Christianity Makes No Sense

[connermt]

The concept of christianity makes little to no sense to many once it's reviewed in detail. However, that's doesn't seem to be christianity's main problem. That 'accolade' falls to it's lack of structure combined with its malleability. Both of these characteristics allow christianity to thrive in most all environments, but allows for segregation. This, in turn, leads to distenct sects of the same belief system.
When this happens, we start seeing things like different definitions for the same term, terms used in one sect not used in another, new 'holy writings' introduced as docterine in one group but not others, etc. This creates more divides between sects.
Examples: one religion prays to saints and one doesn't; one believes in the 'once saved always saved' mentality and another doesn't; one says 'god is love' while another says 'god is hate' - and they each have qualifying verse(s)/biblical qualifications used to base their belief system on.

For consideration:
Is this the idea god had in mind when it created christianity/allowed it to be created? Did god want dozens or hundreds of differing beliefs from the same belief system? Surely god would know this division of the same belief would cause confusion and lead to more people not worshiping the same, proper way, no?

Or does god want one group to share the same beliefs, in total, of itself - one church one belief united as one?

[ttruscott]

...

For consideration:
Is this the idea god had in mind when it created christianity/allowed it to be created?

Yes, all things are for the good of HIS elect...

Did god want dozens or hundreds of differing beliefs from the same belief system?

The Christian answer is 'obviously allowed ' or they would not exist, though they are a product of sin and therefore not strictly wanted.

Surely god would know this division of the same belief would cause confusion and lead to more people not worshiping the same, proper way, no?

Of course - and by so doing forces people to chose what they believe, wherein they should put their faith, so everyone is separated into their belief groups. It is a war here on earth with Satan trying to keep the sinful elect in their sins so as to keep the postponement of the judgment in place while GOD is gently bringing HIS sinful elect to perfect holiness through heir faith so the reprobate may be safely judged.

Or does god want one group to share the same beliefs, in total, of itself - one church one belief united as one?

In the end, this will be, after the repentance to perfect holiness of the good but evil seed. While even one of HIS elect still loves the pleasures and profits of sin more than the truth, this world will be what it is.

Perfect unity of belief is also the reason for the necessity of banishing the reprobate from created reality to the outer darkness: one church united telepathically in one belief in full, loving and holy communion with GOD and each other throughout all of created reality is the heavenly experience and the presence of just one still evil and hateful criminally minded person would poison that communion totally...they must be banished to prevent any touch of their evil with heaven.

Peace, Ted

[Divine Insight]

For consideration:
Is this the idea god had in mind when it created christianity/allowed it to be created?

This question hypothetically assumes that some God is actually associated with the religion. I personally seen no reason to even entertain such an unrealistic hypothetical question.

This is no different from asking whether Zeus had all the various stories of Greek Mythology in mind before he began. It's just a silly question to begin with.

I think there are enough sound reasons to reject the idea that these religious fables have anything at all to do with any God.

Christianity in particular is extremely vile. It no only begins with God behaving in extremely ignorant an unintelligent ways, but Christianity has this very same God creating a plot where his very own priests end up crucifying his on son on a pole in a very disgusting gory way and then demanding that anyone who doesn't condone and accept this on their behalf will be condemned.

Such a God would be the most disgusting entity that ever existed.

There's no getting around it.

Especially when we consider that in these fables this God could have created a girl like Mother Mary for Adam instead of a Bimbo like Eve.

I mean, come on. If Eve was evil or stupid, who's fault is is that? It could only be this God's fault since he's the one who created her for Adam.

In fact, I often see these "Christian Dating Sites" advertising to people that they should join them and find the mate that God has waiting for them.

What? Why would anyone trust this God to fix them up with a mate after he had fixed Adam up with a bimbo like Eve?

The religion not only makes no sense, but IMHO, it's utterly stupid. It just a very poorly written collection of absolute ignorant and stupid story created by authors who had seriously demented imagination.

I could write a better creation story than the Bible. And this is all the proof I need to know that the Bible could not be a story of the behavior of any God. For such a God would need to necessarily be extremely beneath me in terms of even the simplest common sense.

In order for me to believe in the Bible I would need to believe that our creator is dumber than an uneducated barroom drunkard.

