Creationism

Creationism, Evolution, and other science issues

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Chrismyth
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Creationism

Post #1

Post by Chrismyth »

God is "A" and we are "B".
We were Created in God's image. Thus, at least some of B must = A.
The word "image" conjures up "looks like" or "resembles" or "has similar visual features" perhaps the same facial features or body features. Perhaps even genitalia. (God=Him)

Question: Lets assume God created us "as is" and we did not "evolve". When God created us, what features did He endow us with, that He too possesses?

My thoughts appear to stray a bit but they pull together. :confused2:

My thoughts on this #1: Biblical authors were simple minded and really meant "image" as in someone who looks like your grandpa.
It is easy and perhaps natural to project our current, relatively complex, thoughts and understanding of the world onto what were VERY primitive thinkers in Biblical times. Many Creationists fail to place Biblical text into historical context. I saw a perfect example of this last Christmas while watching our local religious channel: I was flipping through the 5 channels we get at my house not paying particularly close attention when I happened upon a scene with a knockout blonde. After drooling over her for a couple of minutes I realized it was the story of Jesus and this was supposed to be Mary! (I probably just created a special place in Hell for myself but I am just being honest) She had perfect teeth, perfect skin, perfect hair, the face of a model and long, beautiful, shaved legs. Joseph and others around her treated her as a social equal. The only difference I saw from our current world was that She just was dressed like a homeless person and there were dirt paths, Gillian's Island-style huts and lots of straw laying about.
I would bet Biblical authors really meant "image" as in "looks like a person" as you see one walking down the street with wrinkles and all. Many contributors to the text also likely envisioned God as male - as in manly man - due to the patriarchal society in which they existed.
The meaning of many biblical words, concepts and ideas are completely different now than when they were written. Even the concept of a personal self was different. Remember, these people knew a tiny fraction of what you currently know about the world. They did not know it was relatively round or that it existed more than a few hundred miles in any direction. They did not know about molecules or atoms or space or what the sun actually was or what caused disease. They could not even be sure whether or not the moon was made of cheese. They certainly did not understand reproduction very well - or much of anything about anatomy. And yes, even the meaning of "virgin" was different. They also knew nothing about the causes of mental disease and thought schizophrenics were either A) Possessed or B) Actually having personal conversations with God. Cultures that you think of as superstitious and primitive today now know as much or more about the real world than any biblical author ever did. Don't believe all this? Read the bible - carefully.
Biblical authors were simple minded and really meant "image" as in someone who looks like your grandpa. And this is silly.

Thoughts #2: Everything that describes you is result of chemistry. Assigning any human characteristics to God (A = B)- which seems to be required if any portion of us were created in his "image" has serious problems and requires you to ignore much of what we now understand about behavior, perception, experience, feeling & emotion, personality and their relationship to brain chemistry and physical brain structure. You MUST believe that AT LEAST ONE these things emanates from a supernatural "soul" created and endowed upon you by God and NOT due to a particular brain chemistry as a result of the evolution of the brain and resulting combination of genetics, diet, trauma and experiences within your environment.
Answer this before moving on: What characteristics define a "good" or "evil" person and thus one that is likely to go to heaven or hell?
Certain kinds of brain trauma can RADICALLY alter personality. Mind altering drugs can alter behavior, perception and even re-wire the brain. The effect of anti-depressants on people can be dramatic. (present company included) They literally alter your brain chemistry and thus your perception of the world, your emotions and thus your behavior and experience, diet etc... If we alter brain structure or chemistry we can create a FUNDAMENTALLY DIFFERENT PERSON with different behavior (kinder/more "evil"), one who makes different choices that lead to different experiences, different emotions, different interactions with people and their environment. What characteristics did you assign to a "soul" above that cannot be altered? If alter a characteristic that is commonly assigned to a good or evil person then how does God determine who will go to heaven or hell? If we don't alter a person and they are "bad" do they go to hell....whereas if we do alter a person so they are now "good" do they go to heaven...or perhaps pergatory?
How does this relate to A=B?
Everything that describes you is result of chemistry. Your perceptions are a result of a very complex interplay of chemistry & electrical signals within a physical structure. All of your emotions are a result of this interplay. We can alter them. This is proven fact. If "who you are" is due to a supernatural soul then it should not be alterable - especially against your "will".
Thus, WHEN WE ASSIGN HUMAN BEHAVIOR & EMOTIONS TO GOD we are also assigning to Him a certain physical brain structure and chemistry. When we say "God is angry" or "God loves you" we are assigning an "image" of God similar to us. We are assigning very physical, very HUMAN, chemical and alterable characteristics to God. Otherwise you must assume God's emotions NOT of a chemical nature. If not, then what is their source? Can experiences "change" (alter) God's "mind"? Physical, outside experiences? If so, then there is a "switch" of some kind that interacts with the physical world that is alterable. If I become "born again" then I am hoping to to alter God's view of me. No? If I am cleansed of my sins then He is choosing to do something based upon my behavior. No? I am, therefore altering God through something I am doing/feeling etc... Which is physical/chemical. Even if you refuse this "we are chemistry argument" and assume we are indeed a supernatural soul you are still effecting change upon God. No? Once again, what is the mechanism that allows God, who has a "mind" to be changed or "altered"?
Or, perhaps God truly knows everything such that he can predict your behavior and thus already knows His mind will be changed next Thursday when you become born again?
BTW: Child physiologists are getting better and better at predicting a child's future including behavior they will display, the decisions they will likely make, the jobs they will hold, whether they will be criminals, the types of relationships they will form and even if they are likely to become abusive. In other words, they are getting pretty darned good at predicting whether a person will display "evil" or "good" characteristics. Can God predict this? If he is all knowing then certainly he can do this better than us. If he is a personal God then certainly he knows about every single child, the environment in which they reside, their brain chemistry etc.. He knows what is going to happen because he created every molecule in their bodies and set up it's structure. He also created every physical rule that governs how their brains operate. But, He chooses to allow the experience to continue - painful or not?
* Assigning any human characteristics to God (A = B)- which seems to be required if any portion of us were created in his "image" has serious problems that require you to ignore much of what we now understand about behavior, perception, experience, feeling & emotion, personality and their relationship to brain chemistry and physical brain structure. *

Have fun with this!
Chris

Leon_Magnus
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Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2005 6:51 pm

Post #11

Post by Leon_Magnus »

Well I guess it's the way we can think about things other animals can't

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