Who impregnated Mary?

[Zzyzx]

.
Who impregnated Mary?

If Jesus was “the son of god�, then “god� must be the father – and must have impregnated her.

However, doesn’t “scripture� say that Mary was impregnated by “the holy spirit�? Aren’t “god the father� and “the holy spirit� supposed to be DIFFERENT parts of the triad?

Wouldn’t that make Jesus the “son of the holy spirit�?

Was there an “angel� involved?

[Zzyzx]

.

For your "seminary" to teach you that the Old Testament isn't prophetic is laughable.

Exactly who are you to declare any seminary teaching as "laughable"?

Do you possess knowledge that is not available to seminaries? Do you have authority to condemn the thinking and research of others?

[whirlwind]

.

For your "seminary" to teach you that the Old Testament isn't prophetic is laughable.

Exactly who are you to declare any seminary teaching as "laughable"?

Do you possess knowledge that is not available to seminaries? Do you have authority to condemn the thinking and research of others?

As a believer in the Holy Word of the Lord what he attested to as the teaching of the seminary he attended is laughable. It is in direct conflict with the Lord. What does one go to seminary to learn? Satan's ideas? Satan's teachings? To not believe the Bible? To not understand what is written? Yes Z...laughable! Much as the Christian you discussed earlier. What did he learn in seminary? To leave Christianity and convert to Judaism! What's wrong with that picture? Who is teaching and what the heck are they teaching? I'm surprised they aren't taught to praise Allah five times a day.

If they are teaching what Slopeshoulder tells us, then yes Z, I possess more knowledge than they do or....they have the correct knowledge and are purposely deceiving God's children so they in turn will deceive others. It Is Written!

2 Timothy 3:13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.

Matthew 24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

Romans 16:18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.

Ephesians 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;

[cnorman18]

.
Who impregnated Mary?

If Jesus was “the son of god�, then “god� must be the father – and must have impregnated her.

However, doesn’t “scripture� say that Mary was impregnated by “the holy spirit�? Aren’t “god the father� and “the holy spirit� supposed to be DIFFERENT parts of the triad?

Wouldn’t that make Jesus the “son of the holy spirit�?

Was there an “angel� involved?

Haven't read the thread; not my concern. But I thought it might be of interest to note that there is a Jewish tradition, recorded in the Talmud, that Jesus's father was a Roman soldier. His name is variously given as Ben Pantera or Pantira, which signifies "Son of the Panther." It might be a reference to the emblem of his Army unit.

That's no more historically definitive and reliable than the Gospels themselves, but it might be more plausible. No one knows for certain, of course.

Actually, it is disputed that the Pantera is actually referring to Jesus of Nazerth. .. because he is referred to as the teacher of a second century heretic. The time frame between the alleged death of Jesus and the timeframe of the person who he allegedlt taught is too great.

The equating of that to a roman soldier is not actually in a Jewish tradition, but rather that comes through Celsus, who claimed a Jewish person told him. It isn't in the Talmud itself.

Thanks for the correction. I don't remember where I read that, but it was a long time ago. No doubt my aging memory slipped a cog.

[Zzyzx]

.

For your "seminary" to teach you that the Old Testament isn't prophetic is laughable.

Exactly who are you to declare any seminary teaching as "laughable"?

Do you possess knowledge that is not available to seminaries? Do you have authority to condemn the thinking and research of others?

As a believer in the Holy Word of the Lord what he attested to as the teaching of the seminary he attended is laughable. It is in direct conflict with the Lord.

Let’s see what Admin and Moderators think of your condemnations.

What does one go to seminary to learn? Satan's ideas? Satan's teachings?

Do you suggest that the seminary in question TEACHES “Satan’s ideas and teachings�?

To not believe the Bible? To not understand what is written?

Do you maintain that YOUR understanding of the bible is superior to that of theologians, scholars, professors teaching in seminaries?

Yes Z...laughable!

That is a personal opinion that is clearly uncivil. I have referred your inappropriate comments to Admin and Moderators.

Much as the Christian you discussed earlier.