The biblical fables are not even remotely worthy of consideration. Why anyone defends these utterly ignorant fables is beyond me. And I make absolutely no apologies for my views on this matter.

I reject the whole of the Abrahamic religions precisely because their description and behaviors associated with their God character are absolutely ignorant and stupid. That's the reason I reject them, and I actually find it quite insulting when people act like I'm the one who's in the wrong for rejecting this stuff.

It's absolutely ignorant, and shameful, IMHO.

A God who plots to have his only begotten son butchered on a pole by his very own lame priests and then demands that everyone else condone and accept this horrific act on their own behalf lest he'll cast them into eternal damnation.

It totally baffles me how anyone can take this religion seriously.

This is not a picture of a God. This is a story of an absolute monster who has no empathy, love, or intelligence at all. None whatsoever.

Thanks for the chance to let that out.

But seriously, this is how I feel, and I can't see anyone defending this stuff at all. It's totally indefensible, IMHO.

[connermt]

[Replying to post 2 by ttruscott]

Yes, all things are for the good of HIS elect...

Then it truly seems god has no clue what he's doing or how we operate

though they are a product of sin and therefore not strictly wanted.

Not wanted but allowed? Why would god allow such confusion?

[connermt]

[Replying to post 3 by Divine Insight]

This question hypothetically assumes that some God is actually associated with the religion.

Rather it should be or not, it is.

I personally seen no reason to even entertain such an unrealistic hypothetical question.

Other than the fact that it is?

In fact, I often see these "Christian Dating Sites" advertising to people that they should join them and find the mate that God has waiting for them.

What? Why would anyone trust this God to fix them up with a mate after he had fixed Adam up with a bimbo like Eve?

I've often wondered the same type of question. I find those site amusing to the point of being sad. If nothing else, as if god needs an online connection to help you find your connection...

...and I can't see anyone defending this stuff at all. It's totally indefensible, IMHO.

It makes me wonder if these defenders really believe it or if they're doing it to 'save face' or the like.

[Danmark]

Christianity in particular is extremely vile. It no only begins with God behaving in extremely ignorant an unintelligent ways, but Christianity has this very same God creating a plot where his very own priests end up crucifying his on son on a pole in a very disgusting gory way and then demanding that anyone who doesn't condone and accept this on their behalf will be condemned.

Such a God would be the most disgusting entity that ever existed.

There's no getting around it.

Moderator Clarification
Rather than issue a 'comment,' let me just say that a report was filed on this post as 'preaching' in a negative manner. It seems to me that this is 'fair comment' on the religion in question and does not violate forum rules. The criticism of the religion in question is certainly argued in strong terms, but there does not appear to be a specific rule violation. Whether or not the criticism is valid, is the issue, and equally forceful rebuttal in counter argument would be equally allowable.
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[Wootah]

The concept of christianity makes little to no sense to many once it's reviewed in detail. However, that's doesn't seem to be christianity's main problem. That 'accolade' falls to it's lack of structure combined with its malleability. Both of these characteristics allow christianity to thrive in most all environments, but allows for segregation. This, in turn, leads to distenct sects of the same belief system.
When this happens, we start seeing things like different definitions for the same term, terms used in one sect not used in another, new 'holy writings' introduced as docterine in one group but not others, etc. This creates more divides between sects.
Examples: one religion prays to saints and one doesn't; one believes in the 'once saved always saved' mentality and another doesn't; one says 'god is love' while another says 'god is hate' - and they each have qualifying verse(s)/biblical qualifications used to base their belief system on.

For consideration:
Is this the idea god had in mind when it created christianity/allowed it to be created? Did god want dozens or hundreds of differing beliefs from the same belief system? Surely god would know this division of the same belief would cause confusion and lead to more people not worshiping the same, proper way, no?

Or does god want one group to share the same beliefs, in total, of itself - one church one belief united as one?

I've always been able to understand the different sects and view points.

What I think is more important is that one can see the pros and cons of each position. I rarely see someone who has a fixed view acknowledge the points of the other side and how that would affect what they currently believe. So I think it is less about logic but more about cultural influences of friends and family than about Christianity itself.

