Where in the Bible does Jesus tell people to be good?

[Wootah]

Where in the Bible does Jesus tell people to be good?

[Elijah John]

When we take all of what Jesus is said to say, along with the rest of what the Biblical authors have to say, what he is saying is, "good isn't good enough, perfection is required, and you are not even good. Therefore, you should look at giving up your attempts at being good in order to appease God, and beg for mercy." This is what the whole of the Bible is concerned with, which is, giving up our efforts to appease God.

Well here you've departed from the question you thought was simple. We are now deep in a strange theology that perhaps resembles Calvinism. It is you who seem to be dwelling on a single reported line: "Nobody is good except the Father," and this is true if one associates an absolute meaning to the word. Jesus is observing that the totality of goodness resides with God. Meanwhile on planet earth we can enjoy a good meal, without assuming God made it; we can wish someone good night, without suggesting perfection. Christ is toying with semantics, not offering moral guidance.

As for "Be ye perfect" - he's moved to hyperbole.

In his saner moments he commends good deeds. I haven't heard of the BAD Samaritan - we get from Christ it was the GOOD Samaritan.

I suggest your interpretation of what Christ advised goes against the vast store of instruction he gave - and we needn't here know his verbatim words!

Excellent points.

However I would also agree with Evangelicals that our goodness is not what gets us into Heaven but rather God's love and mercy. But that does not mean that Christ did not advocate embracing the Good, (which is from God) and abiding by it as a way of life, the best we are able. On the contrary we are to cultivate the Good from the heart and practice it.

The fact that we need God's mercy in no way suggests we are to give up the stuggle against evil, and simply give up trying to be good.

As the American pioneer Daniel Boone once put it, "I try to do my best, and trust in God's mercy for the rest". Or words to that effect.

[marco]

Where in the Bible does Jesus tell people to be good?

In Luke chapter 6:

33 If you do good to those who do good to you, what credit is that to you? For even sinners do the same. 34 If you lend to those from whom you expect to receive, what credit is that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners in order to receive back the same amount. 35 But love your enemies, and do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return; and your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High; for He Himself is kind to ungrateful and evil men. 36 Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.

Luke and learn, they say! That's a well retrieved indication that Jesus was trying hard to say "Be good". Maybe he occasionally couldn't quite get the words out in Aramaic. As soon as we start to speak we risk being misunderstood by someone somewhere. An interesting alternative question would to ask for quotes where Jesus said: "Be bad."

[marco]

Even so, every good tree produces good fruit; but the corrupt tree produces evil fruit. .

The problem with building on some such statement is that it is not ALWAYS true; good trees do occasionally bear bad fruit and bad trees occasionally have the odd good fruit. It is the way of nature. If we build a theology on some single statement, our theology will sometimes fall flat.

Statements such as "Call nobody good," and "Be perfect" are made for the moment. Statements made by a parable, for instance, are indications of how Christ thought people should live. And he advised against looking at the letter of the law rather than the spirit. In examining where Christ asked people to be good, we are quite definitely looking at letters.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 23 by marco]

What's a bad tree? I take it you are refering to literal trees/literal fruit...so what is "bad fruit" in your opinion? Oranges, lemons?

Please NOTE : I'm asking you what YOU mean. I am not asking you what you think Jesus means I am asking you what you would call a "bad tree" that produces "good" fruit. I take you are not refering to fruit that has past maturity and has stared to rot but friut that is intrinsically "bad" in some way?

Please NOTE I do understand you are not a farmer or a representative of Monsanto and I am not inviting you to question my intelligence or my ability to understand written English.

Thanks,

JW

[marco]

[Replying to post 23 by marco]

What's a bad tree? I take it you are refering to literal trees/literal fruit...so what is "bad fruit" in your opinion? Oranges, lemons?

I don't recall any of Christ's listeners asking this penetrating question. Perhaps they understood what a good tree or a bad tree was without explanation. Clever folk!

In an archard a tree that constantly produces fruit with blemishes might be called a bad tree I suppose but it is not unheard of for such a tree to produce fine fruit now and then. In the non-literal sense a family that riots and causes problems for neighbours might be called a bad family. You may not have heard of such a thing. If they have a son distinguished by his charity and kindness, this would be a bad tree producing good fruit. Not an impossibility, despite what the good Lord opined.

