Why do you believe in Creationism or Evolution?
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Why do you believe in Creationism or Evolution?
Post #1so why do u believe in evolution or creationism???
Post #2
Why are they mutually exclusive? I believe in aspects of both, and reject aspects of both as well. Creationism...are we talking about the popular evangelical 6,000y/o Earth ect, or the very concept of intelligent design? In evolution is it macro or micro? The question is rather vague.so why do u believe in evolution or creationism???
I believe Intelligent design set the process in motion. As far as I can tell evolution can't be ruled out as a valid scientific theory regarding the development of species. I can not, with equal weight, rule out some of the theorys modern creationists hold either. I believe in a splendid mix of both that really bothers absolutists on either side.
Why do I believe this? Because I am quite sure of the existance of a creator, through reason and an intrinsic desire for something higher than myself. I'm just not sure of the details surrounding the 'creation'.
Last edited by Travis on Tue May 25, 2004 2:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
What is the first business of one who practices philosophy? To get rid of self-conceit. For it is impossible for anyone to begin to learn that which he thinks he already knows.
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Post #4
exactly!! its proposterious to think that evolution is truth. and if you believe in a creator(God) and read the bible is clearly says that he created the heavens earth and all the other things inbetween, so that rules you out. evolution even goes against other scientific theroys. like the cell theory for example
The Cell Theory states that all cells are made from existing cells and that all living creatures are made from cells
hence forth i ask the question where did the first cell come from?
and humans are so advanced they are so complex how did they come from one cell that was simple? and if there is evolution why are there still monkeys and why havent humans evolved to an even better species?
The Cell Theory states that all cells are made from existing cells and that all living creatures are made from cells
hence forth i ask the question where did the first cell come from?
and humans are so advanced they are so complex how did they come from one cell that was simple? and if there is evolution why are there still monkeys and why havent humans evolved to an even better species?
Post #5
There are certainly a lot of christians who would disagree with you.exactly!! its proposterious to think that evolution is truth.
Ok lets assume that the bible is the infallible word of god. What is written there, is what happened, period. Genesis does not state the means with which god created our physical world. How can you absolutely write off evolution?and if you believe in a creator(God) and read the bible is clearly says that he created the heavens earth and all the other things inbetween, so that rules you out.
Either the first cell was created by god, or through random chance. The chemicals arranged themselves just right and thus it happened. I think it was designed to do that though....The Cell Theory states that all cells are made from existing cells and that all living creatures are made from cells
hence forth i ask the question where did the first cell come from?
Who says we came from one cell?and humans are so advanced they are so complex how did they come from one cell that was simple?
Mostly because we haven't ate them all yet...and if there is evolution why are there still monkeys and why havent humans evolved to an even better species?
We seem to be evolving into a better species in my view. How much further can we evolve? We completely rule over and manipulate our environment now...What is the first business of one who practices philosophy? To get rid of self-conceit. For it is impossible for anyone to begin to learn that which he thinks he already knows.
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Post #6
If you could create new topics on each of the points addressed here (Cell Theory, Spontaneous Generation, Abiogenesis, Complexity, "Why humans aren't better than we currently are" and "why monkeys still exist") I will be sure to address them. As it stands, it appears that this topic is heading down the same path as the 10 page topic on C vs E that was closed down due to being so open and general.emmy27sf wrote:exactly!! its proposterious to think that evolution is truth. and if you believe in a creator(God) and read the bible is clearly says that he created the heavens earth and all the other things inbetween, so that rules you out. evolution even goes against other scientific theroys. like the cell theory for example
The Cell Theory states that all cells are made from existing cells and that all living creatures are made from cells
hence forth i ask the question where did the first cell come from?
and humans are so advanced they are so complex how did they come from one cell that was simple? and if there is evolution why are there still monkeys and why havent humans evolved to an even better species?
Also understand that evolution is not abiogenesis (spontaneous generation). Evolution is about the process of life, not its origins. Of course, every process has its origins, so it is a related subject.
As for the question of this particular topic, which is more of a discussion thread than one that can be debated, I will say that the evidence is overwhelming to me that evolution is the most likely of the two. Depending on future discoveries, that opinion can change ... or evolve, so to speak.
