What does Intelligent Design prove?

man · Post by **man** » Fri Jul 22, 2016 12:41 am

What does Intelligent Design prove?

I must have asked that question a thousand times in various forms and comment sections and not one single person has ever said, It proves there is a god.

Why is that?

theStudent · Post by **theStudent** » Wed Jul 27, 2016 1:50 pm

[Replying to post 53 by Bust Nak]

Bust Nak wrote:Not necessarily, as long as one do not mix the two.

When you say that, do you mean that a superhuman designer cannot be associated with science, or logic?

Bust Nak wrote:What doesn't make sense, is to infer a design from mere complex pattern.

Okay.
Let's use the cell, as an example.
Would it be senseless to infer from the cells design that there is a designer?

Donray · Post by **Donray** » Wed Jul 27, 2016 1:53 pm

the Student just give the standard retreat that he was taught since birth.

He will not be swayed by and facts or evidence that Evolution Theory is true. Even though there is 150 years of evidence that it is true.

People like theStudent need to believe or there lives are meaning less.

Everyone noticed that theStudent cannot answer simple questions about his belief. For example I asked why god put holes in the universe. Since there is an intelligent design then surely he can tell use about this design.

He does not address the issue of the bad design of some features of humans such as a weak spine that is more fit for fore legs.

He does not believe in evolution yet at the same time says that all faults are because of evolution since god did not like Eve gaining knowledge.

theStudent has not once said who he intends to prove ID is true.

Why doesn't theStudent present his complete theory on ID.

man · Post by **man** » Wed Jul 27, 2016 2:12 pm

theStudent wrote: [Replying to post 46 by man]

No.
It's a definite No.

Note
For those who recognize that God is good - which is not most people - they have faith in his word of promise, that they (those who recognize God's goodness, and cling to him) can look forward to the future, with faith, and hope - where sickness, pain and death will be no more. (Revelation 21:3-5)

Not only do those who recognize his goodness, and cling to him, look forward to benefits in the future, but they benefit right now, from lives they consider to be meaningful, and filled with purpose.
Which part do you find not too clear?

So it's not something that benefits all of human kind, but benefits only the individual?

theStudent · Post by **theStudent** » Wed Jul 27, 2016 2:27 pm

Donray wrote: the Student just give the standard retreat that he was taught since birth.

He will not be swayed by and facts or evidence that Evolution Theory is true. Even though there is 150 years of evidence that it is true.

People like theStudent need to believe or there lives are meaning less.

Everyone noticed that theStudent cannot answer simple questions about his belief. For example I asked why god put holes in the universe. Since there is an intelligent design then surely he can tell use about this design.

He does not address the issue of the bad design of some features of humans such as a weak spine that is more fit for fore legs.

He does not believe in evolution yet at the same time says that all faults are because of evolution since god did not like Eve gaining knowledge.

theStudent has not once said who he intends to prove ID is true.

Why doesn't theStudent present his complete theory on ID.

LOL. You guys are so funny.
You like to dress up, and look pretty, for others to see, and give you praise.

Jesus had similar individuals to deal with in his day.

You asked me many questions.
I answered.
You refuse to accept the answers, because they do not suit your beliefs. And I am the one who

will not be swayed by and facts or evidence

?

I don't have to respond, but I will do so, For the record.

Everything in nature has a purpose.
From the tiniest that scientists has yet to discover, to the largest that they will never discover (imo).
What scientists call junk DNA, is not junk. They don't understand it.
What scientists call black hokes, are not holes, or bad, or flawed, because they call it such. They don't understand it.
What scientists believe to be unnecessary are not unnecessary, because they say so.
Scientists are puny humans, in a vast universe, of which they know zilch, in comparison.
They don't understand it.

Conclusion

God created everything for a purpose.
Mere man does not understand everything .

Hence, my advice - Humble yourselves, therefore, under the mighty hand of God, so that he may exalt you in due time... - The apostle Peter (1 Peter 5:6)

You may go ahead with your illusion of glory.

theStudent · Post by **theStudent** » Wed Jul 27, 2016 2:34 pm

[Replying to post 63 by man]

Great! You got it!

To add.
Imo, everything in nature is designed with purpose.
So if the designer wants everything to work in perfect harmony, he has to root out everything that is not in harmony - including people that are for the motto, "Do What Thou Wilt".

