WBC at it again.

[Elijah John]

The scolding, finger-waving hate-filled members of the Westboro Baptist Church from Kansas have announced plans to protest Robin Williams funeral.

Question for debate, does the WBC abuse the first amendment by their disgusting actions?

[Darias]

Ignorance is not criminal.

You're all talking about whether or not nations should protect rights, but it needs to be said that neither actually exist.

What we have in reality is organized groups of individuals who grant themselves a monopoly on force to permit or prohibit a plethora of behaviors. These are man-made, mortal gods, errant as they may be and often are, with many willing servants and worshipers -- without whom they would not exist.

There are many types of behaviors that do no unwanted injury to person or property (e.g., wanted injury being boxing, or bdsm).

The state has made many of these crimes (e.g., drinking raw milk, or mocking the dear leader), but the only real crimes are those which involve the initiation of force--aka aggression. These things violate consent, much like rape or theft.

Locking someone up because they say unsavory things on their own property is a crime. Kidnapping and murder are crimes, regardless of whether the victims are unpopular.

[arian]

The scolding, finger-waving hate-filled members of the Westboro Baptist Church from Kansas have announced plans to protest Robin Williams funeral.

Question for debate, does the WBC abuse the first amendment by their disgusting actions?

The WBC is funded and organized by the same agency that organized all the school shootings, bombings, 9-11, and so on, and for the same reason; to bring in the Totalitarian control over humanity. The End to; "gun ownership, freedom of speech, freedom of religion or religious assembly, end to eating what you like, end to expressing your thought like on this Forum here, etc."

How do I know this? I almost joined them until one conversation with Shirley Phelps that revealed a carefully organized agenda which practically knocked me off my feet.

Your opening statement reveals that they are doing their job well, and your hints on "how far should we tolerate the Freedom od Speech" makes the reason for the post obvious also.

[Elijah John]

[Replying to post 12 by arian]

Just what do you suggest is the reason for my OP? I really hope it is not common cause with the WBC, because I have no common cause with them. AT all.

They preach a god of hate, I believe in a God of Love. PERIOD.

[UFO]

The scolding, finger-waving hate-filled members of the Westboro Baptist Church from Kansas have announced plans to protest Robin Williams funeral.

Question for debate, does the WBC abuse the first amendment by their disgusting actions?

In order to have and use the 1ST Amendment, we have to accept the good with the bad. What they (WBBC) do, while in bad taste and misguided is biblically based and should be allowed legally. Morally it probably isn't the right thing to do but what is or isn't 'right' isn't always illegal.
I don't know if the 1St Am. can be abused, at least not legally.

[Elijah John]

The scolding, finger-waving hate-filled members of the Westboro Baptist Church from Kansas have announced plans to protest Robin Williams funeral.

Question for debate, does the WBC abuse the first amendment by their disgusting actions?

In order to have and use the 1ST Amendment, we have to accept the good with the bad. What they (WBBC) do, while in bad taste and misguided is biblically based and should be allowed legally. Morally it probably isn't the right thing to do but what is or isn't 'right' isn't always illegal.
I don't know if the 1St Am. can be abused, at least not legally.

"Biblically based?" A loaded term, and out of context. Granted the Bible is against the practice homosexuality, but where in the Bible does it say "God hates fags"? Where does it say that soldiers are in hell, because their nation supports homosexuality? The WBC states both of these things.. explicitly. That is their hateful rhetoric which does NOT represent the Bible well, or in fact most Christians. Even Fundamentalists disavow the WBC, as the hate-mongers they are.

[99percentatheism]

Elijah John

[Replying to post 4 by Elijah John]

Well WBC hasn't physically assaulted anyone yet....

No, they are verbal and SPIRITUAL terrorists.

Prove that. You won't be able to and I won't ask you to retract your foundation-less charge. But please try to show how they do what you charge. They are people that say things that others find offensive and disapprove of. So what? I could make the same charge to the promoters of gay pride when they hurl untold numbers of insults at me. False accusations shouldn't hurt honest people. The verbal attacks I endure are as easy to live with as a hot wind in a desert where I do not reside.

The WBC supposedly tells lies right?

And they are inflammatory, disturbers of the peace.

Yes. And yes.

Are they lying?

[Wordleymaster1]

The scolding, finger-waving hate-filled members of the Westboro Baptist Church from Kansas have announced plans to protest Robin Williams funeral.

Question for debate, does the WBC abuse the first amendment by their disgusting actions?

In order to have and use the 1ST Amendment, we have to accept the good with the bad. What they (WBBC) do, while in bad taste and misguided is biblically based and should be allowed legally. Morally it probably isn't the right thing to do but what is or isn't 'right' isn't always illegal.
I don't know if the 1St Am. can be abused, at least not legally.

