There is a difference between a Christian program with good results (much less recarceration) and a Wahabbi Muslim program that radicalizes inmates for an even more criminal future.

IMHO it is a bit different when talking about radical Islam as it is as much a fascist, expansionary political ideology as it is a religion.

[JBlack]

I'd say large numbers of dramatically changed lives is evidence for His existance.

No, it isn't. Can it be shown that it's God that made them change, and not just their belief in God?

Can it be shown that this is an actual causation and not just merely a correlation?

The Federal Gov't. does currently pay for chaplains.

This prison isn't just talking about hiring a chaplain or two. They're saying that they're only going to hire christians... period. What right does a publicly funded prison have to only hire workers of a certain religion? Do you honestly and seriously disagree that this is wrong? Since the religion happens to be yours, that makes it ok?

[East of Eden]

No, it isn't. Can it be shown that it's God that made them change, and not just their belief in God?

Are there other religions getting similar 'results' due to their belief in their God?

This prison isn't just talking about hiring a chaplain or two. They're saying that they're only going to hire christians... period. What right does a publicly funded prison have to only hire workers of a certain religion?

So have a bunch of Bhuddists start their own prison program.

Do you honestly and seriously disagree that this is wrong?

Yes.

Since the religion happens to be yours, that makes it ok?

You seem to oppose this because the religion isn't yours.

[JBlack]

No, it isn't. Can it be shown that it's God that made them change, and not just their belief in God?

Are there other religions getting similar 'results' due to their belief in their God?

I don't know of any official studies to refer you to, but I do know a few guys that became Muslim in prison and haven't returned since. Doesn't matter though. It can't be shown that God made any of these people change.

This prison isn't just talking about hiring a chaplain or two. They're saying that they're only going to hire christians... period. What right does a publicly funded prison have to only hire workers of a certain religion?

So have a bunch of Bhuddists start their own prison program.

So you have no problem with Buddhists using taxpayer money to fund a prison that's only going to hire Buddhists?...

Since the religion happens to be yours, that makes it ok?

You seem to oppose this because the religion isn't yours.

I have no religion. However, if a prison, that's being funded with public money, said that they were only going to hire people who are non-religious, I'd be equally opposed.

[Abraxas]

I still would like my question from up the thread answered. Would you support a similar institution built upon Islamic teachings and institutions, that let people go early

Where does it say they let prisoners go early? The OP says it is for prisoners at the end of their sentences.

It doesn't (yet) for this one specifically, however other prisons do have release programs for 'good Christians' and something tells me this one probably won't be different.

Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2004/06/10/natio ... UR.html?hp

for accepting the words of the Prophet Muhammad as the word of God or is that a special privilege reserved for those who accept Christ and Christ alone?

I wouldn't care of Muslims did this, as long as it wasn't controlled by radicals. An alarming number of Muslim prison chaplins are radical. Here is a discussion of this problem: http://www.radicalislam.org/content/rob ... nt-prisons Note the NY prison Iman fired after declaring in one of his 'sermons' that the 9/11 criminals should be considered Islamic martyrs. I guess it's a short step from street thug to jihadist.

There is a difference between a Christian program with good results (much less recarceration) and a Wahabbi Muslim program that radicalizes inmates for an even more criminal future.

IMHO it is a bit different when talking about radical Islam as it is as much a fascist, expansionary political ideology as it is a religion.

I could say the same of a lot of Christians in the US who are pushing for Christian law in place of what currently exists. Further, as already pointed out, the results are ambiguous at best. Correlation is not causation and should not be treated as such.

Directed at JBlack, I know, but I oppose this not because the religion isn't mine but because giving anyone special privileges, including such things as getting out of jail sooner, because of their belief set is a direct violation of the ideals of religious freedom and equality under the law.

[JoeyKnothead]

From Post 14:

Not to someone who's mind is already made up to reject God. Read the survey with the aforementioned results I posted earlier.

As mentioned before, there's the whole causation / corelation issue. When folks believe they must act in a certain fashion because their favored god is apt to get upset, then they're more likely to act in a certain fashion. This is not evidence of a deity, but basically the power of positive thinking. You're asking folks who've admitted to religious belief to confirm that belief based on their actions, and not any evidence that deity actually influenced their lives.

Of course if I ever get arrested in Oklahoma I'll start that whole pious Christian deal and hope to get sent to the easy prison (blame my ills on Satan and all that instead of addressing the underlying issues).

I'm not a con man.

Neither am I.

I didn't ask you, but I 'preciate the sharing. You asked why I don't start my own religion and I told you. My point is that I have no way to show one's actions are the product of a god, so trying to declare such is a sort of con.