Does God change his mind?

OnceConvinced · Post by **OnceConvinced** » Mon Feb 13, 2017 4:52 pm

A Christian member of our forum recently pointed out a bible contradiction for all to see:

This verse was presented first:
Numbers 23:19 "God is not human, that he should lie, not a human being, that he should change his mind."

The Christian then attempted to trump it with a contradictory scripture where God DOES change his mind, thus exposing a blatant bible contradiction:

Jeremiah 18:8 "But if that nation about which I spoke turns from its evil way, I'll change my mind about the disaster that I had planned for it."

Here are further verses that show God changing his mind:

Exodus 32:14
So the LORD changed His mind about the harm which He said He would do to His people.

Amos 7:3
The LORD changed His mind about this. "It shall not be," said the LORD.

Jeremiah 18:10
if it does evil in My sight by not obeying My voice, then I will think better of the good with which I had promised to bless it. (wow this is a verse where God says he will break his promise!!)

So questions for debate:

Does Got change his mind?
If he does change his mind, how do we know he hasn't changed his mind about much of what he expected from us in the New Testament?
If he does change his mind, how can we really know what he wants of us today?

Blastcat · Post by **Blastcat** » Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:52 am

[Replying to post 30 by 2timothy316]

2timothy316 wrote: [Replying to post 28 by Blastcat]

Ok. Perhaps being a bit clearer will help

.

One liners back and forth like this aren't allowed in here.. but I am going to risk it anyway.. I'm a bad boy..

Here is the one liner:

"If you ask , you might receive"

____________

Question:

So, what part don't you understand?

____________

2timothy316 · Post by **2timothy316** » Tue Feb 21, 2017 11:13 am

Blastcat wrote:
So, what part don't you understand?

He decides the rules that WE HAVE TO obey or ELSE.

You can burn in hell, or obey.
Take your pick, that's up to you.

Sorry, but if I were REALLY FREE to decide, God wouldn't NEED to put a gun to my head.

First: Are you pro-obey or prefer disobeying? Because it really looks like you're encouraging disobedience.

Blastcat · Post by **Blastcat** » Tue Feb 21, 2017 12:00 pm

[Replying to post 32 by 2timothy316]

[center]
Still not getting it[/center]

2timothy316 wrote:

First: Are you pro-obey or prefer disobeying? Because it really looks like you're encouraging disobedience.

Pro or not, it has no effect on my point at all.
But since you take the trouble to ask, I'll reply anyway.

I am neither PRO nor ANTI "obedience".
DO whatever you like, obey, don't obey, that's your concern.

But you still don't seem to know what my point is.
So, here is another hint:

_________________

Go to the bottom of post 23 in this thread, and then you might notice this sentence in bold:

[center]Death threats are an act of AGGRESSION, not of love.[/center]

_________________

If you still have any trouble understanding that, feel free to ask for an explanation.

2timothy316 · Post by **2timothy316** » Tue Feb 21, 2017 12:38 pm

[Replying to post 33 by Blastcat]

Well then I guess you must hate almost every government in the world then. I know of no land that have laws where there are no consequences for disobeying the laws. Perhaps you think you'd be happier in a land without laws? Somalia would be a good choice. They don't put a gun to your head and force you to obey laws. They simply just puts guns to people's heads for no reason.

This why I don't think you know what you're really saying when you say "Death threats are an act of AGGRESSION, not of love." You've given this very little thought as to what you suggesting. Law without consequences AKA lawlessness, invites death and acts of aggression from people. Laws and obeying those laws invites love and peace. It's like you're saying, 'if a law has consequences for not following it, then I don't want to follow that law and they are big meanies for having consequences'. This is a ridiculous statement and it's worth is very low. We as humans do things a certain way everyday because of the threat of something bad happening. Put on seatbelts so we don't die in a car crash. Avoid cliffs so we don't fall to our deaths. Learn to swim so we don't drown. We don't murder so that we are imprisoned for life or put to death. When it comes to God, don't ruin the Earth for others so that God will not ruin us.

So go, move to Somalia where there are no laws in forced. You get to make your own laws. They can be anything you want. No one will follow them of course, but hey that's the type of person you want to be around right? With your laws I wouldn't try to enforce them in Somalia. Like you they don't like being told what to do under threat. No one will put a gun to your head to move. Just don't expect not to have a gun to your head when you get there.

