Does God change his mind?

[OnceConvinced]

A Christian member of our forum recently pointed out a bible contradiction for all to see:

This verse was presented first:
Numbers 23:19 "God is not human, that he should lie, not a human being, that he should change his mind."

The Christian then attempted to trump it with a contradictory scripture where God DOES change his mind, thus exposing a blatant bible contradiction:

Jeremiah 18:8 "But if that nation about which I spoke turns from its evil way, I'll change my mind about the disaster that I had planned for it."

Here are further verses that show God changing his mind:

Exodus 32:14
So the LORD changed His mind about the harm which He said He would do to His people.

Amos 7:3
The LORD changed His mind about this. "It shall not be," said the LORD.

Jeremiah 18:10
if it does evil in My sight by not obeying My voice, then I will think better of the good with which I had promised to bless it. (wow this is a verse where God says he will break his promise!!)


So questions for debate:

Does Got change his mind?
If he does change his mind, how do we know he hasn't changed his mind about much of what he expected from us in the New Testament?
If he does change his mind, how can we really know what he wants of us today?

[Joe1950]

[Replying to post 456 by Joe1950]

It doesn't follow that if one part is flawed, all the rest is, too. The fact of the matter is that I know of no inerrant works in anything. However, that doesn't mean we should throw out all the books, never listen to any concerts because there has yet to be a totally perfect, flawless one performed, etc. When you read the Bible, as when you read any book, or hear any historical account, you are going to have to use your discretion. Remember, the Bible is essentially a work in history, not science, history, and history is merely gossip. Whenever it comes to any major historical figures, Christ or Napoleon, there is always controversy, contradiction abounding, suspicious accounts, even when, and especially when, you find them to be autobiographical. Granted, sometimes it's hard to decide, so we have just got to do the best we can. That's what they mean by a leap of faith.

I did not say that because one part is flawed, the rest is flawed. What I said was that if one part is flawed there is no way to determine whether or not other parts, or all of it, are flawed. Because there is no way to determine which parts are flawed if you pick and choose which ones to believe you could very well be wrong.

[Joe1950]

For the purposes of this particular OP we are assuming that god exists. However, there seems to be disagreement on the qualities of god.
For purposes of this OP I am assuming god is a female. I am assuming that she is able to change and adapt. A wonderful quality. Much more godlike than being set in one's ways. A woman's prerogative. I am also assuming that there may be many gods, not just one.

[hoghead1]

[Replying to post 476 by Danmark]

Well, of course, humans wrote the Bible, so that it will all sound like a human wrote it. However, that, in and of itself, does not deny divine inspiration. There are theories of divine inspiration other than the dictation model, followed by fundamentalists, whereby God dictated Scripture word for word.

I don't follow you on omniscience. I hold that God is omniscient in that God knows the future for what it is in its own nature: the realm of undecided possibilities, not matters set in cement. That is because God is no dictator and we are not puppets. We have to decide for ourselves. God cannot decide our decisions for us. Hence, the future is open-ended, indeterminate, both for God and for ourselves.

Any time we make a decision, God's knowledge changes, as God moves from knowing an event as possibility, to knowing that event as actual, a decided mater of fact. I also believe God changes because God is sensitive, deeply moved and affected by all that happens. God, like any true personality, is a synthesis of both consistency and change. In so far as the Bible presents around 100 passages in which God is said to change, I heartedly agree with it.

[hoghead1]

[Replying to post 481 by Joe1950]

Yes, but see, my point is that you have to pick and choose, have to use your discretion. And that's not always easy, I'll grant you. Again, I realize this is a problem with Scripture, and I am not indifferent to it. But again, big deal, so what? this is par for teh course when you are studying history. I live to the West of the West. I hear all sorts of stories and accounts of teh last gold rush. I know some are pure baloney, others not. With many, it's hard to tell. I just try and use my discretion as best I can, often making leaps of faith. Occupational hazard in the study of history.

[hoghead1]

[Replying to post 482 by Joe1950]

I agree with allegorizing God in the feminine, as I feel it emphasizes God's passive, empathic, receptive qualities. And, as I mentioned in an earlier post, a precedent was set for this in the Christian mystical tradition.

[marco]

It doesn't follow that if one part is flawed, all the rest is, too. The fact of the matter is that I know of no inerrant works in anything.

You are not addressing the objection made about the Bible. What applies to secular works is a different matter and very often the flaw adds merit. Michelangelo's David was made from a flawed piece of marble.

The Bible gives directions from God and if it is admitted that these may be wrong, where does one stand? It is silly to suggest that SOME bits may be right and others wrong, so we pick and choose. If we have an instruction manual we don't expect errors. And the Bible instructs and commands. You don't say which bits YOU think are worthy of building on, but your thesis is flawed if the criterion used is your own judgment of what might be true and what might be false. You are hardly infallible.

Remember, the Bible is essentially a work in history, not science, history, and history is merely gossip. Whenever it comes to any major historical figures, Christ or Napoleon, there is always controversy, contradiction abounding, suspicious accounts, even when, and especially when, you find them to be autobiographical. Granted, sometimes it's hard to decide, so we have just got to do the best we can. That's what they mean by a leap of faith.

The Bible is NOT essentially a work of history; it is a book of moral illustrations. It does not deal with the biography of Christ but concentrates on his message. Faith comes in accepting the Bible not as a standard piece of history but as a God-inspired work that gives lessons in morality. We are instructed in how to deal with God and with other people. The "leap of faith" has nothing to do with determining fact from fiction.

[marco]

I didn't write what you attributed to me.
I think you meant "hoghead1", instead.

I have made the proper attribution, Blastcat. I didn't for a moment believe you were the author of the quoted portion.

Homer nods.

[marco]

?????????

HUH?

?????????

I take it these symbols suggest you didn't understand what I wrote, or why. Oh, well.

We are obviously not on the same wavelength, which is obvious from your repeating the same question to which I have supplied a good answer. There is nothing more I can do but wish you an enjoyable day.

[Blastcat]

[Replying to post 487 by marco]

I didn't write what you attributed to me.
I think you meant "hoghead1", instead.

I have made the proper attribution, Blastcat.

DO YOU MEAN THAT YOU HAVE CORRECTED THE ERROR?

Because it's correctly attributed now.

Last edited by marco on Thu Apr 13, 2017 3:10 am; edited 1 time in total

Some people thank other people when they spot a simple error that can cause confusion.

I know that I do.
All the time.

YW

[hoghead1]

[Replying to post 486 by marco]

NO, of curse not. Nobody is infallible. However, that isn't exactly the issue here. When we read the Bible or any work in "history," we have to use our discretion, fallible as that may be, too. All we can do is try and do the best we can.

How do we know what is true in the Bible? As I said before, it all depends on what extra-biblical sources you bring into the picture. If you are reading the biblical geophysics and judge it wrong, that is because you looked to modern science. It all just depends on the particular passage and what extra-biblical sources you look to.