Jesus lineage through Joseph

[Elijah John]

Jesus geneology in Matthew and Luke both trace his lineage back to David, through Joseph, who was reputed to be his step-father, not to be his biological father.

Couple of issues arise as Goat pointed out on another thread.

The Messiah was to be born from the house of David, and if Joseph was not Jesus' biological father, there is no evidence he was descended from King David, and therefore cannot be assumed to be the Messiah.

AND if Jesus WAS descended biologically through Joseph, the could not be the Incarnation of God, as his father was entirely human.

So, which is it? Was Jesus Messiah or was Jesus God Incarnate?

Seems to me he could not be both, and I'm thinkin' neither.

[1213]

The Messiah was to be born from the house of David, and if Joseph was not Jesus' biological father, there is no evidence he was descended from King David, and therefore cannot be assumed to be the Messiah.

I think Jesus was born to house of David, because he was born to that family. I think it does not mean that he has to be direct descendant of David. It is enough that he is counted to that family.

[Goat]

The Messiah was to be born from the house of David, and if Joseph was not Jesus' biological father, there is no evidence he was descended from King David, and therefore cannot be assumed to be the Messiah.

I think Jesus was born to house of David, because he was born to that family. I think it does not mean that he has to be direct descendant of David. It is enough that he is counted to that family.

For the Jewish faith, and according to the Jewish law, that doesn't matter one bit. What matters is 'who the biological father is', and yes, to be of the house of David, your father has to be of an unbroken male line to David. No one knows for sure if there is anyone who would qualify. But, according to the stories surrounding Jesus, he did not.

[Elijah John]

The Messiah was to be born from the house of David, and if Joseph was not Jesus' biological father, there is no evidence he was descended from King David, and therefore cannot be assumed to be the Messiah.

I think Jesus was born to house of David, because he was born to that family. I think it does not mean that he has to be direct descendant of David. It is enough that he is counted to that family.

For the Jewish faith, and according to the Jewish law, that doesn't matter one bit. What matters is 'who the biological father is', and yes, to be of the house of David, your father has to be of an unbroken male line to David. No one knows for sure if there is anyone who would qualify. But, according to the stories surrounding Jesus, he did not.

Your answer makes sense to me, Goat, but I also wonder. Where does the tradition of the matrilineal lineage come in? ie One has to have a Jewish mother to be Jewish by bloodline. How far back does that tradition go? Seems it would not apply in this case of Jesus, David and the Messiah?

[Goat]

The Messiah was to be born from the house of David, and if Joseph was not Jesus' biological father, there is no evidence he was descended from King David, and therefore cannot be assumed to be the Messiah.

I think Jesus was born to house of David, because he was born to that family. I think it does not mean that he has to be direct descendant of David. It is enough that he is counted to that family.

For the Jewish faith, and according to the Jewish law, that doesn't matter one bit. What matters is 'who the biological father is', and yes, to be of the house of David, your father has to be of an unbroken male line to David. No one knows for sure if there is anyone who would qualify. But, according to the stories surrounding Jesus, he did not.

Your answer makes sense to me, Goat, but I also wonder. Where does the tradition of the matrilineal lineage come in? ie One has to have a Jewish mother to be Jewish by bloodline. How far back does that tradition go? Seems it would not apply in this case of Jesus, David and the Messiah?

I do not know , but there are passages in the Torah that make those distinctions, so it goes back at least 2500 years. .. or at least variations on that theme.

[Elijah John]

The Messiah was to be born from the house of David, and if Joseph was not Jesus' biological father, there is no evidence he was descended from King David, and therefore cannot be assumed to be the Messiah.

I think Jesus was born to house of David, because he was born to that family. I think it does not mean that he has to be direct descendant of David. It is enough that he is counted to that family.

Good question, does lineage through adoption bear the same weight in those days, enough to be included in the house of David, or is it as Goat suggests, a biological requirement by Jewish tradition in those days.

[1213]

Good question, does lineage through adoption bear the same weight in those days, enough to be included in the house of David, or is it as Goat suggests, a biological requirement by Jewish tradition in those days.

According to the Bible, Jesus was counted to the family of Joseph. Did it really happen, I don’t know how to prove it.

[Zzyzx]

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According to the Bible, Jesus was counted to the family of Joseph. Did it really happen, I don’t know how to prove it.

Might bible writers and other promoters of the new religion have had incentive to say things that made Jesus seem to fit the "messiah" concept of Judaism? Might they also have decreed his birthplace as Jerusalem rather than Nazareth for the same reason?

Of course, Jews maintain that Jesus does not fit their prophesies -- but Christians maintain that he does fit Jewish prophesies. Jews say that lineage is traced through the father in their beliefs -- Christians use creative "explanations" to make him seem to fit (even if they must warp things considerably).

[Goat]

Good question, does lineage through adoption bear the same weight in those days, enough to be included in the house of David, or is it as Goat suggests, a biological requirement by Jewish tradition in those days.

According to the Bible, Jesus was counted to the family of Joseph. Did it really happen, I don’t know how to prove it.

According to the New Testament.. he was counted as the family of Joesph. But, he could not be counted as the house of David. That is the difference.

[1213]

According to the New Testament.. he was counted as the family of Joesph. But, he could not be counted as the house of David. That is the difference.

What do you think House of David means? Was Joseph counted to house of David?