U.S. Supreme Court upholds right to Marry in all 50 States

[Danmark]

The United States Supreme Court today held: same-sex couples
may exercise the fundamental right to marry in all 50 States.
".... No union is more profound than marriage, for it embodies
the highest ideals of love, fidelity, devotion, sacrifice,
and family. In forming a marital union, two people become
something greater than once they were. As some of
the petitioners in these cases demonstrate, marriage
embodies a love that may endure even past death. It
would misunderstand these men and women to say they
disrespect the idea of marriage. Their plea is that they do
respect it, respect it so deeply that they seek to find its
fulfillment for themselves. Their hope is not to be condemned
to live in loneliness, excluded from one of civilization’s
oldest institutions. They ask for equal dignity in the
eyes of the law. The Constitution grants them that right."

Question for debate: Is this decision, and its rationale, consistent with the teachings of Jesus to be loving, faithful, understanding, and tolerant?

[Hatuey]

[Replying to post 30 by lastcallhall]

Repent means to "turn away from," so to repent from divorce would mean to go back to the former spouse and reconcile. Otherwise the divorced person is continuing to live in sin. If a person living in homosexuality is living in sin, then the person who continues to live in a divorced state (from their first spouse) is also living in sin. Any other perspective is hypocritical.

[Korah]

[Replying to post 31 by Hatuey]
What if my first wife kicked me out?
Plus there's polygyny in the Old Testament. So why can't I take another wife? Lots of guys support two or more wives.
(Well yeah, 90% of them dumped the first in favor of the second, third, etc. and never go to church anyway, but I'm talking about the principle.)

[lastcallhall]

Repent means to "turn away from," so to repent from divorce would mean to go back to the former spouse and reconcile. Otherwise the divorced person is continuing to live in sin. If a person living in homosexuality is living in sin, then the person who continues to live in a divorced state (from their first spouse) is also living in sin. Any other perspective is hypocritical

.

I agree to a point and I really don't want to hijack this thread and turn it into a debate on divorce. If you wish to continue this please start another thread.

There are many reasons why a blanket statement cant fit almost anything. If the person was not a Christian prior to divorce they didnt understand what they were doing was against God or and their ex spouse is married again or just wants nothing to do with them then there is nothing they can do.

I believe you can be truly repentant and turn away from your sin and get married again. I believe the blood Jesus shed is stronger than divorce and it is not an unforgiveable sin.
From what I have read and studied about God's nature he would be against say someone got divorced re-married had kids and became a Christian after this. I think it would be a sin to leave your spouse and kids to try to reconcile with a previous spouse. I think that is legalistic.

[Hatuey]

[Replying to post 33 by lastcallhall]

Okay, but my point is the hypocrisy of the church and its members. There are people who get divorced for unbiblical reasons, claim repentance yet do not make things right and the church never gives it a second though. Just like those members who continually struggle with addiction or gambling or some other sin. If a member is struggling with most any sin it is overlooked, but not homosexuality. Why the outrage and protests in the streets against homosexuality and not divorce, or alcoholics, or gamblers, or gluttons? What makes homosexuality something to be rallied against versus gluttony? Why do gluttonous, alcoholic, gambling, spouse abusers get served by and ministered to by the same church that preaches against homosexuals? Double standard that demonstrates pure hypocrisy in most congregations and denominations.

[lastcallhall]

Okay, but my point is the hypocrisy of the church and its members. There are people who get divorced for unbiblical reasons, claim repentance yet do not make things right and the church never gives it a second though

I agree with you totally!! The church has a lot of problems there is no denying that and it is too bad. We would attract more people if we had our house in order. There is too much of what I call prosperity gospel where all the church preaches is what God can do for you and never asks what we need to do for God

Just like those members who continually struggle with addiction or gambling or some other sin. If a member is struggling with most any sin it is overlooked, but not homosexuality. Why the outrage and protests in the streets against homosexuality and not divorce, or alcoholics, or gamblers, or gluttons? What makes homosexuality something to be rallied against versus gluttony? Why do gluttonous, alcoholic, gambling, spouse abusers get served by and ministered to by the same church that preaches against homosexuals? Double standard that demonstrates pure hypocrisy in most congregations and denominations.

I agree with you again, we all struggle with something there is no doubt about it and it is unfortunate that it seems like we focus on this sin because it is the one sin that is open. Most sins are done in private or hidden. All I can say is that I can honestly see how some are not attracted to the church because of how the members act.

[DanieltheDragon]

[Replying to post 31 by Hatuey]
What if my first wife kicked me out?
Plus there's polygyny in the Old Testament. So why can't I take another wife? Lots of guys support two or more wives.
(Well yeah, 90% of them dumped the first in favor of the second, third, etc. and never go to church anyway, but I'm talking about the principle.)

