The Qu'ran

[McCulloch]

quraan is written by allah but other books written by person so you have to read it to make sure

Well i am sure the quran is much unique from among all the other books. [...] the quran has never been changed. The quran was and is as god says himself in the quran that the quran is copyrighted. So there are millions of copys in the world in many translation--but all the same thing. Ones in english, urdu, arabic, chinese, brail... and so on. So which one shall you read? The one that says Quran or koran or coran on the cover. And as the biggining chapter introduces the author (god). You can order many free ones from islam tomorow, or even better go to your local mosque.[...]

So I went to the quran. I read it and I felt closer to god in my whole life. I actually cryed. And now i am closer to god then ever.

I have been invited to read the Qu'ran. It has been claimed that it has the answers to the questions, How can I know if God exists? and How can I know what God wants of me? It has been implied that the divine truth of the Quran is self-evident.

For Debate: If you have read the Qu'ran or part of it, is its divine origin self-evident? Does it make a convincing argument for the existence of God?

[Goat]

There is no verse in the Quran which is copied from the Bible. If someone says that certain verses from the Quran were influenced by the bible then please show how specifically.
The Quran corrects the things which are wrong in the Bible and sets things aright.

The bible contains stories of:
Lot committing incest with his daughters.
Solomon worshipping and idol.
Samson sleeps with a whore.

All of this done by prophets of God. Men who are the most upright amongst the people during their time. Men who are supposed to instruct an be an example of righteousness to the believers. Men who are guided and inspired by God/Allah. The Quran mentions none of these things.

Well , no, they were not prophets.. since they did not give the word of god out. Solomon was a king.. samson was a warrior, and Lot was supposedly drunk ...but not a prophet.

Well it's quite difficult to accept from an Athesit that these three men were not prophets. If you ask any christian I'm sure they would say that they were. Lot did deliver the message to the people read genesis

ANd in what way where these men prophets? None of their writings are in the prophets, they are not listed in the bible or in the talmud as prophets. They are not
bringing a message from God, according to the bible. Just because someone is mentioned in the bible as a protagonist in a story doesn't mean they are a prophet.

Maybe the concept of the Islamic prophet is different that everyone elses.

I think Goat, your remarks here are not correct, you are relying only Bible as your source, remember, there are 3 valid scriptures, that you have to look before making claim.
Torah\Bible\Quran

Now nowhere in religious definition or history it says that if no book was revealed to any person, he is not a prophet.
Furthe Bible didnt give account to all the prophets, and Prophet itself means who deliver word of God, and all these men deliver word of God, and choosen by God, as its also mention in Quran.

The fact you have to jump and use the Koran to show thing shows that there is a difference in concept. To show that for the Jewish scriptures those people were NOT prophets, you have to go to the Jewish scriptures. I do not accept the Quran as 'valid scripture' for the Jewish faith, nor do I accept the New Testement as 'valid scripture' for the Jewish faith.

To the Jews, they are not prophets. QED.

[TrueReligion]

There is no verse in the Quran which is copied from the Bible. If someone says that certain verses from the Quran were influenced by the bible then please show how specifically.
The Quran corrects the things which are wrong in the Bible and sets things aright.

The bible contains stories of:
Lot committing incest with his daughters.
Solomon worshipping and idol.
Samson sleeps with a whore.

All of this done by prophets of God. Men who are the most upright amongst the people during their time. Men who are supposed to instruct an be an example of righteousness to the believers. Men who are guided and inspired by God/Allah. The Quran mentions none of these things.

Well , no, they were not prophets.. since they did not give the word of god out. Solomon was a king.. samson was a warrior, and Lot was supposedly drunk ...but not a prophet.

Well it's quite difficult to accept from an Athesit that these three men were not prophets. If you ask any christian I'm sure they would say that they were. Lot did deliver the message to the people read genesis

ANd in what way where these men prophets? None of their writings are in the prophets, they are not listed in the bible or in the talmud as prophets. They are not
bringing a message from God, according to the bible. Just because someone is mentioned in the bible as a protagonist in a story doesn't mean they are a prophet.

Maybe the concept of the Islamic prophet is different that everyone elses.

I think Goat, your remarks here are not correct, you are relying only Bible as your source, remember, there are 3 valid scriptures, that you have to look before making claim.
Torah\Bible\Quran

Now nowhere in religious definition or history it says that if no book was revealed to any person, he is not a prophet.
Furthe Bible didnt give account to all the prophets, and Prophet itself means who deliver word of God, and all these men deliver word of God, and choosen by God, as its also mention in Quran.

The fact you have to jump and use the Koran to show thing shows that there is a difference in concept. To show that for the Jewish scriptures those people were NOT prophets, you have to go to the Jewish scriptures. I do not accept the Quran as 'valid scripture' for the Jewish faith, nor do I accept the New Testement as 'valid scripture' for the Jewish faith.

