Helping Gauleiter88

[ttruscott]

Hello. I am new to the forum and don't know how to use it yet. I am an American male, 85 years old, retired and now living in northern California. I was raised as a Christian, but not very seriously and soon became an agnostic. Now that I am older, I am more open to the idea of some kind of life after death. I have looked at several religions, but found nothing satisfactory. I have many questions. I don't want preaching, just personal answers.

This post was stuck into another topic so I rescued the thought to give it its own weight. Good luck, Gauleiter88... ask your questions here.

[Blastcat]

[Replying to post 18 by JehovahsWitness]


[center]Do we believe post 5 or post 3?
Part Two: Is god magic the only answer to every conceivable question about "God"?[/center]

Your rough estimates are fine for a long, long time. Unfortunately, "infinity" is longer than an long long time.

And do you recall what I posted regarding "infinity"? Did you read the comments I directed you to in this regard?

Sorry, I focused on just a part of post 5. Now, I've read it all. As I recall, post 5 was in reply to Gauleiter88, and wasn't directed to me, by the way.

There's a lot of information in post 5.
Thanks for reminding me that you said you had no idea how Gauleiter88's problem was going to be resolved. The only thing that you told him is that YOU are confident that it will be.

It doesn't even seem to be a concern to you. I suppose that you have faith that "God" will take care of everything.

It's a bit of a concern for Gauleiter88, however.
I have to wonder if your faith is going to be good enough for him.

Getting back to post 5, you stated there that:

"What the future holds after that the bible does not say, any speculation of moving on to other planets or ceasing to reproduce via the removal of the desire to have children... or some other means ... are just that, speculative. "

So, in your opinion, it's just not going to be a problem. Any problems or any solutions to those problems, they are all going to be purely speculative. But do not fear, for "God" is here !!!

It's as if you are telling that to Gauleiter88... something like "don't worry if there's a problem, it's just all going to be fixed."

And it's just all going to be fixed, presumably, just by way of god magic.
So, Gauleiter88, buddy, you can rest easy.

Do I have that correctly?
You're telling Helping Gauleiter88 not to worry about it?


Due to MAGIC?

What we can be confident of though is that the original promise of a "full" not "overpopulated" earth will be mankind's destiny."

I'm quite sure that you are quite confident.
What we are looking for are reasons to be as confident as you seem to be.

If you have good reasons.. hey.. confidence will happen!
You aren't particularly giving anyone reasons to be confident other than pointing to YOUR spectacular confidence. And I for one, am deeply interested by the amount of confidence you seem to have.

I'd really like to know how you came by that stunning confidence. It seems great.

This is a very interesting conversation, by the way.
Expect questions below.

It looks like you are saying that God's going to take care of everything. Gauleiter88 should maybe just chill out and remember that God does magic miracles. Magic is the miracle cure for every ailment.

____________

Questions:

• 
  1. In post 5, you stated that: "Sex and reproduction are not features of heavenly life since spirits are not sexual beings and do not reproduce."
  
  But that completely contradicts your statement in post 3:
  
  "I repeat, the bible promises eternal life on EARTH. Food, drink, fulfilling work, good health and yes, sex and children will be a feature of this coming paradise on earth."
  
  So, which one is it?
  Sex and kids or no sex and no kids?
  
  2. Do you consider your CONFIDENCE that a problem will be resolved an EXPLANATION of how it will be resolved?
  
  3. Do you consider offering Gauleiter88 your confidence a reason for Gauleiter88 to have it?
  
  4. What reason would Gauleiter88 have to be as confident as you apparently are?
  
  5. Are you depending on your belief that God is omnipotent to resolve Gauleiter88's problems?
  
  6. Have you in any way demonstrated that God can do everything?
  
  7. Are you sure of anything that you profess to believe in?
  
  8. How are you sure, if you are?
  
  9. What assurances can you give Gauleiter88 that JW beliefs have any merit?
  
  10. Are you depending on your beliefs about God's omnipotence to resolve ALL problems?
  
  
  

____________

[JehovahsWitness]

Sex is indeed an occupation of physical humans---there is no sex in heaven. So why do people want to go there?

Lol.. your post did make me smile. Yes I often point out that when I actually ask people to describe what they would like heaven to be, the often end up describing the [paradise] earth... "peace, calm, nobody sick, reunited with my loved ones that have died, no hunger, at one with God and man... " some even believe they'll be animals in heaven!

I understand believer want to go to heaven to see God, and that would be a privilege, but personally, I think that experience would be a bit too much for me, and anyway... I can think of nothing better than this earth, with all its "earthly" pleasures )

[2timothy316]

Sex is indeed an occupation of physical humans---there is no sex in heaven. So why do people want to go there?

Lol.. your post did make me smile. Yes I often point out that when I actually ask people to describe what they would like heaven to be, the often end up describing the [paradise] earth... "peace, calm, nobody sick, reunited with my loved ones that have died, no hunger, at one with God and man... " some even believe they'll be animals in heaven!

I understand believer want to go to heaven to see God, and that would be a privilege, but personally, I think that experience would be a bit too much for me, and anyway... I can think of nothing better than this earth, with all its "earthly" pleasures )

Indeed those with the Heavenly hope are just wired differently. I'm sure they look forward to it as much as I do the paradise Earth. Those that don't understand what a ruler with Jesus means, only wish to go to Heaven just to see God...well, once they've done that, then what? It doesn't take an eternity to see Jehovah, Jesus or Heaven itself. These seem like such small goals. Once I'm in the New Earth I have so many ideas just to start I could write a 1000 page book. Even if were to accomplish all of those things, the Bible says of Jehovah, "Look! These are just the fringes of his ways; Only a faint whisper has been heard of him!" There is no end to the wisdom that God is going to share with mankind.

