I am disgusted by the rejoicing of one slain last night

[salvation2011]

I woke this morning to find the headline on the paper "Osama Bin Laden is Dead" in huge letters... like it is some sort of accomplishment to kill someone. Everyone seems to be taking pride in this on the news as well. I am disappointed at anyone being happy about the death of another. I feel like apologizing on behalf of all people who are celebrating this in the name of our country. May God have mercy on those who live in the US who are not rejoicing at this.

[LiamOS]

Indeed, I find such a reaction from a 'Christian' nation to be somewhat amusing to my strange sense of humour.

[fewwillfindit]

Indeed, I find such a reaction from a 'Christian' nation to be somewhat amusing to my strange sense of humour.

I must have missed the video footage of Christians celebrating his death. Do you have any links? Footage of church services would be even more convincing.

[Kuan]

First define rejoicing.

Am I happy he is dead, yes. Am I happy we had to kill him? No.

[LiamOS]

I've not seen any celebration of his death with those celebrating actively making a point that they're Christian, and nor did I claim to. However, taking into account that over 75% of the population identifies themselves as Christian, it's pretty hard to fathom that those rejoicing in his death are not predominantly Christians.

I'm not saying this reflects on Christianity, but it sure reflects on those 'Christians' taking part in the celebration.

[fewwillfindit]

Indeed, I find such a reaction from a 'Christian' nation to be somewhat amusing to my strange sense of humour.

I must have missed the video footage of Christians celebrating his death. Do you have any links? Footage of church services would be even more convincing.

I've not seen any celebration of his death with those celebrating actively making a point that they're Christian, and nor did I claim to. However, taking into account that over 75% of the population identifies themselves as Christian, it's pretty hard to fathom that those rejoicing in his death are not predominantly Christians.

I'm not saying this reflects on Christianity, but it sure reflects on those 'Christians' taking part in the celebration.

If your intention was not to show that this reflects on Christianity, then why specifically mention 'Christian' nation, especially in quotes so as to draw attention to it? If that was not your intention, why mention 'Christian' at all?

Sorry, but I am not following the logic here.

[LiamOS]

In this post, I use the word Christian to mean somebody who accepts Jesus' teachings and consciously attempts to follow them, while also accepting that which is outlined in the New Testament to be authoritative with respect to living one's life.

If your intention was not to show that this reflects on Christianity, then why specifically mention 'Christian' nation [...]

Because the U.S.A. is a predominantly Christian nation according to the people themselves, and a number of American Christians would claim that it is a Christian nation.
Why wouldn't I mention it?

[...] especially in quotes so as to draw attention to it?

If I had wanted to draw attention to it, I would've formatted the text.
The purpose of the apostrophes was to allude to the fact that these people clearly don't follow New-Testament-based Christian teachings, and that it could be argued that they are not in fact Christians, depending on ones definition. (I wouldn't actually argue it, but I've seen people make this argument many times on this board when presented by others with instances in which supposed Christian theology and dogma are used to support human rights violations. In my experience, it's also something of a consensus among Christians that you can't really be a Christian if you're ignorant of what Christianity is.)

If that was not your intention, why mention 'Christian' at all?

It wouldn't be hypocritical if they weren't claiming to be Christians.
If an Atheist was rejoicing at Bin Laden's death, I'd think it a little odd, but certainly not hypocritical.
When somebody claiming to be a Christian rejoices in somebody's death in blatant contradiction with some key Christian concepts and teachings of Jesus, I think that quite hypocritical.

Sorry, but I am not following the logic here.

Clearly.
I dare say that you expected a much more malicious meaning, and I assure you that I will not make such hilariously flawed arguments as that which you initially perceived my post to be.
I wasn't even really aiming to make much of a point other than people need to think, and I was making that point quite implicitly.

[fewwillfindit]

In this post, I use the word Christian to mean somebody who accepts Jesus' teachings and consciously attempts to follow them, while also accepting that which is outlined in the New Testament to be authoritative with respect to living one's life.

No True Scotsman Fallacy

If your intention was not to show that this reflects on Christianity, then why specifically mention 'Christian' nation [...]

Because the U.S.A. is a predominantly Christian nation according to the people themselves, and a number of American Christians would claim that it is a Christian nation.
Why wouldn't I mention it?

You wouldn't mention it if it were another group. For instance, let's pretend that you had posted something akin to the following:

Almost as if by an act of God, last night an F5 tornado ripped a mile-wide swath of destruction through 'black' Alabama.

When confronted, you back-pedaled and said that you did not intend for your statement to reflect on blacks. I am fairly certain we would all clearly understand your intent.

[...] especially in quotes so as to draw attention to it?

If I had wanted to draw attention to it, I would've formatted the text.
The purpose of the apostrophes was to allude to the fact that these people clearly don't follow New-Testament-based Christian teachings, and that it could be argued that they are not in fact Christians, depending on ones definition. (I wouldn't actually argue it, but I've seen people make this argument many times on this board when presented by others with instances in which supposed Christian theology and dogma are used to support human rights violations. In my experience, it's also something of a consensus among Christians that you can't really be a Christian if you're ignorant of what Christianity is.)