I have NEVER stated that anyone’s beliefs were “laughable�. I am more considerate of others and more respectful of Forum Rules and Guidelines.

It is YOU who condemns fellow Christians – not me.

What did he learn in seminary?

It is my understanding that Christian seminary students learn Christian teachings. Do you have evidence to the contrary?

To leave Christianity and convert to Judaism!

Slopeshoulder had NOT, to my knowledge, left Christianity to convert to Judaism.

Perhaps you confuse Slopeshoulder with Cnorman.

Who are you to criticize ANYONE’S decision to leave Christianity in favor of Judaism?

Perhaps seminary graduates who leave Christianity have learned very good reasons for leaving. That is THEIR choice

What's wrong with that picture?

The only thing wrong that I can see is YOUR attitude.

Who is teaching and what the heck are they teaching?

If you are legitimately concerned about such matters, LEARN who is teaching and what they are teaching. Make your opinion known to the administration of the seminary and of the religious denomination in question.

I'm surprised they aren't taught to praise Allah five times a day.

There are religious schools that teach students to praise Allah. Is that WRONG? Do you know more than those scholars and professors?

If they are teaching what Slopeshoulder tells us, then yes Z, I possess more knowledge than they do or...

Correction: You THINK that you have greater knowledge. Can you cite an opinion other than your own?

.they have the correct knowledge and are purposely deceiving God's children so they in turn will deceive others.

In other words, unless someone teaches what YOU believe, they are “purposely deceiving god’s children�. Is that what you are saying?

It Is Written!

What “is written� is variously interpreted by tens of thousands of different Christian denominations, groups, congregations, splinter groups and cults.

Whose “interpretation� is right and why? How is it that you are so much smarter or more knowledgeable than many who devote their lives and careers to study of religious matters?


As a Non-Theist, I truly appreciate your condemnation of fellow Christians, Jews and Muslims. You do more damage to supernaturalism, in my opinion, than a squad of Atheists could do deliberately. Thank you for showing readers a “Real Christian� point of view.

[whirlwind]

.

For your "seminary" to teach you that the Old Testament isn't prophetic is laughable.

Exactly who are you to declare any seminary teaching as "laughable"?

Do you possess knowledge that is not available to seminaries? Do you have authority to condemn the thinking and research of others?

As a believer in the Holy Word of the Lord what he attested to as the teaching of the seminary he attended is laughable. It is in direct conflict with the Lord.

Let’s see what Admin and Moderators think of your condemnations.

What does one go to seminary to learn? Satan's ideas? Satan's teachings?

Do you suggest that the seminary in question TEACHES “Satan’s ideas and teachings�?

Is the seminary teaching students to disregard the prophecy of the Old Testament? That should answer your question.

To not believe the Bible? To not understand what is written?

Do you maintain that YOUR understanding of the bible is superior to that of theologians, scholars, professors teaching in seminaries?

I maintain that a teacher of His Word would NEVER tell students that the prophecies of the Old Testament are not in effect.

Yes Z...laughable!

That is a personal opinion that is clearly uncivil. I have referred your inappropriate comments to Admin and Moderators.

Much as the Christian you discussed earlier.

I have NEVER stated that anyone’s beliefs were “laughable�. I am more considerate of others and more respectful of Forum Rules and Guidelines.

It is YOU who condemns fellow Christians – not me.

What you see as condemnation is no such thing.

What did he learn in seminary?

It is my understanding that Christian seminary students learn Christian teachings. Do you have evidence to the contrary?

Yes, the word of Slopeshoulder.

To leave Christianity and convert to Judaism!

Slopeshoulder had NOT, to my knowledge, left Christianity to convert to Judaism.

Perhaps you confuse Slopeshoulder with Cnorman.

Who are you to criticize ANYONE’S decision to leave Christianity in favor of Judaism?

Perhaps seminary graduates who leave Christianity have learned very good reasons for leaving. That is THEIR choice

No, you confuse him with another. I am not criticizing the one that left Christianity I am criticizing the seminary that caused him to leave. That is MY choice.

What's wrong with that picture?

