? A Question For All Former Christians Who Fell Away ?

[YahDough]

This is a question addressed only to former Christians who have left the faith.

Why did you become a Christian?
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[YahDough]

Well, before you label people as being "ungodly" I would suggest that you first provide some sort of rational evidence that the term has any meaning.

I don't have to "label" people as ungodly. They know who they are.

Does the "ungodly" include other Christians who "got it wrong"? Other religions such as Islam and Buddhists? How about the Jews? Are they considered ungodly?

Or is it just the atheists?

A little introspection and self-awareness should make it clear how one stands with "God" and whether they are godly or not. A "godly atheist" doesn't sound quite right, but anyone can exhibit virtuous characteristics that might be considered godly, even if they don't believe in God.

While I appreciate the verbal banter, your response doesn't answer my question. Please elaborate what YOU mean by (or consider to be) "ungodly". Thanks!

As I said earlier, "ungodly" covers a lot of territory from thinking to behavior.

The ungodly deny the existence of God and/or live lives that go against God's wishes (SIN).

All sin is ungodly. Do you need a list of what God considers sin?

[Nickman]

The ungodly deny the existence of God and/or live lives that go against God's wishes (SIN).

What are God's wishes? And, has this God ever violated his own "wishes?"

All sin is ungodly. Do you need a list of what God considers sin?

Yes, please provide that list and we will judge your God to see if he follows them.

[YahDough]

The ungodly deny the existence of God and/or live lives that go against God's wishes (SIN).

What are God's wishes?

God "wishes" for us to live in obedience to His word.

And. has this God ever violated his own "wishes?"

Not that I am aware of except maybe when He was sorry He created man or when Moses talked Him out of destroying Israel.

All sin is ungodly. Do you need a list of what God considers sin?

Yes, please provide that list and we will judge your God to see if he follows them.

OK. It started with the "ten commandments" (Exodus 20)

1: And God spake all these words, saying,
2: I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
3: Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
4: Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:
5: Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;
6: And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.
7: Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.
8: Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9: Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10: But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
11: For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
12: Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee.
13: Thou shalt not kill.
14: Thou shalt not commit adultery.
15: Thou shalt not steal.
16: Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.
17: Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's.

And here's a partial list of more specific sins mentioned in the New Testament:

fornication idolatry, adultery, homosex, envy, murder, drunkenness, uncleanness, lasciviousness, witchcraft, hatred, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, and heresies,

And my Lord and God is Christ Jesus. Good luck trying to pin any sin on Him.

Do you try to condemn God in order to justify yourself?

[KenRU]

Well, before you label people as being "ungodly" I would suggest that you first provide some sort of rational evidence that the term has any meaning.

I don't have to "label" people as ungodly. They know who they are.

Does the "ungodly" include other Christians who "got it wrong"? Other religions such as Islam and Buddhists? How about the Jews? Are they considered ungodly?

Or is it just the atheists?

A little introspection and self-awareness should make it clear how one stands with "God" and whether they are godly or not. A "godly atheist" doesn't sound quite right, but anyone can exhibit virtuous characteristics that might be considered godly, even if they don't believe in God.

While I appreciate the verbal banter, your response doesn't answer my question. Please elaborate what YOU mean by (or consider to be) "ungodly". Thanks!

The way I see it is that any term like "godly" can be used like "Mormon" because it carries baggage. "Godly" really has no true definition.

I agree entirely. That was where I was going with my questions, actually. Such a meaningless way to use the word, anyone who doesn't fit within YahDough's perception of what "ungodly" actually means (regardless of what that actually is) would fall into that category. "Ungodly" for YahDough probably could and would be different than what most other people on the planet believe.

Well said!

-all the best,

[KenRU]

Well, before you label people as being "ungodly" I would suggest that you first provide some sort of rational evidence that the term has any meaning.

I don't have to "label" people as ungodly. They know who they are.

Does the "ungodly" include other Christians who "got it wrong"? Other religions such as Islam and Buddhists? How about the Jews? Are they considered ungodly?

Or is it just the atheists?

A little introspection and self-awareness should make it clear how one stands with "God" and whether they are godly or not. A "godly atheist" doesn't sound quite right, but anyone can exhibit virtuous characteristics that might be considered godly, even if they don't believe in God.

While I appreciate the verbal banter, your response doesn't answer my question. Please elaborate what YOU mean by (or consider to be) "ungodly". Thanks!

