Does anyone actually believe the story of Noah's Ark?

[Topaz27]

I know a bunch of Christians, and so many of them believe that Noah's Ark is a myth. Basically just a story to teach morals and lessons. I personally see a lot of things wrong with the story of the flood. So I was wondering, if anyone believes the story of Noah's Ark, and the world flood, to be the truth?

[Topaz27]

Jehovah's Witness:
The Bible does in fact tell us where the water comes from. Look at Genesis 7:12. It specifically says that it rains for 40 days and 40 nights.

To measure the amount of water needed for a world flood, isn't too hard. All you need is a basic understanding of the volume of spheres. We know how fast Mt. Everest is "growing" so we can back track to find what the highest point at the time of the flood would be. And it turns out to be basically the height that it's at now.

From there we can calculate the amount of water need to "fill" the Earth, up to that height. We also know the approximate amount of water that the Earth has. The fact is, that there's not enough water on Earth to create a true world flood. We would need, approximately, 3.3 times the amount of water that is currently on Earth. If you want I can give you the exact calculations.

I would also like to know your explanation, of how hundreds of thousands of salt water animals could survive the fresh water environment a downpour of that size would create.

[ttruscott]

So I was wondering, if anyone believes the story of Noah's Ark, and the world flood, to be the truth?

Sure - why not?

[Topaz27]

Jehovah's Witness:
I apologize, I didn't see your second statement. I did account for ice in my calculations. Trenchs of that size require a massive amount of time to form. As in millions of years, at least. Anyways, are you saying that you believe that even more water fell in those 40 days? If so, the questions about marine life still stands. How would they survive the freshwater conditions?

ttruscott:
Well I think there's a lot of things that don't make any sense. Regarding the flood of course. For example, how did all of the animals not die of lack of oxygen? The amount carbon dioxide, and consumption of oxygen, that would be created in that enclosed space, would be deadly.
The amount of water needed for a world flood, as well as the salinity of the water, which would of course impact sea life. Are also great examples of the holes in the story. Which goes to show, that when the story was created, people just didn't understand how the world works. At least not as well as we do now.

[JehovahsWitness]

If the water came from rain, it would heavily dilute the water. Basically making it into fresh water. So how would whales, sharks, sponges, deep sea fish etc. survive?

HOW WOULD SALT WATER CREATURES HAVE SURVIVED THE DESALTIFICATION OF THE OCEANS?

Scientists theorize that seawater wasn't always salty; when the Earth's oceans first formed the oceans were mostly fresh water, ocean life probably adapted as the salt levels increased.

Seawater wasn’t always so salty; when the Earth’s oceans first formed about 3.8 billion years ago, as the surface of the planet cooled enough to allow water vapour to liquify, the oceans were mostly fresh water

source: https://cosmosmagazine.com/chemistry/wh ... sh%20water.
.

NOTE Certain huge fresh water aquifers are estimated to have formed only 15,000 to 20,000 years ago

Further reading : Salt of the Early Earth
https://www.astrobio.net/extreme-life/s ... rly-earth/




JW


PS: Would there have been enough rainwater to keep alive?



1×1m box collect 10 litres
http://www.fao.org/3/r4082e/r4082e05.ht ... 20rainfall

1 day for a modest house at 40 approv 9,000 litres in a day.
https://www.quora.com/What-do-you-mean- ... 2024%20hrs.

* an elephant will drink approx 50 gallons /200 litres as day.

[JehovahsWitness]

Jehovah's Witness:
I apologize, I didn't see your second statement. I did account for ice in my calculations. Trenchs of that size require a massive amount of time to form. As in millions of years, at least. Anyways, are you saying that you believe that even more water fell in those 40 days? If so, the questions about marine life still stands. How would they survive the freshwater conditions?
.

Ok I'll take your word for it (No point in explaining the math to me, I'm a math dummy's dummy). The biblical response is in my post above.
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 807#983807

[Topaz27]

Jehovah's Witness:
Maybe I wasn't clear. How would animals, who can only live at certain salinity levels, live at radically different ones. So how would both fresh water, and salt water animals be able to live in the flooded world at once.

If we just talk about fish here. Yes some fish can live in both fresh and salt water. They are called euryhaline fish, but they are not the majority. Most fish require certain levels of salinity to survive.

The scientists that you're talking about, also believe that oceans are millions of years old. If we're talking about Noah, that's only thousands of years ago.

My question is, how could salt and fresh water creatures survive together?

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 16 by Topaz27]

Just flip the coin, it's possible that the animals that we have now exist as a result of adapting to the the gradually increased levels of salinity. Presumably using the same mechanism they used to develop lungs, grow legs out of fins and crawl out of the oceans to eventually become horses.

[Topaz27]

Jehovah's Witness:
So you believe that the oceans changed from fresh water to salt water in just a few thousand years?

Are you saying that evolution is true?

I also still haven't gotten a full answer to my question about the amount of water needed for a world flood.

Thank you

[JehovahsWitness]

I also still haven't gotten a full answer to my question about the amount of water needed for a world flood.

HOW COULD THE WATERS HAVE COVERED ALL THE MOUNTAINS ?

The New Encyclopedia Britannica says: The average depth of all the seas has been estimated at 3,790 metres (12,430 feet), a figure considerably larger than that of the average elevation of the land above the sea level, which is 840 metres (2,760 feet). If the average depth is multiplied by its respective surface area, the volume of the World Ocean is 11 times the volume of the land above sea level.

• Since the mountains and sea basins rise and fall, it is apparent that at one time the mountains were not as high as they are now and the great sea basins were not as deep. Mountains can be likened to wrinkles in the the earth's crust caused by giant plates of crust pressing against each other. This causes land that once was sea bed to fold upwards and to rise thousands of feet into the air. So, if everything were leveled out—if the mountains were flattened and the deep sea basins filled in—the sea would cover the whole earth to a depth of thousands of meters

For the Flood to have happened, the pre-Flood sea basins would have to have been shallower, and the mountains lower than they are now. Is this possible?

The textbook Planet Earth Glacier states: The movements of the continental plates cause the land both to rear up ...and, at the other extreme, to plunge and lie in hidden splendor deep beneath the surface of the sea.

NOTE The ark is estimated to have been able to carry support a maximum weight of 50 million kilos.
https://physicsworld.com/a/how-much-wei ... k-support/

[JehovahsWitness]

Jehovah's Witness:
So you believe that the oceans changed from fresh water to salt water in just a few thousand years?

Are you saying that evolution is true?

Microevolution* seems to most plausible, animals have an amazing capacity to adapt to their environment.

Microevolution is the change in allele frequencies that occurs over time within a population. This change is due to four different processes: mutation, selection (natural and artificial), gene flow and genetic drift.

As for timescale, my personal view can be summed up by the following quotation.

When science and the Bible differ, science has obviously misinterpreted its data. -- Henry M. Morris