<i>'Beauty is truth, truth beauty,—that is all
Ye know on earth, and all ye need to know.'</i>
-John Keats, Ode on a Grecian Urn.
Ye know on earth, and all ye need to know.'</i>
-John Keats, Ode on a Grecian Urn.
Post #7
I dont like to use the term "believe in", but for parallelism purposes I'll go with it...
I believe in evolution.
One of the things I find interesting is the False Dichotomy which many people seem to fall for: They believe either Creationism accurately describes diversity of life, or they believe Evolution accurately describes diversity of life. In reality, Evolution would occur regardless of whether there exists a creator or not. The reason: Evolution is painfully simple to understand, the engine behind Evolution is selective pressures of environments. Even if all the animals were created by a god, as long as there are selective pressures (which I would imagine are the result of animals living off of their environment), Natural Selection occurs and evolution takes place.
Creationism on the other hand...
It doesnt make any predictions, descriptions, testable or falsifyable claims. I doubt Creationism serves much intellectual usefulness (nor does Intelligent Design, which is Creationism by another name). As the universe appears to be the product of purely natural forces, where everything which exists and occurs can be explained in terms of matter and natural phenomena, I very much doubt Creationism is an accurate model describe anything which occurs in the universe. At best, it serves the purpose of "providing at least some kind of explanation", which translates into a renaming of ignorance by the title of "Creator" (which in itself accomplishes exactly nothing).
I would imagine if there were anything of truth to glean from Creationism, it would be unimaginably easy to demonstrate in the lab. Currently, there exists an absolutely overwhelming amount of evidence in favor of evolution, in fact I would go as far to say it is probably the most strongly supported theory in all of science.
Why there is still "debate" between Evolution and Creationism, I dont know. The "debate" does not exist in any academic institutions. Now, either there is an evil athiest conspiracy to play a horrible trick on the world, or that absence of debate serves as a real life representation where intellectual development (and to a large extent moral development) evolves as stages consisting of Theological Interpretation, to Metaphysical Interpretation, to Positivistic Interpretation. That is not really surprising, and I'm not the first to express that same attitude.
I believe in evolution.
One of the things I find interesting is the False Dichotomy which many people seem to fall for: They believe either Creationism accurately describes diversity of life, or they believe Evolution accurately describes diversity of life. In reality, Evolution would occur regardless of whether there exists a creator or not. The reason: Evolution is painfully simple to understand, the engine behind Evolution is selective pressures of environments. Even if all the animals were created by a god, as long as there are selective pressures (which I would imagine are the result of animals living off of their environment), Natural Selection occurs and evolution takes place.
Creationism on the other hand...
It doesnt make any predictions, descriptions, testable or falsifyable claims. I doubt Creationism serves much intellectual usefulness (nor does Intelligent Design, which is Creationism by another name). As the universe appears to be the product of purely natural forces, where everything which exists and occurs can be explained in terms of matter and natural phenomena, I very much doubt Creationism is an accurate model describe anything which occurs in the universe. At best, it serves the purpose of "providing at least some kind of explanation", which translates into a renaming of ignorance by the title of "Creator" (which in itself accomplishes exactly nothing).
I would imagine if there were anything of truth to glean from Creationism, it would be unimaginably easy to demonstrate in the lab. Currently, there exists an absolutely overwhelming amount of evidence in favor of evolution, in fact I would go as far to say it is probably the most strongly supported theory in all of science.
Why there is still "debate" between Evolution and Creationism, I dont know. The "debate" does not exist in any academic institutions. Now, either there is an evil athiest conspiracy to play a horrible trick on the world, or that absence of debate serves as a real life representation where intellectual development (and to a large extent moral development) evolves as stages consisting of Theological Interpretation, to Metaphysical Interpretation, to Positivistic Interpretation. That is not really surprising, and I'm not the first to express that same attitude.
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NuclearTBag
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Evoulotion just makes sense.
Post #8A while ago, a guy by the name of Charles Darwin went on a trip, and studied animals, Darwin came up with the conclusion that species change over time, aka evoloution. Where as creationism, says that a cloud man, created everything in under a week. After the cloud man created everything, he needed a nap, he is all powerfull, but The Pacific really took a lot out of him.