"Biblically based?" A loaded term, and out of context. Granted the Bible is against the practice homosexuality, but where in the Bible does it say "God hates fags"? Where does it say that soldiers are in hell, because their nation supports homosexuality? The WBC states both of these things.. explicitly. That is their hateful rhetoric which does NOT represent the Bible well, or in fact most Christians. Even Fundamentalists disavow the WBC, as the hate-mongers they are.

Have you been to their website lately? They show how they justify their actions off of the bible. Rather or not you agree with their take on it, they do simply show biblical justification for their actions. Of course, there is no literal passage that says "God hates fags" but their INTERPERTATION is biblically based.
That's the problem though, isn't it - INTERPERTATION? The bible is so loose in it construction (probably trying to be all encompassing to as many as possible to recruit as many as possible) that a person can make it say almost anything.
While I don't agree with their views nor interpertation, they do justify it. Maybe the biblical editors should have removed more of the 'god hates' wording before it was published?

[arian]

The scolding, finger-waving hate-filled members of the Westboro Baptist Church from Kansas have announced plans to protest Robin Williams funeral.

Question for debate, does the WBC abuse the first amendment by their disgusting actions?

In order to have and use the 1ST Amendment, we have to accept the good with the bad. What they (WBBC) do, while in bad taste and misguided is biblically based and should be allowed legally. Morally it probably isn't the right thing to do but what is or isn't 'right' isn't always illegal.
I don't know if the 1St Am. can be abused, at least not legally.

"Biblically based?" A loaded term, and out of context. Granted the Bible is against the practice homosexuality, but where in the Bible does it say "God hates fags"? Where does it say that soldiers are in hell, because their nation supports homosexuality? The WBC states both of these things.. explicitly. That is their hateful rhetoric which does NOT represent the Bible well, or in fact most Christians. Even Fundamentalists disavow the WBC, as the hate-mongers they are.

Have you been to their website lately? They show how they justify their actions off of the bible. Rather or not you agree with their take on it, they do simply show biblical justification for their actions. Of course, there is no literal passage that says "God hates fags" but their INTERPERTATION is biblically based.
That's the problem though, isn't it - INTERPERTATION? The bible is so loose in it construction (probably trying to be all encompassing to as many as possible to recruit as many as possible) that a person can make it say almost anything.
While I don't agree with their views nor interpertation, they do justify it. Maybe the biblical editors should have removed more of the 'god hates' wording before it was published?

Or maybe people should try to understand the Bible itself, not keep interpreting it through religious doctrines.

Are you serious? You said regarding the Bible as: (probably trying to be all encompassing to as many as possible to recruit as many as possible) ??

Matthew 24:21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be. 22 And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the elect’s sake those days will be shortened.

Matthew 10:22 And you will be hated by all for My name’s sake. But he who endures to the end will be saved.

Matthew 5:11 “Blessed are you when they revile and persecute you, and say all kinds of evil against you falsely for My sake. 12 Rejoice and be exceedingly glad, for great is your reward in heaven, for so they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

It is the religiously altered interpretations of the Bible that is aimed to "recruit as many as possible" with their; 'Pre-tribulation rapture, everyone who confesses "Lord, Lord" is getting into Heaven, .. be happy and do as thou wilt 'cause Christ got you covered!' and so on.

Hate;
If you had gangrene eating at your leg, would you pat it and say: "Nice gangrene, oh I love you gangrene, .. good boy gangrene." Or would you say: "Damn you gangrene, I hate you. I hate you so much that I'm willing to cut my leg off to get rid of you. You are a destroyer, a killer gangrene, and I hate you!"

Yes, God hates, and soon, .. real soon He will show the world just exactly how much He can hate. No more 'nice-guy' to those who promote and condone evil.

Yes, as perfect and obvious as Gods message has been for the past 6,000 years (through Prophets, through the beauty of nature, through devastations of nature, etc.) we people can make it say/mean just about anything we want it to say. We can do that with anything said, written or anything that we have observed.

One person can admire Gods work in a Gorilla at the zoo, while another can say: "See Bill, that's you, and the only thing separates you and that Gorilla is 'time'."

This last 'Noah' movie is another perfect example of your 'interpretation based' comment. Seems like evil people see both the punishment, and the punisher as evil, never what it was truly intended for, for correction to bring about justice.

If you look more carefully, you would see that the WBC's sole purpose is not to 'bring people closer to God', but to turn them away. You think the lesbian Ellen DeGeneres would have them come on her show if they were even remotely
about 'drawing people to Christ'!?

[Wordleymaster1]

The scolding, finger-waving hate-filled members of the Westboro Baptist Church from Kansas have announced plans to protest Robin Williams funeral.

Question for debate, does the WBC abuse the first amendment by their disgusting actions?

In order to have and use the 1ST Amendment, we have to accept the good with the bad. What they (WBBC) do, while in bad taste and misguided is biblically based and should be allowed legally. Morally it probably isn't the right thing to do but what is or isn't 'right' isn't always illegal.
I don't know if the 1St Am. can be abused, at least not legally.