Think man!

I hate to be the one to tell you this, but you are under laws of nature right now that if you try to break or don't respect will have dire consequences and there is nothing you can do about it no matter how upset it makes you.

Blastcat · Post by **Blastcat** » Tue Feb 21, 2017 1:40 pm

[Replying to post 34 by 2timothy316]

[center]Some people think that death threats mean love.[/center]

2timothy316 wrote:
Well then I guess you must hate almost every government in the world then.

Where did you ever get that idea from?

2timothy316 wrote:
Perhaps you think you'd be happier in a land without laws?

Where did you ever get that idea from?

2timothy316 wrote:
This why I don't think you know what you're really saying when you say "Death threats are an act of AGGRESSION, not of love."

Go ahead and believe that death threats are acts of love all you like.
It seems to explain why you think that your god is a loving god.

The more he threatens you of violence, the more he shows how much he loves you.

2timothy316 · Post by **2timothy316** » Tue Feb 21, 2017 1:55 pm

Blastcat wrote:

Go ahead and believe that death threats are acts of love all you like.
It seems to explain why you think that your god is a loving god.

The more he threatens you of violence, the more he shows how much he loves you.

Believe as you wish as well. If you what to focus on disobeying and if that is your choice then expect the consequences. I on the other hand do not have to worry about the consequences or any threat because I enjoy obeying and the blessings that come with it.

It seems you enjoy rebellion. So be it. With your hate of laws with consequences I'd recommend not hating your local laws. You have demonstrated your hate for the laws that have consequences, I hope you will be safe out there and don't go walking into traffic because the traffic law threatens you with a violent end if you disobey.

Blastcat · Post by **Blastcat** » Tue Feb 21, 2017 2:09 pm

[Replying to post 36 by 2timothy316]

[center]
Some folks LOVE to obey someone who threatens them with death[/center]

2timothy316 wrote:
If you what to focus on disobeying and if that is your choice then expect the consequences. I on the other hand do not have to worry about the consequences or any threat because I enjoy obeying and the blessings that come with it.

You think that someone who would threaten you, your loved ones and your friends and relatives isn't an evil person?

Be my guest.
Enjoy obeying it.

2timothy316 wrote:
It seems you enjoy rebellion.

It seems that you like to make up things about people.

2timothy316 wrote:
With your hate of laws with consequences

You are dreaming this up.
Why don't you tell me MORE about me?

Apparently, you know more about me than I do myself.

2timothy316 · Post by **2timothy316** » Tue Feb 21, 2017 2:20 pm

Blastcat wrote:
You think that someone who would threaten you, your loved ones and your friends and relatives isn't an evil person?

LOL No. Folks that made laws like don't cross the street when it says 'don't walk' are not evil. The folks that put into law burn bans in my county because of the threat of destruction of my neighborhood are not evil people. Nor is Jehovah God evil who's laws include avoiding "hostility, strife, jealousy, fits of anger". Gal 5:20. What about your parents? Did they not tell you not to do things as a child and threaten you with consequences. Like don't touch that hot pan, it will burn you badly. Are they evil for doing that?

It seems that you like to make up things about people.

Just calling as I see it. A respecter of laws, to me seems they wouldn't be calling people that make laws for protection, evil people. Do you call the folks that make up the laws in your city evil because they threaten you with prison?

Apparently, you know more about me than I do myself.

Not you, I just know more about the reasoning you're trying to justify and that reasoning comes from rebellion. The attempt to make a case for braking or ignoring a law. Don't worry, I used to say the same things too in my younger years. Back when I knew everything.

Blastcat · Post by **Blastcat** » Tue Feb 21, 2017 2:46 pm

[Replying to post 38 by 2timothy316]

[center]Loving and obeying an evil psychopath[/center]

Blastcat wrote: You think that someone who would threaten you, your loved ones and your friends and relatives isn't an evil person?

2timothy316 wrote:
LOL No.

We sure are different, you and me.
I can't relate to your blind obedience and your kind of ... "love".

I'm describing a psychopath, and you think that's the same as law makers that I do not have a problem with. If the law makers are making SANE laws that keep us SAFE, I don't have a problem with that. If I'm just expected to OBEY.. and to LOVE and to WORSHIP and so on.. or DIE?