The only thing wrong that I can see is YOUR attitude.

Who is teaching and what the heck are they teaching?

If you are legitimately concerned about such matters, LEARN who is teaching and what they are teaching. Make your opinion known to the administration of the seminary and of the religious denomination in question.

No. I prefer to make it known here to the one telling us what his seminary teaches is the correct teaching.

I'm surprised they aren't taught to praise Allah five times a day.

There are religious schools that teach students to praise Allah. Is that WRONG? Do you know more than those scholars and professors?

Yes it's wrong! If that is what they teach then Yes I am more qualified!

If they are teaching what Slopeshoulder tells us, then yes Z, I possess more knowledge than they do or...

Correction: You THINK that you have greater knowledge. Can you cite an opinion other than your own?

I don't have to.

.they have the correct knowledge and are purposely deceiving God's children so they in turn will deceive others.

In other words, unless someone teaches what YOU believe, they are “purposely deceiving god’s children�. Is that what you are saying?

No. A supposedly Christian teaching school teaching their students deception is wrong.

It Is Written!

What “is written� is variously interpreted by tens of thousands of different Christian denominations, groups, congregations, splinter groups and cults.

Whose “interpretation� is right and why? How is it that you are so much smarter or more knowledgeable than many who devote their lives and careers to study of religious matters?

Anyone teaching that His Word is not to be believed is WRONG. One can argue about meaning, about interpretation but one cannot argue that it is a lie or written by anyone other than God without being very, very wrong.

As a Non-Theist, I truly appreciate your condemnation of fellow Christians, Jews and Muslims. You do more damage to supernaturalism, in my opinion, than a squad of Atheists could do deliberately. Thank you for showing readers a “Real Christian� point of view.

You are most welcome for my comments. They are not condemnation about anyone except deceivers. I will always condemn them whenever possible.

[otseng]

There are times we are just able to debate with our "mirror, mirror on the wall."

Moderator warning:

This would be considered an unconstructive one-liner. Please read through the rules. Also read through the C&A Guidelines.

[Zzyzx]

.

What does one go to seminary to learn? Satan's ideas? Satan's teachings?

Do you suggest that the seminary in question TEACHES “Satan’s ideas and teachings�?

Is the seminary teaching students to disregard the prophecy of the Old Testament? That should answer your question.

Is “Satan� opposed to the old testament? How do you know that?

Kindly cite evidence (other than bible quotations) that “Satan� is a real entity.

To not believe the Bible? To not understand what is written?

Do you maintain that YOUR understanding of the bible is superior to that of theologians, scholars, professors teaching in seminaries?

I maintain that a teacher of His Word would NEVER tell students that the prophecies of the Old Testament are not in effect.

There are thousands of different versions and teachings of Christianity. Your preference is ONE of thousands – and you claim greater understanding than theologians, scholars and professors teaching in seminaries.

Where do you come by such vast knowledge?

Yes Z...laughable!

That is a personal opinion that is clearly uncivil. I have referred your inappropriate comments to Admin and Moderators.

Much as the Christian you discussed earlier.

I have NEVER stated that anyone’s beliefs were “laughable�. I am more considerate of others and more respectful of Forum Rules and Guidelines.

It is YOU who condemns fellow Christians – not me.

What you see as condemnation is no such thing.

What do you call it?

What did he learn in seminary?

It is my understanding that Christian seminary students learn Christian teachings. Do you have evidence to the contrary?

Yes, the word of Slopeshoulder.

Kindly quote his words verbatim that state that any seminary teaches something other than Christianity.

To leave Christianity and convert to Judaism!

Slopeshoulder had NOT, to my knowledge, left Christianity to convert to Judaism.

Perhaps you confuse Slopeshoulder with Cnorman.

Who are you to criticize ANYONE’S decision to leave Christianity in favor of Judaism?

Perhaps seminary graduates who leave Christianity have learned very good reasons for leaving. That is THEIR choice

No, you confuse him with another. I am not criticizing the one that left Christianity I am criticizing the seminary that caused him to leave. That is MY choice.