As I said earlier, "ungodly" covers a lot of territory from thinking to behavior.

The ungodly deny the existence of God and/or live lives that go against God's wishes (SIN).

All sin is ungodly. Do you need a list of what God considers sin?

No, I've been well informed over the years of what they are, thank you. I was just curious as to what you consider to be ungodly.

Ok, so my original question: "Does the "ungodly" include other Christians who "got it wrong"? Other religions such as Islam and Buddhists? How about the Jews? Are they considered ungodly?"

You're response then would be yes, they would all be considered ungodly. Correct?

[YahDough]

Well, before you label people as being "ungodly" I would suggest that you first provide some sort of rational evidence that the term has any meaning.

I don't have to "label" people as ungodly. They know who they are.

Does the "ungodly" include other Christians who "got it wrong"? Other religions such as Islam and Buddhists? How about the Jews? Are they considered ungodly?

Or is it just the atheists?

A little introspection and self-awareness should make it clear how one stands with "God" and whether they are godly or not. A "godly atheist" doesn't sound quite right, but anyone can exhibit virtuous characteristics that might be considered godly, even if they don't believe in God.

While I appreciate the verbal banter, your response doesn't answer my question. Please elaborate what YOU mean by (or consider to be) "ungodly". Thanks!

As I said earlier, "ungodly" covers a lot of territory from thinking to behavior.

The ungodly deny the existence of God and/or live lives that go against God's wishes (SIN).

All sin is ungodly. Do you need a list of what God considers sin?

No, I've been well informed over the years of what they are, thank you. I was just curious as to what you consider to be ungodly.

Ok, so my original question: "Does the "ungodly" include other Christians who "got it wrong"? Other religions such as Islam and Buddhists? How about the Jews? Are they considered ungodly?"

And my original answer. "The ungodly deny the existence of God and/or live lives that go against God's wishes (SIN)"

You're response then would be yes, they would all be considered ungodly. Correct?

No. That is not necessarily correct.

[KenRU]

[Replying to post 245 by YahDough]

"Not necessarily"? Why not be clear then and avoid any confusion?

Are practitioners of other religions and other Christian denominations considered "ungodly"? If so, what differentiates them?

[YahDough]

[Replying to post 245 by YahDough]

"Not necessarily"? Why not be clear then and avoid any confusion?

Are you confused?

Are practitioners of other religions and other Christian denominations considered "ungodly"? If so, what differentiates them?

It depend on what they "practice", Ken. I posted a sin list.

I'm sorry you don't understand what "not necessarily" means. We all may have opinions about other religions and denominations but that does not necessarily mean they are ungodly.

[KenRU]

[Replying to post 245 by YahDough]

"Not necessarily"? Why not be clear then and avoid any confusion?

Are you confused?

By your inability to apply your use of the word "ungodly" to real world examples, yes.

Unless you are admitting to not knowing anything at all about other denominations or religions, then I fail to see why you won't respond in specifics.

Are practitioners of other religions and other Christian denominations considered "ungodly"? If so, what differentiates them?

It depend on what they "practice", Ken. I posted a sin list.

I'm sorry you don't understand what "not necessarily" means. We all may have opinions about other religions and denominations but that does not necessarily mean they are ungodly.

I know what "not necessarily" means. I was asking you to provide an example of a religion or denomination that you consider "ungodly". Your use of "not necessarily" strongly implies that there are some that you do consider "ungodly". Otherwise, why use the phrase in the first place?

The sin list does not answer my question.

Can you give an example of one that would "necessarily" be considered "ungodly" by you (excluding Satanism and devil worship please).

My apologies for being persistent, but I am truly curious.

-All the best

[YahDough]

KenRU Quote:

Are practitioners of other religions and other Christian denominations considered "ungodly"? If so, what differentiates them?

It depend on what they "practice", Ken. I posted a sin list.

I'm sorry you don't understand what "not necessarily" means. We all may have opinions about other religions and denominations but that does not necessarily mean they are ungodly.

I know what "not necessarily" means. I was asking you to provide an example of a religion or denomination that you consider "ungodly".

Most all religions have their own god. If adherents meet the criteria of their particular "god", they could not be considered ungodly. Do you understand? The true ungodly would be those who either have no god, or break the rules of the god they claim to have.

The sin list does not answer my question.

It should. It is the standard for Christian godliness.

My apologies for being persistent,

Annoying is a better word. But thanks anyway. I accept your apology.