"Biblically based?" A loaded term, and out of context. Granted the Bible is against the practice homosexuality, but where in the Bible does it say "God hates fags"? Where does it say that soldiers are in hell, because their nation supports homosexuality? The WBC states both of these things.. explicitly. That is their hateful rhetoric which does NOT represent the Bible well, or in fact most Christians. Even Fundamentalists disavow the WBC, as the hate-mongers they are.

Have you been to their website lately? They show how they justify their actions off of the bible. Rather or not you agree with their take on it, they do simply show biblical justification for their actions. Of course, there is no literal passage that says "God hates fags" but their INTERPERTATION is biblically based.
That's the problem though, isn't it - INTERPERTATION? The bible is so loose in it construction (probably trying to be all encompassing to as many as possible to recruit as many as possible) that a person can make it say almost anything.
While I don't agree with their views nor interpertation, they do justify it. Maybe the biblical editors should have removed more of the 'god hates' wording before it was published?

Or maybe people should try to understand the Bible itself, not keep interpreting it through religious doctrines.

Are you serious? You said regarding the Bible as: (probably trying to be all encompassing to as many as possible to recruit as many as possible) ??

Matthew 24:21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be. 22 And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the elect’s sake those days will be shortened.

Matthew 10:22 And you will be hated by all for My name’s sake. But he who endures to the end will be saved.

Matthew 5:11 “Blessed are you when they revile and persecute you, and say all kinds of evil against you falsely for My sake. 12 Rejoice and be exceedingly glad, for great is your reward in heaven, for so they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

It is the religiously altered interpretations of the Bible that is aimed to "recruit as many as possible" with their; 'Pre-tribulation rapture, everyone who confesses "Lord, Lord" is getting into Heaven, .. be happy and do as thou wilt 'cause Christ got you covered!' and so on.

Hate;
If you had gangrene eating at your leg, would you pat it and say: "Nice gangrene, oh I love you gangrene, .. good boy gangrene." Or would you say: "Damn you gangrene, I hate you. I hate you so much that I'm willing to cut my leg off to get rid of you. You are a destroyer, a killer gangrene, and I hate you!"

Yes, God hates, and soon, .. real soon He will show the world just exactly how much He can hate. No more 'nice-guy' to those who promote and condone evil.

Yes, as perfect and obvious as Gods message has been for the past 6,000 years (through Prophets, through the beauty of nature, through devastations of nature, etc.) we people can make it say/mean just about anything we want it to say. We can do that with anything said, written or anything that we have observed.

One person can admire Gods work in a Gorilla at the zoo, while another can say: "See Bill, that's you, and the only thing separates you and that Gorilla is 'time'."

This last 'Noah' movie is another perfect example of your 'interpretation based' comment. Seems like evil people see both the punishment, and the punisher as evil, never what it was truly intended for, for correction to bring about justice.

If you look more carefully, you would see that the WBC's sole purpose is not to 'bring people closer to God', but to turn them away. You think the lesbian Ellen DeGeneres would have them come on her show if they were even remotely
about 'drawing people to Christ'!?

Better yet, people should understand the bible for what it is: a book of non-sense. That would clear up all the issues!
It's sad to think people in this day and age read something as ignorant as the bible and think it an accurate history book and not a book written by superstitous men with a political and social bend for its time.
But yeah, we all need to 'truly understand it' as many Christians would say! Pa-leeze! It's just another religious work - nothing more.

[arian]

[Replying to post 12 by arian]

Just what do you suggest is the reason for my OP? I really hope it is not common cause with the WBC, because I have no common cause with them. AT all.

They preach a god of hate, I believe in a God of Love. PERIOD.

But don't you believe that God will cast billions of people into hell, a place of eternal darkness without hope, where there can be no joy (for all good things come from God, and God removes His presence from hell) but weeping and gnashing of teeth? And according to the NT Jesus teachings, if "Just like in the days of Noah, .. where only a few as eight people were saved" most people are going there. So if God can throw the majority of people who have denied Him and his Son Word into such an evil place, IMHO it would be delusional for me to say; "God is Love, PERIOD".

I also believe that just as God used Pharaoh and the idolatrous nation Egypt back in Moses days to bring about His will, the WBC is also doing a fine job of it. This was the main reason I wanted to join them, until I found out what the real 'paid' reason was for their actions. So does God hate fags? Here, you be the judge of it:

Revelation 21:8 But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.�

Oh, just to make something clear regarding the "God loves the sinner, but hates the sin" popular Christian Religious phrase, God will not just throw the 'homosexual ACT' into that lake of fire, but He will cast the homosexual, the 'fag' himself into the lake which burns with fire and brimstone. You cannot have an 'act' without the actor. No actor, no sin. Also on that Last Day, God will not "separate the sin from the sinner", so in this sense, according to the Bible God does "Hate faggots", and all other sinners too.