Why is believing in something implausible necessary?
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Why is believing in something implausible necessary?
Post #1Why must you believe in something absurd to be a religious person? It seems that this is a common characteristic of all religions. Why couldn't there be a religion where you don't have to believe anything eccentric? Why wouldn't a religion where you don't have to believe anything unbelievable work? Is it necessary to have faith in something you know is nuts to secure a bond?
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Kenisaw
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Post #21
I'm curious why you say he does not know what he is talking about.Monta wrote: [Replying to Delphi]
"Faith is a license that people give themselves to allow them to believe whatever idea they feel strongly about. Especially if it is to please the unseen God. "
People with this menatality don't know what they are talking about.
Post #22
I take offence at being told that my faith gives me licence to believe whatever idea I strongly feel about. Unless they personally know a person, they do not know what they are talking about but makes them feel good just to say it.Kenisaw wrote:I'm curious why you say he does not know what he is talking about.Monta wrote: [Replying to Delphi]
"Faith is a license that people give themselves to allow them to believe whatever idea they feel strongly about. Especially if it is to please the unseen God. "
People with this menatality don't know what they are talking about.
Post #23
[Replying to post 22 by Monta]
Why do you take offense at being told that your faith gives you license to believe whatever idea you feel strongly about?
If I say something about science that is incorrect and I am told that I am wrong followed by an explanation and citations that I can then check I'm elated at now having a deeper more accurate understanding.
You on the other hand are so confident that what you believe is the ultimate truth you have no capacity for learning or change.
Why do you take offense at being told that your faith gives you license to believe whatever idea you feel strongly about?
If I say something about science that is incorrect and I am told that I am wrong followed by an explanation and citations that I can then check I'm elated at now having a deeper more accurate understanding.
You on the other hand are so confident that what you believe is the ultimate truth you have no capacity for learning or change.
Post #24
[Replying to man]
"Why do you take offense at being told that your faith gives you license to believe whatever idea you feel strongly about?
If I say something about science that is incorrect and I am told that I am wrong followed by an explanation and citations that I can then check I'm elated at now having a deeper more accurate understanding.
You on the other hand are so confident that what you believe is the ultimate truth you have no capacity for learning or change."
Not quite right. I do believe in the ultimate truth but it is not complete; my capacity and desire to change if neccessary and learn here and to eternity will remain fully open and receptive.
As to the top paragraph, I do not believe whatsoever because I feel strongly about it; understanding and wanting to know more is only first step.
"Why do you take offense at being told that your faith gives you license to believe whatever idea you feel strongly about?
If I say something about science that is incorrect and I am told that I am wrong followed by an explanation and citations that I can then check I'm elated at now having a deeper more accurate understanding.
You on the other hand are so confident that what you believe is the ultimate truth you have no capacity for learning or change."
Not quite right. I do believe in the ultimate truth but it is not complete; my capacity and desire to change if neccessary and learn here and to eternity will remain fully open and receptive.
As to the top paragraph, I do not believe whatsoever because I feel strongly about it; understanding and wanting to know more is only first step.
Post #25
[Replying to post 24 by Monta]
I guess you have to be on the outside looking in because when I listen to someone talk about the outlandish stores from their religion they sound bat s**t crazy. And it's not just Christians it's Jews, Muslims, Scientologists, people who believe in Bigfoot, etc. etc. etc.
I guess you have to be on the outside looking in because when I listen to someone talk about the outlandish stores from their religion they sound bat s**t crazy. And it's not just Christians it's Jews, Muslims, Scientologists, people who believe in Bigfoot, etc. etc. etc.
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PghPanther
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Re: Why is believing in something implausible necessary?
Post #26ttruscott wrote:There is always the choice between existentialism and modern buddhism/taoism...man wrote: Why must you believe in something absurd to be a religious person? It seems that this is a common characteristic of all religions. Why couldn't there be a religion where you don't have to believe anything eccentric? Why wouldn't a religion where you don't have to believe anything unbelievable work? Is it necessary to have faith in something you know is nuts to secure a bond?
