Question for Christians ...

[McCulloch]

I would like someone to recommend to me a really good book of Christian Apologetics. Surely someone can do better than Josh McDowell's Evidence Demands A Verdict.

[unicorn]

Did you really read that entire book!
What are you looking for?

[McCulloch]

Did you really read that entire book!
What are you looking for?

Yes. I was looking for a book with fewer blatant logical fallacies. Surely there must be something with a bit more rigor and with a bit more scholarly approach.

[unicorn]

Okay. So I guess I shouldn't bother reading my copy? Let me know what you end up finding!

[v_octane]

i recommend the Bible.

as for defending Christianity and its theology, the truth defends itself. God doesn't really require anybody to try to defend Him or His Word. you just have to refer to the truth, His Word, and that will be all that you need to keep your faith growing in Him. other peoples ideas of how to defend Christianity are only their own reasonings, and if some other person who is non-Christian finds a fault in them, then this person's view on Christianity will be totally negative. if you use the Bible as your foundation instead of your own logic, your words will never have fault.

i'm not saying that the Bible is totally illogical, but i am saying that man's logic is not always trustworthy.

but this is only my opinion.

may God bless you...

[Vladd44]

It is a bit difficult to depend on truth from a series of books that have so many obvious errors.

[McCulloch]

i recommend the Bible.

...

may God bless you...

Thanks for the suggestion. I have studied the Bible. All of it.

It was a bit weak in the area of apologetics. There is very little in it about why one should believe in a supernatural God or why one should believe that this particular collection of books is the revelation from that supernatural God. The writers seem to assume that the reader believes in a God.

[v_octane]

sorry for not understanding, but what series of books were you talking about vladd44, the Bible or Evidence Demands A Verdict and maybe a series of this book? the quote you posted with God in brackets, i don't understand that one either. i think Apostle Paul is the one speaking there, please reply, just curious. are you slavic by the way, cause i know i guy named vlad and he is. thanks.

to McCulloh, i'm not trying to argue but state my understandings: if God of the Bible really is who he is and everything that is stated in the Bible is true, then that gives enough reason for one to believe in Him and do what he says. as for proving God, Romans 1:19-21 states that God's attributes could be seen from the things He has made, but some people choose to ignore and deny it with every effort. to trust the Bible is not easy and sometimes i seem to see contradictions, but later realize that i was wrong and the Bible still stands. more than 40 authors of all the books in the Bible delivering the same message, i see a lot of interesting things in this.

but some of what i said are my understandings and i could be wrong. this is the way i see things, let me know what you think.

anywho,

thank you and peace out...

[McCulloch]

sorry for not understanding, but what series of books were you talking about vladd44, the Bible or Evidence Demands A Verdict and maybe a series of this book? the quote you posted with God in brackets, i don't understand that one either. i think Apostle Paul is the one speaking there, please reply, just curious. are you slavic by the way, cause i know i guy named vlad and he is. thanks.

I think that Vladd was speaking of the Bible as the series of books.

to McCulloh, i'm not trying to argue but state my understandings: if God of the Bible really is who he is and everything that is stated in the Bible is true, then that gives enough reason for one to believe in Him and do what he says.

Yes, but since I don't believe that the God described in the Bible even exists. The Bible itself is rather poor at convincing me that he exists.

as for proving God, Romans 1:19-21 states that God's attributes could be seen from the things He has made, but some people choose to ignore and deny it with every effort.

If I were to accept the argument made in Romans 1 regarding the existence of God, that would still only lead me to the point of being a deist. There is still a long way from believing in a creator and believing in the rather twisted God of the Christians. By twisted, I mean that the Christian concept of God tends to twist any form of consistent logic. Trinity, the problem of evil, God's redemptive sacrifice to himself, inept design etc.

to trust the Bible is not easy and sometimes i seem to see contradictions, but later realize that i was wrong and the Bible still stands. more than 40 authors of all the books in the Bible delivering the same message, i see a lot of interesting things in this.

They only deliver the same message if you have an a priori expectation that they deliver the same message. Theology is full of very strange ways of harmonizing the messages of the Bible.

i recommend the Bible.
as for defending Christianity and its theology, the truth defends itself. God doesn't really require anybody to try to defend Him or His Word. you just have to refer to the truth, His Word, and that will be all that you need to keep your faith growing in Him.

I once knew a theology student who really believed that. Whenever he was given a chance to preach, he would only do a directed reading of the Bible. He would select passages of scripture, all related to the topic of choice and link them together in a coherent fashion with as few of his own words as possible. Guess what? He could not hold an audience. Would you go to his church? Does the preacher/minister/priest in your church preach only the Bible? I doubt it. I'll bet he adds quite a few words of illustration, example and explanation. Apparently God does need someone to defend his word.

... and peace be to you.

[Bugmaster]

I would like someone to recommend to me a really good book of Christian Apologetics. Surely someone can do better than Josh McDowell's Evidence Demands A Verdict.

I would personally recommend C.S.Lewis's The Screwtape Letters and, of course, The Chronicles of Narnia.

As far as I can tell, The Screwtape Letters is one big apologetics argument; in the book, C.S.Lewis goes as far as saying that atheism is irrational, and that Christianity is logically justified. He then proceeds to make his case. In the end, it's less than persuasive (seeing as I'm still an atheist, heh), but he really comes through as an honest, thinking individual, which is more than I can say for most apologetics.

Narnia takes a different approach, and attempts to involve the leader emotionally. It doesn't try to prove to you that Christianity is true; rather, it tries to make you experience what it's like to be Christian. There's this great moment in the book, which, inexplicably, didn't make it into the recent movie.

WARNING: SPOILERS AHEAD.
WARNING: SPOILERS AHEAD.
YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.

Lucy, the youngest child, goes through the eponymous wardobe to Narnia, but she has no evidence and no witnesses of this -- and Edmund is openly speaking out against her. The elder kids (Peter and Susan) tell her to stop pretending, and she gets very upset... eventually the elder kids sit down and talk with the Professor about it. He tells them that, since they are a family and they clearly love their sister, they should trust what she says. During the course conversation, you can plainly feel that Susan and Peter already know this, but they're afraid to admit it to themselves -- because the only alternative is that Lucy has gone insane. The Professor reassures them: madness is a very serious charge, and their love, and their trust, should be strong enough to overcome it.

That scene does more to explain the mindset of Christians than thousands of "Jesus luvz j00 !!!!1!" posters ever could. For Christians (at least, the C.S.Lewis kind), love and faith are more real than anything else in the world, including their five senses, and rationality, and pretty much anything else. That's a pretty powerful statement, and C.S.Lewis doesn't just say it -- he makes you experience it. It's really too bad that he slips up in the later books... the first ones were the best.

END SPOILERS

Oh yeah, and if gnosticism is more your style, I'd recommend Richard Bach's The Reluctant Messiah. It's not mainstream Christianity, but it still does a good job.

I admit that I haven't read too many non-fiction apologetics books... the fictional ones are much more enjoyable to read, probably because the suspension of disbelief is already a given when one reads fiction.