Religion in schools

[Insomniac]

***

Yesterday, my english teacher had us write on the question "Do you believe religion should be allowed in schools?". Of course, this got me thinking...

I believe that religion should not be pushed upon students. But, if a religion class is to be taught, it should cover more than just one scope. I remember a few years ago when a pastor came to our school, spoke about God, and handed out those little red bibles to each of us. Now, if a person expressing belief in the worship of Satan had asked to speak at our school, I highly doubt he would have been permitted to. Why? If religion is going to be pushed in school, shouldn't all be covered?

I do think that individuals should be able to express themselves (as in wearing jewelry, shirts, or in verbal expression). But, I doubt that the school system would allow an "I love Satan" shirt to be worn.

Anyways, enough of my ramblings. What are your opinions on this subject?

[Cephus]

You're too late. They are already teaching Satanism in public schools under the guise of secular feminism and gay sexism.

You really are delusional, aren't you?

[QED]

You're too late. They are already teaching Satanism in public schools under the guise of secular feminism and gay sexism.

You really are delusional, aren't you?

Cephus: jcrawford has made a startling claim alright, but seeing as this is a debate forum it would be better for you to challenge the claim rather than reply with an ad hom. Challenging such a ridiculous claim shouldn't take too much effort.. for starters I would like to see jcrawford expand on what he means by "secular feminism". And I would also like him to provide an example of the teaching of "gay sexism".

[The Persnickety Platypus]

You're too late. They are already teaching Satanism in public schools under the guise of secular feminism and gay sexism.

Have you attended a public school in recent memory?

[jcrawford]

You really are delusional, aren't you?

Cephus: jcrawford has made a startling claim alright, but seeing as this is a debate forum it would be better for you to challenge the claim rather than reply with an ad hom.

Quite right, QED. Cephus is deluded himself if he thinks I'm delusional.

I would like to see jcrawford expand on what he means by "secular feminism".

Secular feminism is a political philosophy which maintains that married Christian, Jewish and Muslim men have no reproductive rights in their marriages. Secular feminists discriminate against Christian, Jewish and Muslim men and women by denying them their rights to teach their religion in public schools.

And I would also like him to provide an example of the teaching of "gay sexism".

Gay sexism is the political philosophy that agrees with and supports secular feminism, and also also demands secular marital rights for homosexuals.

[jcrawford]

You're too late. They are already teaching Satanism in public schools under the guise of secular feminism and gay sexism.

Have you attended a public school in recent memory?

No. I haven't attended a public school or an abortion clinic lately. How many 65 year old fathers have? Besides, they won't let me in.

[Cephus]

Cephus: jcrawford has made a startling claim alright, but seeing as this is a debate forum it would be better for you to challenge the claim rather than reply with an ad hom. Challenging such a ridiculous claim shouldn't take too much effort.. for starters I would like to see jcrawford expand on what he means by "secular feminism". And I would also like him to provide an example of the teaching of "gay sexism".

The claim has been soundly challenged, even though it's laughable on the face of it. Of course, just because his nonsense has been disproven doesn't stop him from continuing to make it, and similar ludicrous claims.

After a while, the only thing one can say to the "reality-challenged" is "What color is the sky in your world".

[The Persnickety Platypus]

No. I haven't attended a public school or an abortion clinic lately. How many 65 year old fathers have? Besides, they won't let me in.

Then perhaps you could explain to me how you came upon the knowledge that schools teach "secular feminism" and "gay sexism".

Secular feminism is a political philosophy which maintains that married Christian, Jewish and Muslim men have no reproductive rights in their marriages.

I have never been taught this.

Gay sexism is the political philosophy that agrees with and supports secular feminism, and also also demands secular marital rights for homosexuals.

I have never been taught this.


You are wrong. I can say this with absolute objectivity because, believe it or not, I currently attend a public school.

Schools are politically/religiously neutral. They are required to be. By secular American law.

[Cathar1950]

jcrawford wrote:

You're too late. They are already teaching Satanism in public schools under the guise of secular feminism and gay sexism.

That is just about the biggest load of crap I have heard in a while.
I bet it can't be supported and would turn out to be the most bias bs ever foisted on the reading public.

Secular feminism is a political philosophy which maintains that married Christian, Jewish and Muslim men have no reproductive rights in their marriages.

The truth of the power structure supported by these so called men promotes both spouse and child abuse. All of these religions in wich I have my roots in are notorious for treating women and children like disposable property.

Gay sexism is the political philosophy that agrees with and supports secular feminism, and also also demands secular marital rights for homosexuals.

The problem is in the USA many women are afraid to speak out against the injustice for fear of being call feminist by controlling fearful tiny little powerless men using religion to maintain domination .This stuff needs to be put on a comedy site or program.

[Cephus]

Then perhaps you could explain to me how you came upon the knowledge that schools teach "secular feminism" and "gay sexism".

The voices in his head told him, of course.