Re: Evoulotion just makes sense.
Post #9That's you're reason for believing in evolution? Seems quite pathetic to me.NuclearTBag wrote:A while ago, a guy by the name of Charles Darwin went on a trip, and studied animals, Darwin came up with the conclusion that species change over time, aka evoloution. Where as creationism, says that a cloud man, created everything in under a week. After the cloud man created everything, he needed a nap, he is all powerfull, but The Pacific really took a lot out of him.
So from Jerusalem all the way around to Illyricum, I have fully proclaimed the gospel of Christ.
Romans 15:19
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Post #10
I agree with previous comments to the effect that we need to stop thinking of an 'either/or' solution to the riddle.
Ilyricum wrote:
I think a lot of people have difficulty with evolution because of the mind-boggling expanses of time. I have a hard time remembering what I looked like 10 years ago - it is downright impossible to imagine what the earth looked like 50 million years ago. We like stories to have a beginning, a middle, and an end - but unfortunately, evolution doesn't work that way. Evolution is an extreeeeemly slow, extreeeemly long-range process.
But please, creationists, remember this: the Theory of Evolution was not developed for the purpose of disproving the Bible. It was developed in order to provide a comprehensive explanation for observable facts. It bears comparison to the theory of a heliocentric solar system, which ruffled the church 400 years ago. But the advancement of scientific knowledge should not be a threat to anyone's faith - unless they posit a god who lives in a patently absurd world. I could feel sorry for a devout believer in Thor and his daily ride in a golden chariot - he would have to either abandon his faith, or turn his back on science.
But in Christianity, there need not be such a dilemma. There is a middle path, which accepts the following:
1. Evolution has not yet explained "everything". This does not make it false.
2. Evolution makes predictions that have not yet been observed, or at least, observed well. This means only that we do not yet know everything. It is also a symptom of living in a teeny tiny slice of History.
3. The "meat" of the Bible is in its descriptions of God's relationship with Her followers. A science textbook, it is not.
4. The wisdom of Jesus' teachings does not depend upon the age of the earth.
As a result, I see no inherent conflict between Evolution, and faith in an eternal Principle which may, after all, have created evolution as a way of giving us a functioning world to live in.
Ilyricum wrote:
Well, you can whack me with the same stick if you want, but the Theory of evolution is based on observed data, makes testable predictions, and is subject to peer-review scrutiny under the guidelines of the scientific method - none of which apply to a literal reading of Genesis.That's you're reason for believing in evolution? Seems quite pathetic to me.
I think a lot of people have difficulty with evolution because of the mind-boggling expanses of time. I have a hard time remembering what I looked like 10 years ago - it is downright impossible to imagine what the earth looked like 50 million years ago. We like stories to have a beginning, a middle, and an end - but unfortunately, evolution doesn't work that way. Evolution is an extreeeeemly slow, extreeeemly long-range process.
But please, creationists, remember this: the Theory of Evolution was not developed for the purpose of disproving the Bible. It was developed in order to provide a comprehensive explanation for observable facts. It bears comparison to the theory of a heliocentric solar system, which ruffled the church 400 years ago. But the advancement of scientific knowledge should not be a threat to anyone's faith - unless they posit a god who lives in a patently absurd world. I could feel sorry for a devout believer in Thor and his daily ride in a golden chariot - he would have to either abandon his faith, or turn his back on science.
But in Christianity, there need not be such a dilemma. There is a middle path, which accepts the following:
1. Evolution has not yet explained "everything". This does not make it false.
2. Evolution makes predictions that have not yet been observed, or at least, observed well. This means only that we do not yet know everything. It is also a symptom of living in a teeny tiny slice of History.
3. The "meat" of the Bible is in its descriptions of God's relationship with Her followers. A science textbook, it is not.
4. The wisdom of Jesus' teachings does not depend upon the age of the earth.
As a result, I see no inherent conflict between Evolution, and faith in an eternal Principle which may, after all, have created evolution as a way of giving us a functioning world to live in.
"When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a communist."