I think that's insane and evil.
We aren't talking about how to cross streets here.

I really can't even THINK of a psychopath like your god.. maybe Kim Jong-un. but I'm not sure that even HE is that psychopathic , evil and crazy. I don't know if he insists to be loved by those he threatens with death if they do not obey each and EVERY order that comes out of his mind today.

Do you consider all dictators perfectly benign?
Who do you think the rule about obeying god comes from?

Who set the punishment for not obeying god?
WHY does God need to KILL us if we don't obey and love him?

Why doesn't he just love the ones who want to love him, and then LEAVE THE REST OF US ALONE?

Sorry, we all JUST have to die?
Sorry, but now, he's JUST going to have to KILL US?

Sorry, but since I don't love or obey your god he is JUST going to send me to an eternal hellfire?

You love and obey a monster.

2timothy316 wrote:
Folks that made laws like don't cross the street when it says 'don't walk' are not evil.

People who say "Do what I say or die" are evil.
People who say "Love me or die" are twisted and evil.

Love whoever you want to love.
We are different.

2timothy316 wrote:
Just calling as I see it. A respecter of laws, to me seems they wouldn't be calling people that make laws for protection, evil people.

You IMAGINE that I don't respect the law?
What are you talking about?

You keep making things up about me and then believe it.
Could you STOP?

It's ridiculous.

2timothy316 wrote:
I just know more about the reasoning you're trying to justify and that reasoning comes from rebellion.

Oh please.
This is getting ridiculous.

I'm not rebelling.
You must be pretending to read my mind or something.

2timothy316 wrote:
Don't worry, I used to say the same things too in my younger years.

You seem to make up things and then believe them.
I'd be quite worried about that kind of thing, if I were you.

2timothy316 wrote:
Back when I knew everything.

You must be dreaming again.
I would never even THINK for a second that I know everything.
And you must be dreaming that you and I were EVER the same.

What preposterous things for you to say about someone eise.

Where oh where do you come UP with this nonsense?
It's not from me, sorry.

I urge you to stop.

2timothy316 · Post by **2timothy316** » Tue Feb 21, 2017 3:08 pm

Blastcat wrote: [Replying to post 38 by 2timothy316]

[center]Loving and obeying an evil psychopath[/center]

Blastcat wrote: You think that someone who would threaten you, your loved ones and your friends and relatives isn't an evil person?

2timothy316 wrote:
LOL No.

We sure are different, you and me.

Um yes.

I can't relate to your blind obedience and your kind of ... "love".

Yet that was something we all do at some point in our life. As a kid you might not have understood why you had to obey certain things. But you trusted them that they were leading you in the right direction. Then as you get older you learn why they did what they did and thank them for it. So you can relate you just don't acknowledge it.

I'm describing a psychopath,

Who? If you say God how can an atheist believe someone who they claim doesn't exist as a 'psychopath? However, I don't believe in this 'psychopath God' either.

and you think that's the same as law makers that I do not have a problem with. If the law makers are making SANE laws that keep us SAFE, I don't have a problem with that.

Whew! That's good, I was starting to wonder if you were going to go out and do something seriously harmful.

If I'm just expected to OBEY.. and to LOVE and to WORSHIP and so on.. or DIE?

I think that's insane and evil.

So when your parents expected you to obey and so on or face punishment, they were evil. Also I'd like to point out not every judgement from God is 'or die'. That's only in your head. There are many times that punishment was not death. Even stealing under the old Mosaic law wasn't death. What is wrong with a commandment 'to love'?

We aren't talking about how to cross streets here.

So what is good for the goose is not good for the gander? So only God gets all the hate speech. Even for all those laws that you do understand and support yet He was the one that made them. As an atheist why spend your time hating someone so much that you don't think is even there to be hated?

I really can't even THINK of a psychopath like your god.. maybe Kim Jong-un. but I'm not sure that even HE is that psychopathic , evil and crazy. I don't know if he insists to be loved by those he threatens with death if they do not obey each and EVERY order that comes out of his mind today.

You seem to be getting angry and just being plain hateful. So we need stop right here. Calling my God a psychopath, evil and crazy is inflammatory speech and is highly offensive and this discussion is no longer civil. I'm out!