Are there good reasons to believe that a god exists?

Jashwell · Post by **Jashwell** » Sat Jun 14, 2014 1:14 pm

"Are there good reasons to believe that a god exists?"

Doesn't seem like much preamble is needed, but expect this largely to be filled (if at all) with arguments in favour of the existence of a God and counter-arguments. (Because the question is not "Are there good reasons to believe that a god does not exist?"). Though if you do think you have a good argument that shows it is reasonable to believe God does not exist, that is also valid.

This question comes up a lot in other threads where various classical arguments (e.g. ontological, axiological, cosmological) have been given in those threads.

If possible, try not to shotgun debate by raising lots of arguments at once. One sound argument should be sufficient.

Danmark · Post by **Danmark** » Sun Jul 13, 2014 2:27 pm

Zzyzx wrote: .
jcb wrote: Another well know publicised fact is every year more and more scientist are leaning towards a creation and a Supreme Power having started.
Kindly provide links to creationist websites (or others) that document this claim.

Z, are you suggesting that these 'facts' might not be found on a science site that is unbiased; that such claims are only made on religious-pseudo science blogs?

Jashwell · Post by **Jashwell** » Sun Jul 13, 2014 2:37 pm

[Replying to post 209 by jcb]

"Evidence has ruled out the Big Crunch. "
That website; "The Big Rip" section; third paragraph.

jcb · Post by **jcb** » Sun Jul 13, 2014 2:38 pm

jcb wrote: [Replying to post 206 by Zzyzx]

I asked for this.

Here is 1 url: http://hubblesite.org/hubble_discoverie ... iverse.php

Here is another link. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Crunch

Danmark · Post by **Danmark** » Sun Jul 13, 2014 2:41 pm

jcb wrote: [Replying to post 206 by Zzyzx]

I asked for this.

Here is 1 url: http://hubblesite.org/hubble_discoverie ... iverse.php

I have a suggestion. Quote the portion of this site that you thinks supports a specific claim you are making. Simply providing a URL is not much help. I suggest you actually make a specific point, then copy the relevant quote from the website you think supports the point, then argue why your contention is correct.

DanieltheDragon · Post by **DanieltheDragon** » Sun Jul 13, 2014 2:53 pm

[Replying to post 212 by jcb]

I am not sure which point you are specifically trying to make. Yes there are many competing theories of how the universe will end or begin again. The Big Bounce comes to mind which incorporates some concepts of the big crunch and quantum physics that is still being examined.

Let's say for the sake of argument that oscillatory universal expansion theories are all false. What is the point? The universe likely could just keep expanding and not retract just as likely as it could rebound. How does this relate to creation or creationism? please connect your ideas so one can understand the point you are making.

jcb · Post by **jcb** » Sun Jul 13, 2014 3:04 pm

[Replying to post 214 by DanieltheDragon]

I already did several posts back, but no-one will accept or even consider it.
Scientist will eventually prove the existence of a Supreme Power and a creation. They are not far from it now.. They only have a few more dots to connect

Danmark · Post by **Danmark** » Sun Jul 13, 2014 3:12 pm

jcb wrote: [Replying to post 214 by DanieltheDragon]

I already did several posts back, but no-one will accept or even consider it.
Scientist will eventually prove the existence of a Supreme Power and a creation. They are not far from it now.. They only have a few more dots to connect

Are these dots in a child's puzzle book? I ask because you have yet to clearly state what your point is; have failed to support it with a quotation with citation combined with an argument advancing your claim.

For example, you claim that scientists are, in increasing numbers, coming to believe that a god exists; however so far you have failed to support this claim.

I confess that your unsupported claim surprises me because among many other reports, there is this:

"A survey of scientists who are members of the American Association for the Advancement of Science, conducted by the Pew Research Center for the People & the Press in May and June 2009, finds that members of this group are, on the whole, much less religious than the general public."
http://www.pewforum.org/2009/11/05/scie ... nd-belief/

It has been well documented that the trend is the opposite of what you claim. Not only among scientists, but the general public is trending more to atheism or non theism and away from the idea of belief in a personal, creative god.

If you have evidence this trend is reversing, please share that with us. Your bare, undocumented and unsupported opinion is not persuasive.

jcb · Post by **jcb** » Sun Jul 13, 2014 3:26 pm

[Replying to post 216 by Danmark]

Do you want documentation for this statement. "The dots are in their Mind."

I provided documentation about the retracting of the universe. True or false with fact.. I really don't know or care. My point was, the Bible says in different words, this is how this life and universe will end.

On the other I haven't found the documentation yet and may never will. This was from several years ago.

Jashwell · Post by **Jashwell** » Sun Jul 13, 2014 3:29 pm

Jcb, do you have a response to this?
Both of your sources:

Site 2
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Crunch

Recent experimental evidence (namely the observation of distant supernovae as standard candles, and the well-resolved mapping of the cosmic microwave background) has led to speculation that the expansion of the universe is not being slowed down by gravity but rather accelerating.

Site 1
http://hubblesite.org/hubble_discoverie ... iverse.php

Evidence has ruled out the Big Crunch.

I never said it wasn't a possibility that everything would eventually come back together - I implied that science was currently going in the other direction (pun unintended) - which it is.

jcb · Post by **jcb** » Sun Jul 13, 2014 3:40 pm

[Replying to post 218 by Jashwell]

I did read that before posting the URL, and even heard the same before. This still does not change the fact that gravitational pull inside the universe could eventually make it retract. The scientist in the documentary say it will, the Bible says it will. And since I am not religious man and am a Bible man, I have to agree