That's the reason for freedom of choice.
Everyone has that choice imo.

man · Post by **man** » Wed Jul 27, 2016 2:49 pm

theStudent wrote: [Replying to post 63 by man]

Great! You got it!

To add.
Imo, everything in nature is designed with purpose.
So if the designer wants everything to work in perfect harmony, he has to root out everything that is not in harmony - including people that are for the motto, "Do What Thou Wilt".

That's the reason for freedom of choice.
Everyone has that choice imo.

So god hates everybody else?

theStudent · Post by **theStudent** » Wed Jul 27, 2016 3:29 pm

[Replying to post 66 by man]

If that were true, I don't think any of us would be on any computer communicating right now, because we would all be non-existent.

God is love, but he is also holy.
So at the time he is ready to harmonize everything, it is obvious he needs to remove anything that would prevent, or form a resistance to that harmony.

For example, people raise animals as pets, because they love them.
Everyone has different tastes, so some raise dogs, some lions, or tigers, some crocodiles, or alligators, some snakes...

But sometimes, some of those animal lovers feel forced to "put down", one of those animals.

You likely saw how hurt the zookeepers were, who felt they had to shoot and kill the gorilla, in order to save the boy that fell in the lair.

And people have had to chop a snake, and even kill crocodiles, in order to save a life.

These actions have bought relief not only to the saved ones and their relatives, but even the animal lovers, who even though saddened by the lost of the animal, are relieved that they saved a life.

In the same way, God has to remove resistant destructive individuals in order to save the lives of others. It's not something he enjoys.
According to the prophet Ezekiel,

of God he wrote: ...I do not take any pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Sovereign Lord Jehovah. So turn back and live.

Ezekiel 18:33

Do you think that there are stubborn people, who do not listen to reason, but who insist on doing what ever they want irregardless of any damaging consequences?

Donray · Post by **Donray** » Wed Jul 27, 2016 3:29 pm

theStudent wrote:
Donray wrote: the Student just give the standard retreat that he was taught since birth.

He will not be swayed by and facts or evidence that Evolution Theory is true. Even though there is 150 years of evidence that it is true.

People like theStudent need to believe or there lives are meaning less.

Everyone noticed that theStudent cannot answer simple questions about his belief. For example I asked why god put holes in the universe. Since there is an intelligent design then surely he can tell use about this design.

He does not address the issue of the bad design of some features of humans such as a weak spine that is more fit for fore legs.

He does not believe in evolution yet at the same time says that all faults are because of evolution since god did not like Eve gaining knowledge.

theStudent has not once said who he intends to prove ID is true.

Why doesn't theStudent present his complete theory on ID.
LOL. You guys are so funny.
You like to dress up, and look pretty, for others to see, and give you praise.

Jesus had similar individuals to deal with in his day.

You asked me many questions.
I answered.
You refuse to accept the answers, because they do not suit your beliefs. And I am the one who
will not be swayed by and facts or evidence
?

I don't have to respond, but I will do so, For the record.

Everything in nature has a purpose.
From the tiniest that scientists has yet to discover, to the largest that they will never discover (imo).
What scientists call junk DNA, is not junk. They don't understand it.
What scientists call black hokes, are not holes, or bad, or flawed, because they call it such. They don't understand it.
What scientists believe to be unnecessary are not unnecessary, because they say so.
Scientists are puny humans, in a vast universe, of which they know zilch, in comparison.
They don't understand it.

Conclusion

God created everything for a purpose.
Mere man does not understand everything .

Hence, my advice - Humble yourselves, therefore, under the mighty hand of God, so that he may exalt you in due time... - The apostle Peter (1 Peter 5:6)

You may go ahead with your illusion of glory.

You do realize you explained nothing. You just have questions that you don't have and answer and because you have no answer Allah did. Allah is the great is that correct?

You explained the god of the gaps theory correctly.

You failed answer why you god created cancer you don't believe it evolved and therefore your god created it.

According to you the Ark could never have held every animal. At least Christians have tried to explain the story by using evolution in that only one horse like animal or dog like animal was on the Ark and all the current animals evolved form these. You have no explanation.

You have failed to explain which god created things. You have failed to say how god was created since everything needs a creator. Or are you going to the except god idea?