[Joe]

Could, or should religion be taught in schools? In my opinion religion is a subject that exists to some extent in every society and deserves mention in an educational system. Religion has in many ways shaped the world in which we exist, sometimes in good ways and often in bad. One must first recognize that religion is a belief system, based on thought alone. Therefore religion would not fit well in a science class, but would more so be applicable in a philosophy class. I suggest this as religion is a subject which can be perpetually debated. No conclusive proofs can be made from any proposed theories. Science on the other hand allows for theories to develop and be more or less acceptable as proofs can often be shown in support of them. Not to say science is an exacting subject as even scientific theories can and often are found to be wrong, but in most cases they are close enough to be useful. A simple example is in mathematics we use the constant known as pi, which we define in most cases to be equal to 3.14 or more accurately 3.141592..., and although we know that to be only an approximation of pi, it suffices to be useful in many important calculations. The answers determined by using pi in a calculation are known not to be exact answers, but are accurate enough to be useful. Many numbers are used as constants in performing important calculations, and known to be only approximations as they are of infinite fractional length and have no exact value. Although this is true there is no debate over what the value of pi should be, and it is accepted by everyone. A science class produces many questions, which can be debated. This leads to theories being produced, and for a theory to continue to exist it must possess some supporting evidence or facts which will sustain it's debate. Many tests are applied to a theory in attempt to further prove or disprove its accuracy before it is either accepted as fact or proven to be wrong. A theory can become accepted as fact if no means of disproving can be found, but that does not mean it is absolutely correct and only means that it has survived all the tests we are currently capable of applying to it. As knowledge progresses we may find that we can determine cases in which the theory does not work and determine the reasons and as a result refine the theory. Science is an evolving area of knowledge which has made great leaps in recent history and continues to be refined with new discoveries.

Religion is a subject that has evolved over many centuries, and most likely began with the beginning of intelligent life. A life form which can question would most certainly begin to question its own existence and the surrounding objects it encountered. Life and death would present many questions, and many things would have no immediate answers. Intelligence provides the ability to reason and produce objects of use, initially they would have been simple objects but would have built a sense that intelligence allows creation. This might have been the seed that produced religion in its earliest form. All that existed would have to have been the result of an intelligent source having created it. For many centuries humans had attributed the acts of nature to be the acts of Gods, ignoring that within nature laws exist that were producing events with no involvement of an intelligent source such as a God who was producing events as a response to that Gods displeasure with the activities of the humans being affected. Things such as plagues, floods, droughts, earthquakes, volcanic eruptions and many other events had in the past been attributed to have been acts created by Gods, and even in more recent history including the bible such events of nature have been attributed to the single God which most religions today worship.

As religion has been a basic component of most societies and embedded in their cultures from the beginning it has become difficult to eliminate from societies beliefs. Throughout history, from ancient to modern, humans have warred with one another based often on religious beliefs, and atrocities have been committed in the name of religion and continue to be even today. Religion, being no more than a belief system, should in reality be something that belongs to the individual and not the society as a whole. Organized religion is a means of perpetuating ones beliefs by imposing such beliefs on others. Is there a true religion that is correct and should be followed by everyone? No one can answer that question, and as such no one religion should be considered above another. Should a God or Gods truly exist then the laws of that God or Gods and their punishments should be controlled only by that God or Gods, and not by humans. What right has one religion to impose its belief over another? The written texts of each religion have been produced by the cultures that support them and as such are not necessarily products of the God(s) they worship, but interpretations of what those cultures believe.

Getting back to the education system, schools are failing in many ways in the modern age. What a school is, or as I feel should be, is a place where one goes to learn the basics, the three R's as once stated. School should teach primarily how to learn, where to gather material, and how to evaluate the accuracy of that material. I often laugh when I think about a question once posed in school about why we need to learn about history, memorizing dates and events which happened long ago. I was told that it's important to learn about the past so we won't make the same mistakes twice. If such were true, would we be having wars today? or does it mean that we need to emphasize teaching history more in the warring areas of the world? But even the most literate countries of the world are often involved in wars so it would appear that history teaches us little.

So in closing I would state that we should present in schools all subjects of importance, not trying to embed an absolute belief of certainty in any of the things being taught, but instead producing an enticement to study on ones own to find the most accurate answers. If one is taught that pi equals 3.14, they might later in life have to cope with why they encounter errors in calculations that require a more accurate representation of pi. In todays world much knowledge exists, in comparison to the beginning of intelligent life, or even just the most recent past 100 years, to the present, but it still is very little in comparison to the extent of total knowledge which we only creep toward.

So where does religion fit into the education system? It might find mention in a history class as many events in history have been associated to a great degree with religious beliefs at the time which produced the historical event being studied. In a philosophy class most certainly as it is a subject that began from a philosophical point of view. But one must be careful in bringing religion into classrooms as a subject as by doing so would demand that all information relating to the development of religion would also have to be allowed, much of which would be damaging to its survival. The careful study of Genesis alone might be enlightening.