And, to the Christian mind, our own sinfulness is the cause of our understanding being so distorted that the truth seems to us to be undeniably implausible...as written in Roman 1.
Truth??...............
Paul and everyone else in those times had no idea how to document and establish truth.............all their truth claims on things they didn't understand (aka natural phenomenon for example) were absolute truth claims based on ignorance coupled with their supernatural superstitions.
Truth of the unknown can only be established provisionally and that didn't have a process until the scientific method came into use centuries after these people lived.
Romans 1 is a perfect example of total ignorance of how reality works............
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Kenisaw
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Post #27
Thank you for the clarification.Monta wrote:I take offence at being told that my faith gives me licence to believe whatever idea I strongly feel about. Unless they personally know a person, they do not know what they are talking about but makes them feel good just to say it.Kenisaw wrote:I'm curious why you say he does not know what he is talking about.Monta wrote: [Replying to Delphi]
"Faith is a license that people give themselves to allow them to believe whatever idea they feel strongly about. Especially if it is to please the unseen God. "
People with this menatality don't know what they are talking about.
I guess I took it to mean that, given the astounding number of variations that each belief system generates, the ability to modify a belief system to fit one's world view is a normal part of adhering to a belief system. In other words, a belief system doesn't change the person nearly as much as the person changes the belief system. I feel comfortable making this statement given what I've experienced from Christians that I had discourse with at this site and others as well as my personal relationships. If you disagree please let me know.
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otseng
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Post #28
man wrote: they sound bat s**t crazy.
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Re: Why is believing in something implausible necessary?
Post #29I personally want to believe what is true.man wrote: By the very definition of religion it involves a set of beliefs, but WHY do the beliefs need to be in conflict with reality?
A rational person tends to discriminate between that which is plausible and that which is implausible.
The Bible could be argued to be the Holy handbook of the implausible.
Biblical incidents include virgin births (Matt 1:18), or staffs turning into snakes (Exodus 7:10), or a person becoming a pillar of salt (Gen 19:26), or the sun becoming still in the sky (Joshua 10:13), or seas of water dividing apart for slave escapees from Egypt (Exodus 14:21).
That's just a few examples of many. They seem to conflict with reality.
Is there evidence of these unusual Biblical claims to compel a 21st century Christian to accept such magical and supernatural things in the Holy text? Or is it merely religious faith...?
Re: Why is believing in something implausible necessary?
Post #30[Replying to ttruscott]
"And, to the Christian mind, our own sinfulness is the cause of our understanding being so distorted that the truth seems to us to be undeniably implausible...as written in Roman 1."
I noticed many commented on Romans 1 but not on what it actually said
so here is part of it:
22 Claiming to be wise, they became fools, 23 and qexchanged the glory of rthe immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things.
24 Therefore sGod gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to tthe dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, 25 because they exchanged the truth about God for ua lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, vwho is blessed forever! Amen.
26 For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions.
28 And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God,zGod gave them up to aa debased mind to do what ought not to be done. 29 They were filled with all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. They are gossips, 30 slanderers, haters of God, insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, 31 foolish, faithless, heartless, ruthless.
AND HOW TRUE THIS IS!
"And, to the Christian mind, our own sinfulness is the cause of our understanding being so distorted that the truth seems to us to be undeniably implausible...as written in Roman 1."
I noticed many commented on Romans 1 but not on what it actually said
so here is part of it:
22 Claiming to be wise, they became fools, 23 and qexchanged the glory of rthe immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things.
24 Therefore sGod gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to tthe dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, 25 because they exchanged the truth about God for ua lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, vwho is blessed forever! Amen.
26 For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions.
28 And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God,zGod gave them up to aa debased mind to do what ought not to be done. 29 They were filled with all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. They are gossips, 30 slanderers, haters of God, insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, 31 foolish, faithless, heartless, ruthless.
AND HOW TRUE THIS IS!