Which seminary caused what person to leave?

What's wrong with that picture?

The only thing wrong that I can see is YOUR attitude.

Who is teaching and what the heck are they teaching?

If you are legitimately concerned about such matters, LEARN who is teaching and what they are teaching. Make your opinion known to the administration of the seminary and of the religious denomination in question.

No.

I did not think that you had strength of conviction.

I prefer to make it known here to the one telling us what his seminary teaches is the correct teaching.

That is nothing more than personal opinion.

I'm surprised they aren't taught to praise Allah five times a day.

There are religious schools that teach students to praise Allah. Is that WRONG? Do you know more than those scholars and professors?

Yes it's wrong! If that is what they teach then Yes I am more qualified!

Are you claiming that all Islamic schools that teach praise of Allah are wrong? Their ‘holy’ book is no less valid than yours. You have no more evidence than they. You quote your book, they quote theirs, one is no better or worse than the other.

If they are teaching what Slopeshoulder tells us, then yes Z, I possess more knowledge than they do or...

Correction: You THINK that you have greater knowledge. Can you cite an opinion other than your own?

I don't have to.

Of course you don’t have to cite anything other than your own opinion – only honor and honesty would require anyone to follow Forum Rules and Guidelines that they agreed to when joining – at least until Moderators step in.

Are you not aware that readers understand that when one toots his own horn and claims superiority without justification that is nothing more than “blowing smoke�?

.they have the correct knowledge and are purposely deceiving God's children so they in turn will deceive others.

In other words, unless someone teaches what YOU believe, they are “purposely deceiving god’s children�. Is that what you are saying?

No. A supposedly Christian teaching school teaching their students deception is wrong.

Which “Christian teaching school� do you identify as teaching their students deception?

What, exactly, is their teaching?

It Is Written!

What “is written� is variously interpreted by tens of thousands of different Christian denominations, groups, congregations, splinter groups and cults.

Whose “interpretation� is right and why? How is it that you are so much smarter or more knowledgeable than many who devote their lives and careers to study of religious matters?

Anyone teaching that His Word is not to be believed is WRONG. One can argue about meaning, about interpretation but one cannot argue that it is a lie or written by anyone other than God without being very, very wrong.

Kindly quote verbatim the seminary teachings to which you object.

As a Non-Theist, I truly appreciate your condemnation of fellow Christians, Jews and Muslims. You do more damage to supernaturalism, in my opinion, than a squad of Atheists could do deliberately. Thank you for showing readers a “Real Christian� point of view.

You are most welcome for my comments.

All comments that show Fundamentalist condemnations of all who disagree with their personal “interpretation� of “the good book� are helpful to show readers the disadvantage in preaching “my way is the only way�.

They are not condemnation about anyone except deceivers. I will always condemn them whenever possible.

Who, exactly, are “deceivers�, all who disagree with your “teachings� and preachings?

[S-word]

.
Who impregnated Mary?

If Jesus was “the son of god�, then “god� must be the father – and must have impregnated her.

However, doesn’t “scripture� say that Mary was impregnated by “the holy spirit�? Aren’t “god the father� and “the holy spirit� supposed to be DIFFERENT parts of the triad?

Wouldn’t that make Jesus the “son of the holy spirit�?

Was there an “angel� involved?

Interseting question....the subject of speculation.

This story from New Zealand looks at it.

Why the biilbaord?

From the church's website:

•To invite people to think about the virgin birth and the nature of God.
•To say that there was more than one Christian way to think about the virgin birth and God. Indeed there are many.
•To promote the Progressive view of Jesus having 2 human parents and God being the power of love in his life.
•To ridicule the very literalistic view that God is a male and literally sired Jesus.
•To invite people outside of the church to see a type of Christianity here at St Matthew’s that they might be able to relate to.