[catnip]

[Replying to post 17 by catnip]




[center]
God magic: The answer to all questions.
Part One[/center]

While I see that your challenge is to JWs and not to traditional Christians, I think it bears saying that Christ said that in heaven we will be like the angels. IF we were to return to a "new earth" such as JWs believe in, it would be made in the pattern of heaven--thus we would no longer be male and female (reproductive) but like the angels.

Right, no sex or children.
The only children there.. would be the " angels" who died early... Or if they "grow up" in heaven.. none after a few years. Every one would be... old. But without bodies, so that wouldn't matter. People in heaven would grow older and older forever.. and apparently, by god magic.. in perpetual bliss.

Heaven is supposed to be bliss... no idea how.
I suppose that a lot of Christians must believe that being in perpetual proximity to the god would magically do that. Wouldn't that be a little bit boring after the first 10 billion years?

Nothing ever new happening?
Just bliss?

I think that might be even worse than the oblivion of death. At least with death.. no boredom possible.

In any case, I don't think that "angels" are like humans. They might like having nothing to do but "worship". I don't consider that there are many hobbies up there in heaven. Nothing to do... just be "happy" and "blissful" ... "loving".

I very much wonder what these words MEAN without bodies... we FEEL our emotions by way of our bodies. So, we might not have sex, children, or feelings, either.. UNLESS


GOD MAGIC
That would be the answer to everything.

lol
I rather agree with you to an extent--if we are going to be very literal about it.

I think it is more like a holy instant than billions of years . . . but I was trying to deal with the JW point of view.

[onewithhim]

"Evil-doers shall be cut off; but those that wait on Jehovah, they shall possess the land [or, as the margin says: the earth].

"The meek shall possess the earth, and shall delight themselves in the abundance of prosperity.

"The righteous shall inherit the land, and dwell therein for ever." (Psalm 37:9,11,29, Darby)


Why are these scriptures unknown to churches that don't agree with JWs?


"6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid, and the calf and the young lion and the fatted beast together, and a little child shall lead them. 9 They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain; for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of Jehovah, as the waters cover the sea." (Isaiah 11:6,9, Darby)

[catnip]

"Evil-doers shall be cut off; but those that wait on Jehovah, they shall possess the land [or, as the margin says: the earth].

"The meek shall possess the earth, and shall delight themselves in the abundance of prosperity.

"The righteous shall inherit the land, and dwell therein for ever." (Psalm 37:9,11,29, Darby)


Why are these scriptures unknown to churches that don't agree with JWs?


"6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid, and the calf and the young lion and the fatted beast together, and a little child shall lead them. 9 They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain; for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of Jehovah, as the waters cover the sea." (Isaiah 11:6,9, Darby)

We have the scriptures and have studied them ad infinitum. I am sure that nothing has escaped the notice of the greater church. We simply do not read them the way you do.

But then sometimes I have noticed something that you believe and wonder how you could considering what scripture says.

[onewithhim]

"Evil-doers shall be cut off; but those that wait on Jehovah, they shall possess the land [or, as the margin says: the earth].

"The meek shall possess the earth, and shall delight themselves in the abundance of prosperity.

"The righteous shall inherit the land, and dwell therein for ever." (Psalm 37:9,11,29, Darby)


Why are these scriptures unknown to churches that don't agree with JWs?


"6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid, and the calf and the young lion and the fatted beast together, and a little child shall lead them. 9 They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain; for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of Jehovah, as the waters cover the sea." (Isaiah 11:6,9, Darby)

We have the scriptures and have studied them ad infinitum. I am sure that nothing has escaped the notice of the greater church. We simply do not read them the way you do.

But then sometimes I have noticed something that you believe and wonder how you could considering what scripture says.

How do you view the above Scriptures? They are obviously talking about the physical earth---animals, land/earth, etc.

[JehovahsWitness]

we are looking for are reasons to be as confident as you seem to be.

If anyone wants to have full confidence in God, read the bible.

The bible says God is all powerful and all knowing so having the knowledge and the means to foresee any problem and the power to avert it, and having expressed is explicit intention for the earth in this regard (ie that it be filled rather than overpopulation) it is more than reasonable to conclude he will be in complete control and that there is nothing to worry about in this regard.

JW

[JehovahsWitness]

1. In post 5, you stated that: "Sex and reproduction are not features of heavenly life since spirits are not sexual beings and do not reproduce."

But that completely contradicts your statement in post 3:

"I repeat, the bible promises eternal life on EARTH. Food, drink, fulfilling work, good health and yes, sex and children will be a feature of this coming paradise on earth."

So, which one is it?
Sex and kids or no sex and no kids?

Are you having difficulty distinguishing the difference between the English words "heaven"/heavenly and EARTH? Why is that?

The first statement refers to heavenly creatures (in heaven) ie spirits (such as angels)
The second statement refers to EARTH and earthly creatures namely HUMANS.

Could you explain why you see the above as contradictory?

[Blastcat]

[Replying to post 24 by catnip]




[center]Big time news in my book
Part One[/center]

lol
I rather agree with you to an extent--if we are going to be very literal about it.

Say WHAT now?

We agree to something to an extent if we are going to be very literal about it?
Could you elaborate a bit so that I know precisely what I should be celebrating about?