For instance, it seems from my view, elementary, that one cannot get to heaven by oneself. And yet on this crux all religions turn. It is so mentally hurtful to the ego that we cannot get to heaven without Christ it is for me, little wonder to see so many other views created. And yet it's pretty simple to see it is true.

That we are not God, we are not 'the one'. Is very difficult for us to accept. And yet it makes no sense, there is no evidence from our lives, to remotely imagine we are the one or that we are good enough for Heaven. And yet all religions except Christianity believe that we are good enough for Heaven.

[Divine Insight]

That we are not God, we are not 'the one'. Is very difficult for us to accept. And yet it makes no sense, there is no evidence from our lives, to remotely imagine we are the one or that we are good enough for Heaven. And yet all religions except Christianity believe that we are good enough for Heaven.

Not all religions believe in a "Heaven" in the same way as Christianity. So it doesn't really make sense to say that all religions except Christianity believe that we are good enough for Heaven.

Moreover, even if we accept that we are not "good enough" for Heaven does it really makes sense that having Jesus butchered on a pole would somehow make us good enough for Heaven?

In a way Christianity is actually based on the concept that two wrongs somehow make a right. In other words, supposedly we aren't good enough for Heaven, yet if we condone having Jesus crucified for our sake (another wrong) that would somehow make things right?

How in the world does that make any sense at all?

According to Christianity I don't deserve to go to this place called Heaven. Yet if I condone having God's only begotten son butchered on a pole for my sake, I'll be let into heaven. So I end up a a place where I don't belong and I'm not worthy of being solely because I gave my seal of approval to have his son beaten and nailed to a pole to pay for my sins.

For me, that would be a "heaven" that I would not even be interested in going to. I wouldn't even want to be in that heaven if that's how I had to get there.

In short, Christianity is demanding that I lower my standards of morality and ethics to an extremely low and shameful level just to be admitted into this Heaven.

As far as I can see I would be on far higher moral ground if I simply told this God to forget the whole thing and cast me into his place of damnation. It might not be an enjoyable fate for me, but it would be the greater act of morality on my part.

Choosing to go to hell in Christianity rather than condoning having Jesus crucified for my sake would be the higher moral ground.

After all, if everyone made that choice this God would be standing there having his son butchered on a pole for no good reason because all humans would reject that immoral act.

As far as I can see it Christianity is actually asking me to become a highly immoral person just to save my butt from eternal damnation.

I'd rather go to hell than condone having Jesus nailed to a pole for my sake.

I don't think a person can take a higher moral stance than this.

Christianity is actually asking me to toss out my superior moral values and do something highly immoral which would be to condone the crucifixion of Jesus to pay for my supposed sins.

From my perspective that is a highly immoral God to even suggest that I should do such a thing.

[Wootah]

That we are not God, we are not 'the one'. Is very difficult for us to accept. And yet it makes no sense, there is no evidence from our lives, to remotely imagine we are the one or that we are good enough for Heaven. And yet all religions except Christianity believe that we are good enough for Heaven.

Moreover, even if we accept that we are not "good enough" for Heaven does it really makes sense that having Jesus butchered on a pole would somehow make us good enough for Heaven?

Yes I think the conscious notion of Jesus sacrifice allows us to acknowledge that we live by grace. It's an in history rescue event that we cannot ignore. Even after a 1000 years in heaven I will know I am not deserving of it and it is given by grace. No one in heaven other than God deserves it, apart from grace.

In a way Christianity is actually based on the concept that two wrongs somehow make a right. In other words, supposedly we aren't good enough for Heaven, yet if we condone having Jesus crucified for our sake (another wrong) that would somehow make things right?

What the second wrong of killing Jesus shows is that God is so powerful that he can use our evil to defeat us. It's like victory, only complete and utter.

How in the world does that make any sense at all?

How do you fail to understand, or why you choose not, is not a debatable matter. I'm no genius and it makes sense to me.

According to Christianity I don't deserve to go to this place called Heaven. Yet if I condone having God's only begotten son butchered on a pole for my sake, I'll be let into heaven. So I end up a a place where I don't belong and I'm not worthy of being solely because I gave my seal of approval to have his son beaten and nailed to a pole to pay for my sins.

