JWs consider God's Kingdom to be a Government

[JehovahsWitness]

Jehovah's Witnesses believe God's Kingdom for which many Christians have prayed throughout the ages to be a (heavenly) government (three words).

What, in three or four words if possible, do you believe it to be?

(Many Christians I have met have said its "A feeling" (in one's heart).

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 38 by McCulloch]

Yes, when I say soon I mean the same thing as if I were to say "at hand". Immenent close.

1. SOON
in or after a short time.

synonyms: in a short time, shortly, presently, in the near future, before long, in a little while, in a minute, in a moment, in an instant, in a twinkling, in the twinkling of an eye, before you know it, any minute (now), any day (now), any time (now), by and by;

I have posted about when we will experience the benefits of kingdom rule here; I'll post the link in case you missed it
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 193#852193



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RESPONSE: I thought Jehovah Witnesses claim that Jesus returned in 1914. I would not claim that 1914 to 2017 is a "short" time, do you?

Just when will experience this " we will experience the benefits of kingdom rule " occur or is that just wishful thinking on the part of the JW's?

Yes, biblically 1914 to 2017 is very short indeed, actually it is described in the bible as "a short period of time". Indeed when you compare it to eternity, or even the thousands of years of mans existence, it is a relatively short period of time.


Just when will experience this " we will experience the benefits of kingdom rule " occur ...?

I have already explained this, maybe you missed my post, I will LINK you to what I wrote.
viewtopic.php?p=852193#852193


Regards,

JW

[McCulloch]

[Replying to post 38 by McCulloch]Yes, when I say soon I mean the same thing as if I were to say "at hand". Immenent close.

1. SOON
in or after a short time.
synonyms: in a short time, shortly, presently, in the near future, before long, in a little while, in a minute, in a moment, in an instant, in a twinkling, in the twinkling of an eye, before you know it, any minute (now), any day (now), any time (now), by and by;

Excellent!
Let's look at some examples.

Then He came to the disciples and said to them, Are you still sleeping and resting? Behold, the hour is at hand and the Son of Man is being betrayed into the hands of sinners. Get up, let us be going; behold, the one who betrays Me is at hand!

No one has any difficulty determining what is meant here.

Now after John had been taken into custody, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of God, and saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel.

Using the same words Jesus tells the people that the kingdom of God is at hand. Clearly he did not mean it would come in two years, two decades, two centuries or two millennia. Yet so many Christians seem to believe that the kingdom of heaven is somehow in the future. If the kingdom has not been established then Jesus was wrong.

And he said to me, Do not seal up the words of the prophecy of this book, for the time is near.

Daniel the prophet was told something similar with his book. But his message was the opposite. He was told to seal up his book for the time was far off. So, I propose a simple scriptural test. Estimate the length of time between when Daniel wrote and when his prophesies were fulfilled. That is a long time. Estimate the length of time between when John wrote and when his prophesies have been (or will be) fulfilled. This is a short time. If your short time is roughly the same as your long time, then you are probably mistaken. If your short time is greater than your long time, then you are completely on the wrong track.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 42 by McCulloch]

Was there a part of "when *I* say 'soon' " you were having difficulty in understanding? Or did you think I was Jesus in Garden of Gethsemane? Same species totally different sandals.

[McCulloch]

[Replying to post 42 by McCulloch]

Was there a part of "when *I* say 'soon' " you were having difficulty in understanding? Or did you think I was Jesus in Garden of Gethsemane? Same species totally different sandals.

Let me know if I understand your complaint. When you say soon, you mean what you say. But when Jesus or an angel says soon, you believe that the meaning of the words might be something completely different.

[Checkpoint]

[Replying to post 37 by JehovahsWitness]


JehovahsWitness wrote:

God's kingdom is a govenement made up of Jesus and 144,000 co-rulers.

No kingdom is merely its government.

That should be self-evident, surely.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 44 by McCulloch]

Maybe I can help you this way, its a bit like the question "How long is a piece of string", the answer? "THIS long!" In short, everything is relative. Context is king, for me, for Jesus, for anyone with even a tiny amount of common sense. Your total disregard for context is certainly entertaining but probably not the best hermeneutics.

No need to thank me,

JW

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 45 by Checkpoint]

Well the OP is about what YOU believe, so let's get back to it.

The kingdom of God is the reign of God.

Could you explain what you mean it's a "the reign" then, its not clear to me. Do you mean the kingdom is a system of rulership?

[Checkpoint]

[Replying to post 45 by Checkpoint]

You observed

Well the OP is about what YOU believe, so let's get back to it.

Yes, I know that is how you crafted it, as you have been tending to do with others too.

This does not allow debate of a position taken or a belief held.

This forum, hoiwever is a debate one, in which defense and attack are an integral part.

Hence its name, the "Debating Christianity and Religion Forum">

[Checkpoint]

[Replying to post 45 by Checkpoint]

Well the OP is about what YOU believe, so let's get back to it.

The kingdom of God is the reign of God.

Could you explain what you mean it's a "the reign" then, its not clear to me. Do you mean the kingdom is a system of rulership?

Probably yes, I guess, but as described and/or written about by Jesus and his apostles.

In which there is a present aspect and a future one.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 45 by Checkpoint]

Well the OP is about what YOU believe, so let's get back to it.

The kingdom of God is the reign of God.

Could you explain what you mean it's a "the reign" then, its not clear to me. Do you mean the kingdom is a system of rulership?

Probably yes, I guess...

Why "probably" ... you "guess"? You are not sure what YOU meant when you said "the reign of God"? You don't have to agree that its a "system of rulership" if that doesn't adequately explain what you mean, but if its not why not just explain what you meant in a better clearer way.


Anyway, sticking with the Kingdom is a "system of rulership"...

...as described and/or written about by Jesus and his apostles.

Tell me more. How is this "system of rulership... "described and/or written about by Jesus and his Apostles"? A "system" of rulership implies some kind of structure? Can you give any details about its struvture? You seem confident it must be in line with what Jesus and the Apostles said, can you explain what Jesus and his Aposles said? (not just quote the scripture but what you think they mean in relation to your point).

There is a present aspect and a future one

What does this mean? I don't know what a "present and a future" aspect of this system of rulership means... can you explain?