In Luke 3: 23; you will find the genealogy of Jesus, who is the son of Joseph, the son of Heli, and Joseph the biological Father of Jesus is about the 40th descendant of Nathan the priest of David who became his son-in-law, Nathan was the half brother to Solomon the biological son of King David, as they both had the same mother Bathsheba the wife of Uriah the Hittite who is the biological father of Nathan and a member of the tribe of Levi by his marriage to Bathsheba the daughter of Ammiel, the son of Obed-Edom, who is a descendant of Moses the Levite through his second wife, the daughter of Hobab, one of the two father-in-laws of Moses. Jethro the father of Zipporah the first wife of Moses, being the other.

This Joseph the Levite who came from Cyprus, who had a half sister by the name Mary, who was the adopted mother of John who Jesus had surnamed “Son of Thunder,� who is identified with the young John who was surnamed “Mark,� which means ‘Hammer,’ or “The Hammerer.�

Presumably he would have met Mary for the first time, at the gathering of the family and friends of Elizabeth their cousin, who, like Mary, was of the daughters of Levi. This was some months after Mary had told the angel that up until that point in time she had never had any sexual relations with a man. Undoubtedly they did not realise at that time that they had a common father, Heli, from the tribe of Levi.

Isaac is a prototype of Jesus and like Jesus was born of Gods promise according to the workings of the Holy Spirit. Both Isaac and Jesus were the sons of parents who were both sired by the one Father. ‘Terah,’ is the father to both Abraham and Sarah, while ‘Heli,’ is the father of both Joseph and Mary. Both Mary and Sarah were informed by an angel that they would become Pregnant and bear the son of Gods promise. Isaac was offered up as a sacrifice by his physical father, Jesus was offered up by his spiritual father, who descended upon him in the form of a dove as the voice was heard to say, ‘ you are my beloved in whom I am well pleased, today I have become your Father.� See the more ancient authorities of Luke 3: 22; and Isaac was offered up on the very spot where Jesus was crucified.


Young’s Analytical Concordance to the Bible, gives the meaning of the Hebrew word “Almah,� which is used in Isaiah 7: 14; as, (Concealment: Unmarried woman.) when Mary, the obedient handmaid to her indwelling spirit, who had told the angel three months earlier that she was at that time still a virgin, She then went from her home town of Nazareth to Jerusalem to join with many other members of the family of Elizabeth the cousin of Mary who were of the daughters of Levi, where she must have met for the first time and was attracted to the biological father of Jesus, who had come from Cyprus. The act of obedience from which the child of Gods promise was conceived in the womb of the “Almah,� unmarried woman, was concealed in the shadow beneath the wings of the Lord of spirits. Please don’t be concerned by the added interpolation in brackets, (As was supposed) by those deceiver who would have you believe that the Hebrew word “Almah,� means virgin.

[whirlwind]

There are times we are just able to debate with our "mirror, mirror on the wall."

Moderator warning:

This would be considered an unconstructive one-liner. Please read through the rules. Also read through the C&A Guidelines.

What I wrote wasn't nice. I do apolgize and ask for his forgiveness.

[whirlwind]

.
Who, exactly, are “deceivers�, all who disagree with your “teachings� and preachings?

Deceivers teach others to not believe the words of the Lord.

Isaiah 9:14-16 Therefore the LORD will cut off from Israel head and tail, branch and rush, in one day. The ancient and honourable, he is the head; and the prophet that teacheth lies, he is the tail. For the leaders of this People cause them to err; and they that are led of them are destroyed.

The leaders of His people...we're not talking about unbelievers but His people....those leaders (preachers, teachers, politicians) deceive those that allow it. Those leaders are destroyed. The "prophet that teacheth lies, he is the tail." Who is that?

Revelation 12:3-4 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads. And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

The "tail of the dragon" is the "prophet that teacheth lies." Those false prophets, his tail, draw unsuspecting children of God (the stars of heaven) and because they are so trusting or through pride...they believe the deception. Deception such as taught in seminaries that tell their students the Old Testament prophecies aren't prophetic! They lose their spot in heaven and are "cast to earth." And there they remain unless they see truth. The same false prophets stand before "the woman," the church, just waiting to dine on the elect, the man child "as it was born." They stand in churches, on forums, in schools, in seminaries just licking their chops waiting for the dinner bell.