Biggest Problem With Accepting Christianity

[Danmark]

I suggest that one of the major reasons people do not accept Christianity is that Christians do not accept the teachings of Christ.

While many are eager to call homosexuality a sin because they believe Jesus preached that (even tho' it is unclear that he did);
And even tho' many are adamant that husbands should rule over their wives because Paul said so;

Jesus preached very clearly that if you want to be perfect you should sell all you have, give it to the poor, and follow Him. Here is one of the clearest and most unequivocal teachings of Jesus, yet virtually NO Christian even attempts to follow this command.

And behold, a man came up to him, saying, “Teacher, what good deed must I do to have eternal life?�
. . . . “If you would be perfect, go, sell what you possess and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow me.�
Matthew 19:16-21

Most if not all give the same response Jesus heard 2000 years ago:

When the young man heard this he went away sorrowful, for he had great possessions.

How can people call themselves 'Christian' when they fail to follow this central teaching of Jesus?

[Willum]

[Replying to JehovahsWitness]

You don't accept many a common interpretation of the Bible.

Isn't that the assumption of the topic?
Everyone claiming to be Christian only believes the bits they personally find agreeable?

It's like physics, right?
God is more profound than any natural law, right?
So, if you don't believe in gravity, then it is possible to hover in mid-air?

If you don't believe in a verse in the Bible, will that save you from damnation?

Not according to my understanding of your religion.

[JehovahsWitness]

You don't accept many a common interpretation of the Bible.

This is true. I'm one of Jehovah's Witnesses, we think outside the box. Is that a problem?

If you don't believe in a verse in the Bible, will that save you from damnation?

I personally believe in all the verses of the bible, so I have that covered, thanks for your concern though.

JW

[Divine Insight]

[Replying to post 1 by Danmark]

I don't accept your interpretation of the teachings of Christ, so I propose that people can and do call themselves 'Christian' because they successfully follow the central teaching of Jesus?

This is exactly what I am talking about. It's not that they try to follow the teachings of Jesus and fail, it's that they don't even try. When they run into a clear statement of proposed action, they refuse to accept it.

Exactly. No one rejects the teachings of Jesus more than those who simply refuse to acknowledge them by proclaiming they don't even accept words attributed to Jesus in the first place.

[Willum]

[Replying to JehovahsWitness]

Of course it's a problem.
If you (JWs) are only following willie-nilly the bits you believe in, those that are easy, then you are going to Hell with the rest of us sinners.

The truth, in any subject is hard.
Why are your expectations that, only the the things you find easy to believe are the truth?

That the Bible is contemptuous of homosexuals and so on, is exceptionally distasteful to me, but I am free to ignore that. I would find it hard to believe, but if I did believe, I would have to believe that homosexuals are sinners, right?

Someone who says they believe, but doesn't believe the bits that are distasteful or difficult is not realistic in those beliefs.

I mean just grabbing from science: Who would believe that merely by traveling faster your aging slows down? It is hard to believe, but true.

It is very easy for me to believe those conventional parts of the Bible, you find distasteful, assuming any of the book is true, are bits that will keep one from the pearly gates.

[rikuoamero]

[Replying to post 12 by JehovahsWitness]

I personally believe in all the verses of the bible, so I have that covered, thanks for your concern though.

I really don't see how this is possible though. Take for instance Jesus's birth-date.

According to Matthew, Jesus was born during the reign of Herod the Great (Matthew 2:1). According to Luke, Jesus was born during the first census in Israel, while Quirinius was governor of Syria (Luke 2:2). This is impossible because Herod died in March of 4 BC and the census took place in 6 and 7 AD, about 10 years after Herod's death.

It'd be one thing if you had said you believe some verses, and not others...but to say you believe in ALL of them?

[Danmark]

If you were to remove everything that was not reasonable from the Bible there would be little left.

If you were to remove everything that was not reasonable from the Bible would remain entirely as it is. The bible is the most reasonable and logical of books and remains a staple reference for many millions of people for daily living as well because it reflects a reasonable balanced and logical worldview.

These are unfounded assertions capped off with the ad populum fallacy.

The list of unreasonable claims in the Bible is long and undisputed:
7 day creation 6000 years ago
Talking animals
A worldwide flood
Dozens of anti reason, anti science claims that defy physics and history

plus:

An absurd theology that claims God made the Earth and all flesh, called it good, then declared it bad and nearly destroyed all life; then sent himself to tortured in order to save the very people he had earlier destroyed, but for a single family which immediately started sinning as soon as they hit dry ground.

It would be difficult to find a more laughably ridiculous and unreasonable set of beliefs. It is propped up merely by tradition and vanishing popularity.

These things are believed thru faith, not reason; therefore they are unreasonable.

[Danmark]

You don't accept many a common interpretation of the Bible.

This is true. I'm one of Jehovah's Witnesses, we think outside the box. Is that a problem?

No, you certainly do NOT 'think outside the box. You've admitted that yourself with your

I personally believe in all the verses of the bible....

Being restricted by believing "all verses of the bible" puts you squarely 'in the box.'

[JehovahsWitness]

The list of unreasonable claims in the Bible is long and undisputed:

7 day creation [...]
Talking animals
A worldwide flood

These things are believed thru faith, not reason; therefore they are unreasonable.

Firstly, true faith requires both evidence and reason, I do not agree with the false dichotomy of your premise and hence the conclusion you come to that faith is "unreasonable".

What one considers reasonable or not would depend largely on one's worldview. That you consider the above unreasonable, is a matter of opinion (based on your personal beliefs). In actuality, there is nothing in your list that is unreasonable. They are all absolutely logical, plausible and reasonable given what the bible has to say about the explanations for the elements referred to.

The bible contains no claims that defy true history or proven science and your list is demonstratively not "undisputed" since I am here disputing it.


JW


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[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 12 by JehovahsWitness]

I personally believe in all the verses of the bible, so I have that covered, thanks for your concern though.

I really don't see how this is possible though.

I don't believe it is considered good show to question a person's testimony of belief. I said I believe in all the verses of the bible and that is not up for debate.

I really don't see how this is possible though. Take for instance Jesus's birth-date.

No birth date is given in the bible for Jesus. I don't hold to your conclusion regarding Luke's statements; I have written extensively on this topic, fee free to consult an earlier post I wrote on this topic.

Luke 2:2 [Reference to Quirinius]
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 984#781984



JW

[Willum]

[Replying to JehovahsWitness]

Hey Danmark,
I am afraid JW has got you there!

I went out and asked my friend the snake, and he confirmed what JW said:
It really does depend on your experience and worldview. Snake agreed with JW completely.
Then I went to the farm, and asked an associate of mine, donkey, and as much as he hates snake, he agreed with him almost word-for-word!

So, just because you don't see miracles, doesn't mean they didn't happen 2000, 4000, 6000 years ago, that can't be proved and have no historical evidence.

Some folks experience miracles on a daily basis. I mean every year or so in the Enquirer, I see Jesus has returned and brought people back from the dead.

Why be so skeptical?