To the Jews, they are not prophets. QED.

This is not a rule of debate, we dont belief in Jewish faiths, so it will conclude the end of discussion right?

This is showing more that your positive side is towards 1 particular religion, and its not getting in an open hearted and healthy debate anymore.

For authentication of Jewish scripture, I can make post, and will invite you to come there, but here we have to be neutral and see all the authentic references and accept them with open heart, whicch is the simple and main rule of debate, if you accept, we will proceed further.

[TrueReligion]

Its your statement only, proof is required whatever you make claim, please provide proof.

Render this...


بأي ذنب قتلت

Its already posted, as its an english forum, so you have to provide in english for all members to understand your claim.
Hoowever I wil make it easy for other members. You are refering chapter 81, verse 9. but full context is from verse 8 till 9.

Chapter 81
when the infant girls buried alive (here reference is made to the Pre-Islamic Arab custom of burying new born girls alive) will be questioned[8] for what sin she was killed;[9]

So what do you mean here quoting this verse. Please explain now.

Look at the confusion amongst your “authorized� translators, brother…


Literal:
And when/if the buried alive was asked/questioned:
Free_Minds:
And when the girl killed in infancy is asked,
Khalifa:
The girl who was buried alive is asked:
Yusuf_Ali:
When the female (infant), buried alive, is questioned -
Shakir:
And when the female infant buried alive is asked
Pickthal:
And when the girl-child that was buried alive is asked
Arberry:
when the buried infant shall be asked
George_Sale:
and when the girl who hath been buried alive shall be asked
Hilali_Khan:
And when the female (infant) buried alive (as the pagan Arabs used to do) shall be questioned.
Maulana_Ali:
And when the one buried alive is asked
QXP:
And when the little girl that was buried alive is made to ask -
Sarwar:
questions are asked about the baby girls buried alive,.




So…which is it…?

A. A single baby girl killed
B. A single baby girl buried alive
C. One (gender neutral) buried alive
D. Baby girls (plural) buried alive


Further, how exactly do you question a dead baby girl?

Whats the confusion here? all are talking about same subject, your poor google site is not helping you much in understanding Apple_Pie.

Its clearly mention , that the matter will be raised on judgement day, when the people wil be raised, and this dead girl will be raised as well, and will be asked.

Now its arabic grammmer, which you have to learn to understand the plural and singular, when they are refered, which word is usedd.

Its very simple, strange you can;t understand.

[Apple Pie]

Further, how exactly do you question a dead baby girl?

Whats the confusion here? all are talking about same subject, your poor google site is not helping you much in understanding Apple_Pie.

Its clearly mention , that the matter will be raised on judgement day, when the people wil be raised, and this dead girl will be raised as well, and will be asked.

Now its arabic grammmer, which you have to learn to understand the plural and singular, when they are refered, which word is usedd.

Its very simple, strange you can;t understand.

Define each word in the ayah, brother...

[TrueReligion]

Further, how exactly do you question a dead baby girl?

Whats the confusion here? all are talking about same subject, your poor google site is not helping you much in understanding Apple_Pie.

Its clearly mention , that the matter will be raised on judgement day, when the people wil be raised, and this dead girl will be raised as well, and will be asked.

Now its arabic grammmer, which you have to learn to understand the plural and singular, when they are refered, which word is usedd.

Its very simple, strange you can;t understand.

Define each word in the ayah, brother...

Translation is provided already wiith full context, you can get the meaning as well.

Further, still we are waiting for your answer to be given 1st we move annymmore.
How come smoke is referedd to Evil as you claim.
Also, your claim of muslims stilll illeterate also need to be justified, as its a blame you are posting, which you have to certify, otherwise its against morality, and you have to take back your words otherwise.

[Goat]

This is not a rule of debate, we dont belief in Jewish faiths, so it will conclude the end of discussion right?

This is showing more that your positive side is towards 1 particular religion, and its not getting in an open hearted and healthy debate anymore.

For authentication of Jewish scripture, I can make post, and will invite you to come there, but here we have to be neutral and see all the authentic references and accept them with open heart, whicch is the simple and main rule of debate, if you accept, we will proceed further.

Well, since you were quoting the Jewish scriptures, you should look at what the Jews believe about their own scriptures. When someone makes a claim that the concept is different in one religion than another, you look at how the scholars who specialize in the religions use it, and if they match, they are the same, and if they disagree, they are different.

My point stands. For the use of the Jewish scriptures, to describe Samson, Solomon and David as 'prophets' is incorrect.

[Apple Pie]

Further, how exactly do you question a dead baby girl?

Whats the confusion here? all are talking about same subject, your poor google site is not helping you much in understanding Apple_Pie.

Its clearly mention , that the matter will be raised on judgement day, when the people wil be raised, and this dead girl will be raised as well, and will be asked.

Now its arabic grammmer, which you have to learn to understand the plural and singular, when they are refered, which word is usedd.

