Is God proud of His work?

[Greatest I Am]

Is God proud of His work?

You should know that I do not ever expect God to return at some end time because I see His judgment at the beginning of our birth in Genesis as the only judgment that he need’s render.

Genesis 1:31
And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

This very good included all that is, including sin, evil and the woes that were to afflict us, without which we could not develop our moral sense.

To have Him return, red faced, to fix a perfect world is beyond my definition of God. He gets things right the first time, every time.

I believe that when we left the garden we did so with God being proud of His perfect works and not ashamed that He had started us off on the wrong foot, so to speak, from the beginning of our journey.

Deuteronomy 32:4
He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he.

I know that many think of Genesis as the fall of man. This is false.
Man came out of Genesis only after the development of the moral sense that comes from the knowledge of good and evil.

God wanted man to have a moral sense and insured that this would happen by making sure that the talking snake/Satan was there to draw Eve out of any lethargy or laziness of mind and would be lead in the right direction.

I take the advice of the Pope and read the Bible allegorically and see Genesis as a right of passage for all humans from a state of innocence in the home/garden to a search for moral values in the greater society/talking snake.

It is this same society, with it’s differing values that hone our moral sense. It also draws us to sin. As God wants.

Why does God want us to sin?

2 Peter 3:9 KJ
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.


New Jerusalem
9 The Lord is not being slow in carrying out his promises, as some people think he is; rather is he being patient with you, wanting nobody to be lost and everybody to be brought to repentance.

If we must all come to repentance then clearly we must all sin.
God makes this easy by creating us all with a sinning nature.

It is God’s will that all repent and none be lost and it must be so, if God’s will is supreme.

To think otherwise is to think that God’s will can be thwarted.
If it is then it is not God’s will at all.

So to those who await a second or third judgment from God, forget that silly notion.

He told us it was a good beginning and from good beginnings come good endings.
We are all to be saved which ends the notion of a hell. If you think about hell for just a moment, it is clear from a moral standpoint, that God would not ever invent or create such a place. It would be admitting that He has failed in saving all of us. This is against His will and must be a false interpretation of scripture.


Do you think that God is proud of His creations, or, do you think He will return in shame to -fix- His perfect works?

Regards
DL

[Faith Leads to Knowledge]

seijun,

would it? You can change definitions to suit your beliefs. You can basically do whatever you like. Whether it's true is another question altogether.

[Faith Leads to Knowledge]

dear greatest I AM

what do you believe?

[Greatest I Am]

if perfection evolves, how does it ever reach a state of perfection.

If perfection is never changing then in the beginning, God, if perfect would not be able to do anything to change anything. He did.

When He added to His initial perfection, He did not lose perfection, He added evolution and now has an evolving perfection.

If perfection were never changing the how could the U S go to a more perfect union.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I Am]

if perfection evolves, how does it ever reach a state of perfection.

And wouldn't that mean that the definition of perfection is constantly changing?

Yep, it does.

God alone. Perfect.
God plus the earth. Perfect.
God plus all we see. Perfect.

God does not back slide out of perfection and neither do we.

If He did, show when.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I Am]

It's pretty funny how God says everything is good and then later on he regrets ever making it and decides to destroy nearly all of it in the great flood. Yeah, maybe you should look at the whole bible instead of choosing bits and pieces to try and fit your own theories.

Unfortunately for the Bible, if you want to see a God of love, you have to scrap 3/4 of it.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I Am]

It's pretty funny how God says everything is good and then later on he regrets ever making it and decides to destroy nearly all of it in the great flood. Yeah, maybe you should look at the whole bible instead of choosing bits and pieces to try and fit your own theories.

But wasn't it good when he created it and then it turned bad due to man?

Where did man get his nature that he can only follow?

Regards
DL

[Greatest I Am]

dear greatest I AM

what do you believe?

Many things.

Could you narrow down the field of the book I would have to write?

That of check out my posts.

Regards
DL

[McCulloch]

mcculloch, more perfect woulod imply striving towards something close to completeness.

No, technically, striving towards perfection would not be more perfect but closer to being perfect. As it stands in the English language, perfect is not an analog value but a binary one. Either something is perfect or it is not. There should be no degrees of perfection, Americans notwithstanding.

not sure there is a distinction in anglo/american meanings.

Neither am I, but almost all of the examples of this I could find were American. Coincidence?

[Jester]

Genesis 1:31
And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

This very good included all that is, including sin, evil and the woes that were to afflict us, without which we could not develop our moral sense.