You didn't give your seal of approval. God did it regardless of whether you wanted Him to do it or not. You either accept the sacrifice or reject it but let's not pretend we can approve of it.

For me, that would be a "heaven" that I would not even be interested in going to. I wouldn't even want to be in that heaven if that's how I had to get there.

In short, Christianity is demanding that I lower my standards of morality and ethics to an extremely low and shameful level just to be admitted into this Heaven.

As far as I can see I would be on far higher moral ground if I simply told this God to forget the whole thing and cast me into his place of damnation. It might not be an enjoyable fate for me, but it would be the greater act of morality on my part.

Choosing to go to hell in Christianity rather than condoning having Jesus crucified for my sake would be the higher moral ground.

After all, if everyone made that choice this God would be standing there having his son butchered on a pole for no good reason because all humans would reject that immoral act.

As far as I can see it Christianity is actually asking me to become a highly immoral person just to save my butt from eternal damnation.

I'd rather go to hell than condone having Jesus nailed to a pole for my sake.

I don't think a person can take a higher moral stance than this.

Christianity is actually asking me to toss out my superior moral values and do something highly immoral which would be to condone the crucifixion of Jesus to pay for my supposed sins.

From my perspective that is a highly immoral God to even suggest that I should do such a thing.

You never demonstrate your claims and yet you make your claims. Maybe it's because you thought you had to approve of God?

How is your morality better than Gods?

[Divine Insight]

In a way Christianity is actually based on the concept that two wrongs somehow make a right. In other words, supposedly we aren't good enough for Heaven, yet if we condone having Jesus crucified for our sake (another wrong) that would somehow make things right?

What the second wrong of killing Jesus shows is that God is so powerful that he can use our evil to defeat us. It's like victory, only complete and utter.

Well, we clearly think quite differently on this matter. IMHO, any God who has to stoop to the level of evil beings in order to "defeat them" is an extremely pathetic God.

Moreover, speak for yourself when you say "our evil". I personally do not consider myself to be an "evil" person. I have never done anything in my entire life that would justify nailing anyone to a pole.

If Jesus paid for my sins he's due a huge rebate because he way over-paid.

How in the world does that make any sense at all?

How do you fail to understand, or why you choose not, is not a debatable matter. I'm no genius and it makes sense to me.

You're right, that's beyond debate.

I'm just offering my views on the subject. I'm not judging your intelligence, nor attempting to compare your intelligence with mine. My conclusions are sane and rational for me. And that's all they need to be.

According to Christianity I don't deserve to go to this place called Heaven. Yet if I condone having God's only begotten son butchered on a pole for my sake, I'll be let into heaven. So I end up a a place where I don't belong and I'm not worthy of being solely because I gave my seal of approval to have his son beaten and nailed to a pole to pay for my sins.

You didn't give your seal of approval. God did it regardless of whether you wanted Him to do it or not. You either accept the sacrifice or reject it but let's not pretend we can approve of it.

I totally disagree with you on this matter.

If you accept the crucifixion of Jesus for your sake then you condone it for your sake. In fact, I hold that if you do not condone the crucifixion of Jesus to pay for your sins then you are in error to claim that you have accepted this.

It's really not up to God. It's up to me. This God should have asked me first. In fact, if he was truly omniscient like he's claimed to be he would have known from beginning of time that I would never condone such a disgusting act. As far as I'm concerned, the fact that this biblical God character had absolute NO CLUE that I would be so totally disgusted by this actually proves to me that it has to be a false man-made fable, because no genuinely intelligent God would have been that lame.

That is my reasoning on that one, and if you want to talk about geniuses I don't think it should take a genius to see the rationale in that.

You never demonstrate your claims and yet you make your claims. Maybe it's because you thought you had to approve of God?

It's absolutely mandatory that I approve of this biblical God. That's a given according to the Bible itself. The Bible demands that I love this God with all my heart, mind, and soul. How in the world could I possibly love a God that I don't even approve of?

How is your morality better than Gods?

Well, for starters I don't go around doing disgusting things and then demanding that people love me for them or I will condemn them to eternal torture.

I am so far above the morality of the Biblical God that it's not even remotely in question.