I have to agree with you here adultery in scripture is when one man sleeps with another mans wife. It is only considered living in sin for the woman because she is technically still the other mans wife.

I wouldn't think you even need to take on another wife so long is she is an unmarried non virgin. For reference look at all of King Solomon's many concubines or generally the entire story of Samson.

[Haven]

[Replying to post 24 by lastcallhall]

We don't live in a theocracy, we live in a constitutionally secular democratic republic under the rule of (human!) law. Your religious beliefs about marriage for same-sex couples (and mistaken beliefs about the age of the Earth) are completely irrelevant to U.S. law and should have no legal standing whatsoever. You're free to believe as you wish and abstain from marrying a same-sex partner, but you can't legislate your fundamentalist religious beliefs (if you want that, move to a theocratic country like Iran or Saudi Arabia).

[Haven]

I agree with you totally!! The church has a lot of problems there is no denying that and it is too bad. We would attract more people if we had our house in order. There is too much of what I call prosperity gospel where all the church preaches is what God can do for you and never asks what we need to do for God

I think the church (by this, I assume you mean the evangelical church) would attract more people if it would lay off the anti-gay, anti-trans, and anti-woman bigotry and discrimination, as well as get rid of the absurd science denialism and blatant irrationalism (like proclaiming the Earth to be 6,000 years old, when it clearly is not).

[Korah]

[Replying to post 38 by Haven]
Apparently you failed to read my Post #25 in which I decried LastCall's mention of 6,000 years, that this prevented me from marking his post a "like" even though I otherwise so fully agreed with it.
Not that he NECESSARILY by saying "6.000" meant that this referred to the age of the Earth. After all, that's about how far back we historians can find written records. Maybe that's what he meant. I only dissociated myself to avoid getting labeled myself as anti-scientific.
My body itself shouts that I'm paleolithic! I have Celiac Disease, meaning I'm one of the few survivals from pre-Neolithic agricultural ages when NO ONE ate any type of grains. (I can fortunately eat rice and corn.J My ancestral genetics necessarily goes back over 8,000 years, more like the 30,000 year ago emergence of the Cro-Magnons, the (partial) ancestors of most everyone stemming from Europe (except the Lapps , gypsies, and Jews).
Oh, for the record, I'm not a Nazi but indeed a most fervent U. S Constitutionalist of the Ross Perot stripe. (But I love Bernie Sanders anyway. If only he weren't older than the hills--he's even older than I am.)

[lastcallhall]

We don't live in a theocracy, we live in a constitutionally secular democratic republic under the rule of (human!) law. Your religious beliefs about marriage for same-sex couples (and mistaken beliefs about the age of the Earth) are completely irrelevant to U.S. law and should have no legal standing whatsoever. You're free to believe as you wish and abstain from marrying a same-sex partner, but you can't legislate your fundamentalist religious beliefs (if you want that, move to a theocratic country like Iran or Saudi Arabia).

I have never suggested we live in a theocracy I realize what this country was and is becoming. IMO the country was in a much better place 30+ years ago when the biggest problems in school had nothing to do with guns and drugs and they were not teaching kinds about anal sex with condoms. When you didn't have to lock your doors at night and didn't worry about your kids playing outside. But we did follow the ten commandments much more back then in general as a country. I guess I am not sure what is so offensive about the 10 commandments or which one of them is a bad thing for a person to live by? I think it makes for a better society but I know I am in the minority on that.
As far as gay marriage my problem is not that gays live together because people can live anyway they wish their life lived will be between them and God. My issue with marriage is two. 1. They now are imposing their views on me and my kids if I sent them to public school because now they have to teach marriage between two men is ok when that is not my belief. The school does not have that right and I wont give it to them. They are already calling for churches to be forced to do gay weddings or lose their tax exempt status. It will be criminalized, IMO, soon to preach from the Bible about homosexuality just look to Canada.
2. homosexual rights now trump religious rights and freedom of speech. Look at Indiana, Oregon, New Mexico, and Colorado for proof of people not being able to follow their religious convictions. The gay couples could have gone to any number of florists or bakers but they want the confrontation they want opposition silenced and want Christians out of business. And if you work for a big corporation and someone saw a facebook post that said you didn't agree with the SCOTUS ruling well let's just say you might lose your job quickly. Sounds more like Nazi Germany then the USA

And I am sorry for being vague I can see how you would think I meant the world is 6,000 years old but I believe it could be millions of years old the Bible is unclear we just have 6,000 years of recorded history with man. It says in Genesis God created animals before man and we do not view time as God does so the could have been a billion years for the dinosaurs to roam the earth before God made adam.