Its very simple, strange you can;t understand.

Define each word in the ayah, brother...

Translation is provided already wiith full context, you can get the meaning as well.

Further, still we are waiting for your answer to be given 1st we move annymmore.
How come smoke is referedd to Evil as you claim.
Also, your claim of muslims stilll illeterate also need to be justified, as its a blame you are posting, which you have to certify, otherwise its against morality, and you have to take back your words otherwise.

You don't know any Arabic brother....time to own up....

[TrueReligion]

This is not a rule of debate, we dont belief in Jewish faiths, so it will conclude the end of discussion right?

This is showing more that your positive side is towards 1 particular religion, and its not getting in an open hearted and healthy debate anymore.

For authentication of Jewish scripture, I can make post, and will invite you to come there, but here we have to be neutral and see all the authentic references and accept them with open heart, whicch is the simple and main rule of debate, if you accept, we will proceed further.

Well, since you were quoting the Jewish scriptures, you should look at what the Jews believe about their own scriptures. When someone makes a claim that the concept is different in one religion than another, you look at how the scholars who specialize in the religions use it, and if they match, they are the same, and if they disagree, they are different.

My point stands. For the use of the Jewish scriptures, to describe Samson, Solomon and David as 'prophets' is incorrect.

Still, you are only emphasizing on Jewish scriptures,
Ok, Do you agree that Solomon & David are refered as prophet in Christianity and Islam? after this, we wil move forward for Judaism

[Goat]

This is not a rule of debate, we dont belief in Jewish faiths, so it will conclude the end of discussion right?

This is showing more that your positive side is towards 1 particular religion, and its not getting in an open hearted and healthy debate anymore.

For authentication of Jewish scripture, I can make post, and will invite you to come there, but here we have to be neutral and see all the authentic references and accept them with open heart, whicch is the simple and main rule of debate, if you accept, we will proceed further.

Well, since you were quoting the Jewish scriptures, you should look at what the Jews believe about their own scriptures. When someone makes a claim that the concept is different in one religion than another, you look at how the scholars who specialize in the religions use it, and if they match, they are the same, and if they disagree, they are different.

My point stands. For the use of the Jewish scriptures, to describe Samson, Solomon and David as 'prophets' is incorrect.

Still, you are only emphasizing on Jewish scriptures,
Ok, Do you agree that Solomon & David are refered as prophet in Christianity and Islam? after this, we wil move forward for Judaism

Ok.. I would like you to show a CHRISTIAN source that says that refer to Solomon, David and/or Samson were 'prophets'. They are not considered prophets in the Christian religion either. Can you show any place in the Jewish scripture or the
New Testament that refers to Solomon, David or Samson as being a prophet?

[TrueReligion]

This is not a rule of debate, we dont belief in Jewish faiths, so it will conclude the end of discussion right?

This is showing more that your positive side is towards 1 particular religion, and its not getting in an open hearted and healthy debate anymore.

For authentication of Jewish scripture, I can make post, and will invite you to come there, but here we have to be neutral and see all the authentic references and accept them with open heart, whicch is the simple and main rule of debate, if you accept, we will proceed further.

Well, since you were quoting the Jewish scriptures, you should look at what the Jews believe about their own scriptures. When someone makes a claim that the concept is different in one religion than another, you look at how the scholars who specialize in the religions use it, and if they match, they are the same, and if they disagree, they are different.

My point stands. For the use of the Jewish scriptures, to describe Samson, Solomon and David as 'prophets' is incorrect.

Still, you are only emphasizing on Jewish scriptures,
Ok, Do you agree that Solomon & David are refered as prophet in Christianity and Islam? after this, we wil move forward for Judaism

Ok.. I would like you to show a CHRISTIAN source that says that refer to Solomon, David and/or Samson were 'prophets'. They are not considered prophets in the Christian religion either. Can you show any place in the Jewish scripture or the
New Testament that refers to Solomon, David or Samson as being a prophet?

Sure. will mention here few links, which you can check and decide. Source is from Jewish and christian scholars.

http://www.tikkunministries.org/newslet ... -jan07.asp

http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/ent ... in_Judaism
(Can refer to the part of Solomon in world religion's)

Now, both David, Solomon were Kings, (solomon being son of David), and they were gifted by words from God, and wisdom, and as per the Jewish and christian scripture, God promised and gave them glad tidings etc etc.
To make it easy, in Abrahamic religions, God's promise, glad tidings etc etc, is not for any person, but his prophets and his chosen ones, which are either messenger or prophets.
Further we know from History, that both christian and jewish scriptures are distorted and changed due to several calamities , and what we have now, is just writen books of men throuth traditions and words of mouth.
Also, to be noted that, Jews gave the most hard time to their prophets, or men chosen by God, and always make fun of them, torture them, so in conclusion to this, we can't take their scripture as truly authentic. Because on their history of mocking and making fun of their prophets.