You need some theory what type of material your god is made up of and what he used to create? Playdough?

Everything must be created for a reason and yet you gave no reason virus or Black holes. Why do you god create an earth that has plates that move and therefore kill people with earthquakes?

YOU FAILED TO EPLIN ANYTHING. THE ONLY YOU DID WAS STATE STUFF YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND.

Clownboat · Post by **Clownboat** » Wed Jul 27, 2016 3:58 pm

theStudent wrote:
Clownboat wrote:
theStudent wrote:
Delphi wrote: Thank you for this information, theStudent. We are all aware of this info, but it is always amazing to hear it again.

We can all agree that we are very complex organisms.

Unfortunately, one cannot logically connect biological complexity to the concept of a deity.

This seems like a big fat god of the gaps argument to me.

The glaring problem is that you cannot show that your creator exists, you cannot demonstrate by what means your creator created, and this entire postulation cannot be demonstrated, verified, nor falsified by any means.

The elephant in this epistemological room is that there is NO evidence that any of any supposed designer(s) had a hand in creating anything. ANYTHING.

You can assert that Joe built my brain, but if you can't even show that Joe exists you've got a major problem.
No.
The evidence has been demonstrated.
Just because someone shuts their eyes to evidence, does not nullify it.

Here is another simple demonstration of that.
If I saw a huge rock, or rocks carved out in a concave close to the sea.
I could easily conclude that over time, the salt water from the sea as it's waves bashed against the rocks, caused that effect. Same with nearby caves.
I can say this because I see it demonstrated.

It is demonstrated, that a simple house requires a builder.
In fact, not only a house, everything, inducing sculpted rock, machinery artificial flowers, etc.
Thus, someone was responsible for designing the brain to work, and that person is far greater than you and I.
So to complain that no one has brought him and shown you, is a poor excuse to an obvious no contest.
It's obviously grabbing at straws.
What is so confusing, and this only seems to affect creationists, about the fact that houses are not biological creatures that reproduce with mutations?

A builder can build two identical homes to start with. Let's call them mom and dad. He can at a later date build two more identical homes. Let's call them son and daughter.

Compare this to the real world where biological creatures that reproduce via sexual reproduction never have offspring that are identical to the parents. Variation is built into one and not the other, but creationists don't seem to be able to grasp this fact and continue to make nonsensical claims.

Yes, I know you are a biological creature, but lets compare you to this roller coaster or this 747. See! No evolution!

If I went into a desert and found a house, fully furnished, and decorated, and I reasoned, that all of it just happened by chance, I'd be the laughing stock.
I go into a desert, and find a living species, and I reason that it happened by chance, and I am praised as a sensible, logical, and intelligent individual.
How is that forward?

One reproduces via biological sexual reproduction.
The other does not.

What you say equates to, "the sky is blue, therefore outer space is blue".

Clownboat · Post by **Clownboat** » Wed Jul 27, 2016 4:12 pm

theStudent wrote: [Replying to post 66 by man]

If that were true, I don't think any of us would be on any computer communicating right now, because we would all be non-existent.

God is love, but he is also holy.
So at the time he is ready to harmonize everything, it is obvious he needs to remove anything that would prevent, or form a resistance to that harmony.

For example, people raise animals as pets, because they love them.
Everyone has different tastes, so some raise dogs, some lions, or tigers, some crocodiles, or alligators, some snakes...

But sometimes, some of those animal lovers feel forced to "put down", one of those animals.

You likely saw how hurt the zookeepers were, who felt they had to shoot and kill the gorilla, in order to save the boy that fell in the lair.

And people have had to chop a snake, and even kill crocodiles, in order to save a life.

These actions have bought relief not only to the saved ones and their relatives, but even the animal lovers, who even though saddened by the lost of the animal, are relieved that they saved a life.

In the same way, God has to remove resistant destructive individuals in order to save the lives of others. It's not something he enjoys.
According to the prophet Ezekiel,
of God he wrote: ...I do not take any pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Sovereign Lord Jehovah. So turn back and live.
Ezekiel 18:33

Do you think that there are stubborn people, who do not listen to reason, but who insist on doing what ever they want irregardless of any damaging consequences?

This is the science sub forum.
We are suppose to be free from being preached at here.
Please respect the rules.

I suggest "Holy Huddle" would be more suited for you and your preaching.