[JehovahsWitness]

In an archard a tree that constantly produces fruit with blemishes might be called a bad tree I suppose but it is not unheard of for such a tree to produce fine fruit now and then.

Okay.... a tree that constantly produces fruit with blemishes but produces fine(ie fruit without said blemishes" {quote} "now and then " ... Fair enough that's one way to illustrate a point, whatever point you may think that the above could fittingly illustrate without having your audience scratching their heads.

The parable of the fluke blemishless fruit perhaps?




JW

Please NOTE : I was not asking you think Jesus meant or what you believe Jesus audience undedstood or what they were thinking.

Please NOTE I do understand you are not a farmer or a representative of Monsanto and I am not inviting you to question my intelligence or my ability to understand written English.

[marco]

Okay.... a tree that constantly produces fruit with blemishes but produces fine(ie fruit without said blemishes" {quote} "now and then " ... Fair enough that's one way to illustrate a point, whatever point you may think that the above could fittingly illustrate without having your audience scratching their heads.

I am sorry to have puzzled you, JW. Here is the relevant quote:

"A good tree can't produce evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree produce good fruit."


The point I am unsuccssfully trying to illustrate is a very simple one. The above statement is false in both its literal and figurative meanings.


Christ was speaking figuratively so it is probably more relevant to discuss the figurative truth, but that's what you avoided. A bad famiy is not hard to classify nor is a good son. One can come from the other.


Sometimes folk have to perform absurd acrobatics to justify what they believe in the Bible. And sometimes they can't. C'est la vie.

[JehovahsWitness]

The point I am unsuccssfully trying to illustrate is a very simple one. The above statement is false in [...] its literal [meaning] .

Only if you take the literal assessement of a "good fruit" to mean "not blemished" .

However I'm sure you agree what is a "good fruit", just as what one might classify as "a good beer", a "good" morning or even dare I say it a "good wife" is a subjective assessment . Another human may well mean something other than "unblemished" in using the word "good". In short, if your assessment of what a "good fruit" is, renders the illustration "false" or inaccurate, that doesn't make it make it false, it just reflects how you have interpreted the classification of "good". Could someone else take "good fruit" to mean something else entirely? something that renders the metaphor entirely accurate and appropriate? Of course that is a possibility. The only thing we know for sure is that that someone else evidently is not you.

Have a "good" day and if possible an unblemished one.


JW


ps: Forgive me for not choosing to go around the block with you on how one proves an illustration/metaphor "false".

Please NOTE I do understand you are not a farmer, any references to family members was purely illustrative and not a reflection of my or any posters actual personal lives and I am not inviting you to question my intelligence, my moral standards or my ability to understand written English.

[Tcg]

Where in the Bible does Jesus tell people to be good?

In Luke chapter 6:

33 If you do good to those who do good to you, what credit is that to you? For even sinners do the same. 34 If you lend to those from whom you expect to receive, what credit is that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners in order to receive back the same amount. 35 But love your enemies, and do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return; and your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High; for He Himself is kind to ungrateful and evil men. 36 Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.

Luke and learn, they say! That's a well retrieved indication that Jesus was trying hard to say "Be good". Maybe he occasionally couldn't quite get the words out in Aramaic. As soon as we start to speak we risk being misunderstood by someone somewhere. An interesting alternative question would to ask for quotes where Jesus said: "Be bad."

Yes, I don't recall Jesus saying, "Be bad," or even "Stay the same, it doesn't really matter". He certainly seems to be urging his followers to live much different lives than those wretched "sinners".

[marco]

ps: Forgive me for not choosing to go around the block with you on how one proves an illustration/metaphor "false".

I forgive you of course and I shall simply overlook your confusion over "proving a metaphor false," whatever that means. One can of course prove a statement false. "All prime numbers are odd" is false. "All bad trees bear bad fruit" is false. It's a good metaphor but wrong in implying a universall truth. You will know - as Christ didn't, it seems - that one must be careful when employing the universal quantifier.

Incidentally, it was you who asked for guidance on the subject; you got good guidance. So let the Lord be praised.