No True Scotsman Fallacy

If that was not your intention, why mention 'Christian' at all?

It wouldn't be hypocritical if they weren't claiming to be Christians.
If an Atheist was rejoicing at Bin Laden's death, I'd think it a little odd, but certainly not hypocritical.
When somebody claiming to be a Christian rejoices in somebody's death in blatant contradiction with some key Christian concepts and teachings of Jesus, I think that quite hypocritical.

I see. So then you were, in fact, using this event to cast aspersion on Christians.

Sorry, but I am not following the logic here.

Clearly.
I dare say that you expected a much more malicious meaning, and I assure you that I will not make such hilariously flawed arguments as that which you initially perceived my post to be.
I wasn't even really aiming to make much of a point other than people need to think, and I was making that point quite implicitly.

That remains to be seen.

[lastcallhall]

I woke this morning to find the headline on the paper "Osama Bin Laden is Dead" in huge letters... like it is some sort of accomplishment to kill someone. Everyone seems to be taking pride in this on the news as well. I am disappointed at anyone being happy about the death of another. I feel like apologizing on behalf of all people who are celebrating this in the name of our country. May God have mercy on those who live in the US who are not rejoicing at this.

Did you loose someone on September 11th? Either way how can you judge a reaction from someone when a mass murder was punished for his crimes? He struck terror and brought death to thousands of americans and I for one am not running in the streets for joy but I will not judge those who are. Am I glad he is dead, yes. Was it a just punishment, yes. This is not a christian/muslim,atheist thing or even a left/right issue it is an American issue and he brought the war to us. Do you condem those that celebrated in times square after WWII? Bottom line justice prevailed last night and an evil man met him maker last night.

[LiamOS]

For the sake of making this discussion much easier, please provide a definition of what a Christian is. We don't have to debate this, but it'll make my life much, much easier.

In this post, I use the word Christian to mean somebody who accepts Jesus' teachings and consciously attempts to follow them, while also accepting that which is outlined in the New Testament to be authoritative with respect to living one's life.

No True Scotsman Fallacy

No, I was clarifying what type of person I would be referring to when using the term.
This does not constitute a No True Scotsman fallacy.

If your intention was not to show that this reflects on Christianity, then why specifically mention 'Christian' nation [...]

Because the U.S.A. is a predominantly Christian nation according to the people themselves, and a number of American Christians would claim that it is a Christian nation.
Why wouldn't I mention it?

You wouldn't mention it if it were another group. For instance, let's pretend that you had posted something akin to the following:

Almost as if by an act of God, last night an F5 tornado ripped a mile-wide swath of destruction through 'black' Alabama.

When confronted, you back-pedaled and said that you did not intend for your statement to reflect on blacks. I am fairly certain we would all clearly understand your intent.

Your example does not seem relevant; being black has nothing to do with one's worldview, and neither does being from Alabama(Other than the statistical distribution if you consider it in such a manner.)

Could you clarify what you interpret me as saying and then clarify your point?

If I had wanted to draw attention to it, I would've formatted the text.
The purpose of the apostrophes was to allude to the fact that these people clearly don't follow New-Testament-based Christian teachings, and that it could be argued that they are not in fact Christians, depending on ones definition. (I wouldn't actually argue it, but I've seen people make this argument many times on this board when presented by others with instances in which supposed Christian theology and dogma are used to support human rights violations. In my experience, it's also something of a consensus among Christians that you can't really be a Christian if you're ignorant of what Christianity is.)

No True Scotsman Fallacy

Notice that I didn't actually make the argument.
Further, I explicitly stated that this was subject to ones definition of Christianity, which is obviously the case with a rigorous definition.

I see. So then you were, in fact, using this event to cast aspersion on Christians.

No.

It just so happens that some people are Christians and don't think about what they believe in at all, resulting in hypocrisy. As I've previously stated, any Atheist could be equally ignorant without necessarily being hypocritical in the same situation due to the worldview they claim to adhere to.








Allow me to make plain what I was saying, alluding to or inferring:
First, to circumvent the necessity for some definition of a Christian, I will make the following case:
Earlier the Vatican made the statement: "Faced with the death of a man, a Christian never rejoices [...]"(Arguably a No True Scotsman, but I'm not going to defend this statement.)
To me this would infer that at least a significant portion of Christians would be of the same doctrine.

Hopefully you agree that my assessment of this is correct.
Now:
-Many who call themselves Christians are celebrating the death of a man.
-This can be due to either a stance on life and death different to that held by Roman Catholic Church(And likely other Christian institutions; I'll admit I wouldn't really know the specifics of others.) or due to ignorance of one's own position.
-Statistically it is almost certain that notable number of Christians are doing so out of ignorance, being hypocritical.
-I find that funny in a strange sense.