Where does scripture say that this statement includes sin?
It seems rather that God's being upset at sin a page or so later makes it clear that he's not pleased with sin.

To have Him return, red faced, to fix a perfect world is beyond my definition of God. He gets things right the first time, every time.

Where does it say in scripture that the world was imperfect before sin entered it?

I believe that when we left the garden we did so with God being proud of His perfect works and not ashamed that He had started us off on the wrong foot, so to speak, from the beginning of our journey.

You are free to hold that belief, but I see nothing in the narrative that implies as much. It seems instead that one has to add a great deal, then throw out many other direct statements made elsewhere in scripture in order to come to this conclusion.

I know that many think of Genesis as the fall of man. This is false.
Man came out of Genesis only after the development of the moral sense that comes from the knowledge of good and evil.

For what reason do you feel that this is a more accurate conclusion than the traditional interpretation?

God wanted man to have a moral sense and insured that this would happen by making sure that the talking snake/Satan was there to draw Eve out of any lethargy or laziness of mind and would be lead in the right direction.

Why is it impossible for people to have a moral sense without having sinned?

I take the advice of the Pope and read the Bible allegorically and see Genesis as a right of passage for all humans from a state of innocence in the home/garden to a search for moral values in the greater society/talking snake.

Many read the Bible allegorically without coming to this conclusion. Why should we assume that this is the correct message to take from this story.
Beyond that, I would also like to counter the implication here that the Pope suggests that we should read the Bible purely allegorically. This has never been the Vatican's position.

It is this same society, with it’s differing values that hone our moral sense. It also draws us to sin. As God wants.

Why does so much of scripture have God speaking against sin if he wants us to do as much?
Moreover, if God wants us to sin, what moral sense can be gained from the Bible. If all things are permissible, then is it even possible to have a moral compass?

Why does God want us to sin?

Does God want us to sin?
If so, why does he go to such lengths to insist that we stop?

2 Peter 3:9 KJ
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

If he desires that we should all turn away from our sin and make a positive choice to go right (repentance), then how can we conclude that he wants us to sin?

New Jerusalem
9 The Lord is not being slow in carrying out his promises, as some people think he is; rather is he being patient with you, wanting nobody to be lost and everybody to be brought to repentance.

Agreed, but I have the same question as above.

If we must all come to repentance then clearly we must all sin.
God makes this easy by creating us all with a sinning nature.

Or: if we must all come to repentance then clearly we have sinned already.
Romans 3:23
For all have sinned, and fall short of the glory of God.

It is God’s will that all repent and none be lost and it must be so, if God’s will is supreme.

I suspect that this will be the case, though I do not claim to know for certain.

To think otherwise is to think that God’s will can be thwarted.
If it is then it is not God’s will at all.

You are approaching closer to my position with this last statement, but still with major differences:
It is God's will that we be allowed to choose as we may, even if that means we will choose things of which he disapproves.

So to those who await a second or third judgment from God, forget that silly notion.

Why?
If God allows us to do things that he does not like because he respects individual freedom, why wouldn't he come to straighten things out once we get into a hole deep enough that we can't get out?

He told us it was a good beginning and from good beginnings come good endings.

I'm not sure that follows, actually.
In any case, I don't see any reason to conclude that the return of Christ isn't a good ending.

We are all to be saved which ends the notion of a hell. If you think about hell for just a moment, it is clear from a moral standpoint, that God would not ever invent or create such a place. It would be admitting that He has failed in saving all of us. This is against His will and must be a false interpretation of scripture.

Hell is, by definition, utter separation from God. This means separation from all that is good and life giving. That would be terrible, but it is easy for me to imagine that God would still allow those people who want nothing to do with him to choose Hell if that is their wish. It makes no sense that a truly loving God would force people to love him. Rather, real love lets us come and go as we choose.

Do you think that God is proud of His creations, or, do you think He will return in shame to -fix- His perfect works?

Personally, I think he will return in glory to fix the wrong works of others.
As for his contribution to things, yes, I think he is proud of it. It is one of the reasons why he's so upset when we destroy pieces of it.

Regards
DL

Random curiosity: You tend to end your posts with this line. Does it have any special meaning for you? I'm never sure how to take it myself.

[Science101]

this post makes some sweeping statements. God said it was Good. I said my Toyota was good. ANd then when it got rear ended it needed to go to a panel beater. How does saying a thing is good mean it no longer needs work.

I won't call my truck "good" if it came with
a leaking gas tank
a headlight that cannot be used longer than 1 hour or it will burnout
a clutch that will inevitablely mal-func after a period of time due to design flaws