God is everyone?

[Purple Knight]

It is pretty obvious that God is supposed to be male. It is Adam who is made in his image.

That begs the question: Does God have a penis? If so what is it for? If he has one, then he is not only male but the male of his species, because if he's perfect and he has one, it has to be for something and must go somewhere and therefore there must be more of those things. It's just that none of them created Earth or humans.

[JehovahsWitness]

I do think that if we are to believe fully in the modern morality that is all about individual responsibility, equality, and fairness ...

Which are the fundamental principles of biblical law. Are you contending otherwise?

[Purple Knight]

Most of the modern morality believers are cognitively dissonant. But somehow they seem to be capable of bullying everyone else into regurgitating their dogma....

Ad hominem duly noted but I don't personally hold that being a male makes one automatically bad or that all women are good.

I don't hold that either. It just doesn't seem to me that overall, males and females are exactly equal. It might be that the strengths and weaknesses of each, happen to exactly cancel each other out, but I find that to be incredibly unlikely.

So are you claiming there are no atheists? Since you claim that believers have bullied "everyone else into regurgitating their dogma" is not belief in an intelligent creator part of that dogma, and if so do you have a different definition of "everyone" since if what you are saying is true, atheists would be saying that there is an intelligent creator.

I'm saying everyone is forced into regurgitating it, not that everyone believes it. And still, everyone is a slight exaggeration but only slight. But as to your question of whether I think there are no atheists, well, kind of. I don't think the world or people's minds or their natures can have changed so drastically much since just half a century ago when basically all of them believed in God, or at least a higher power. I think the same roughly 95% of people (I'm not in it) believe in something as they always have. They can change what that thing is. They can suck on a Bible or a pacifier or a golden calf, but they're prisoners of their rooting reflex and they can't just not do it. Now maybe it's all real and that reflex was put there deliberately.

Anyone who, at some point, just stands on morality and insists they don't have to put up with questions because blah is righteous and bleh is unrighteous and that's just the way it is, must believe something, something higher, something with more moral authority, is grounding that absolute, otherwise questioning would be right and proper. I have a hard time calling that something anything but a god. It's even hard imagining that it's just the universe or everything or whatever, and it's not sentient, because whatever that something is, it's using its moral authority to actively decide what morality will be, and what morality will not be.

I lean toward the idea that, that kind of morality can't exist, because people have feelings. In other words, Bob has feelings, and you can say or justify as much as you like that it's righteous to beat him to death, or you can get someone omnipotent to say that, or someone with a sash that says "moral authority" to say that, or you can take a vote that says that, but at the end of the day the fact that you'd be hurting Bob if you did that, destroying him, and he doesn't want that, cannot simply vanish.

I do think that if we are to believe fully in the modern morality that is all about individual responsibility, equality, and fairness ...

Which are the fundamental principles of biblical law. Are you contending otherwise?

Yes. The way original sin is transmitted is against individual responsibility and it is decidedly unfair to the people contaminated with it who never did anything wrong. Whoever wrote such a law into the fabric of the universe that lets sin pass to individuals who did not sin, not only doesn't believe in individual responsibility but doesn't want it. Any time sin or guilt or even debt is transferred from the party who incurred it to an innocent party, that is against individual responsibility. The equality issue is debatable on the front that it's possible the Bible means that even though women don't have totally equal rights to men they're still equal in spirit, but that's definitely not what most people mean when they say equality. (But note that I don't really believe in perfect equality either so I don't think that's necessarily a point against the Bible.)

Note though that I don't believe individual responsibility can cover everything, so sometimes we must be unfair. But insofar as we can craft reality, I think it's a duty to make reality as fair as possible, and minimise cases where innocent people are punished.

[JehovahsWitness]

...It just doesn't seem to me that overall, males and females are exactly equal.

I'm sorry you feel like that but I disagree with your view of humans, I believe mrn and womrn are absolutely equal; furthermore my view is supported by scripture.

..I don't really believe in perfect equality..

That's sad. But as long as you're worldview doesnt translate into illegal actions that's your right. Maybe one day you'll adopt the bible view that all oeople (male or female) are equal in the eyes of God.

[JehovahsWitness]

I'm saying everyone is forced into regurgitating it, not that everyone believes it.

I have never met an atheist that has told me there is a God, perhaps you have a different definition of "forced into regurgitating" Christian beliefs that cover " regurgitating" what Christians do NOT believe.

[JehovahsWitness]

... The way original sin is transmitted is against individual responsibility and it is decidedly unfair to the people contaminated with it ...

Cause and effect applied without prejudice is entirely fair. Is gravity fair or unfair?

[Purple Knight]

...It just doesn't seem to me that overall, males and females are exactly equal.

I'm sorry you feel like that but I disagree with your view of humans, I believe mrn and womrn are absolutely equal; furthermore my view is supported by scripture.

..I don't really believe in perfect equality..

That's sad. But as long as you're worldview doesnt translate into illegal actions that's your right. Maybe one day you'll adopt the bible view that all people (male or female) are equal in the eyes of God.

Does that include all the Paul stuff where the Bible says women should keep silent in church and be absolutely submissive and quiet?

I'm saying everyone is forced into regurgitating it, not that everyone believes it.

I have never met an atheist that has told me there is a God, perhaps you have a different definition of "forced into regurgitating" Christian beliefs that cover " regurgitating" what Christians do NOT believe.

I'm talking about people who believe in modern morality, not Christians. Supposed atheists who stand on morality being unquestionable and absolute at some point, concede God, because only a higher moral authority can rightly simply override another without fair discourse.

[servant1]

[Replying to Purple Knight in post #1]


The image = the ability to love, reason, things like that--It has nothing to do with being male or female.

[Purple Knight]

... The way original sin is transmitted is against individual responsibility and it is decidedly unfair to the people contaminated with it ...

Cause and effect applied without prejudice is entirely fair. Is gravity fair or unfair?

It depends. If there's no one behind it, then gravity is neither fair nor unfair. But if someone implemented gravity to punish someone else, then it can be fair or unfair. Fair, if used to punish someone willfully guilty. Unfair, if used to punish someone who can't help it, has no idea what he's doing, or one who didn't even do anything.

(I will argue for commensurate punishment of the insane, but not because it is fair or righteous. It leads people to say they're crazy when they're not, resulting in overall, more unfair outcomes, since many people want lesser punishments and will lie to get them, but not very many people are that crazy.)

[JehovahsWitness]

..gravity is neither fair nor unfair.

Indeed the gorce of gravity itself is neutral in that it applies equally to everyone. If however someone fails to properly respect its force by willfully defying its power, it should be considered self harm rather than unfair treatment.

[JehovahsWitness]

I'm talking about people who believe in modern morality, not Christians.

Then I suppose it would be productive to make your point to "people who believe in modern morality". I have no way of responding to that.