FORBIDDEN FRUIT. The Role of Plants in the Human Experience.

[William]

This topic is connected to the topic Knowledge of Good and Evil where the question "Without knowledge of good and evil, can we have morality?" was asked.

The topic of The Role of Plants in the Human Experience, particularly when framed around the idea of Forbidden Fruit, opens up a vast field of inquiry, touching on history, mythology, spirituality, biology, and even ethics.

1. The Symbolic Role of Plants: Forbidden Fruit in Mythology

2. Plants as Sustenance and Spiritual Connection

3. Ethical Questions: The Boundaries of Human Use

4. The Biological Role of Plants in the Human Experience

5. Cultural Reflections and the Forbidden

The Role of Plants in the Human Experience, especially through the lens of forbidden fruit, highlights the complex and layered ways in which plants influence human existence—spiritually, biologically, and culturally. Whether seen as symbols of temptation and knowledge, as sacred entities, or as sources of sustenance and healing, plants are deeply entwined with what it means to be human. And the concept of the "forbidden" invites us to explore the limits of knowledge, morality, and power in our relationship with nature.

Does the idea of Forbidden Fruit in relation to gaining knowledge create barriers to gaining knowledge?

[bluegreenearth]

Does the idea of Forbidden Fruit in relation to gaining knowledge create barriers to gaining knowledge?

Is your question asking if the belief that some knowledge is restricted function as an excuse for deliberate ignorance?

[Bible_Student]

Every reputable Corporation utilizes confidentiality and non-disclosure agreements. Thus, limiting information to those with proper authority appears to be entirely normal.

Does the Creator of humanity hold and enforce the right to private information? Absolutely, as both the Bible indicates and Jesus Christ taught.

Acts 1:7 He said to them: “It does not belong to you to know the times or seasons that the Father has placed in his own jurisdiction."

[William]

To elaborate on the points made in the OP.

1. The Symbolic Role of Plants: Forbidden Fruit in Mythology
The phrase forbidden fruit is most commonly associated with the biblical story of Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden. According to the story in Genesis, Adam and Eve were forbidden by God to eat from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, but they were tempted by the serpent and ultimately consumed its fruit, leading to their expulsion from paradise.

• Symbol of Temptation and Knowledge: The forbidden fruit here represents more than just disobedience; it stands as a powerful symbol of the human quest for knowledge and the consequences of seeking wisdom. This story encapsulates a tension in human experience: the pursuit of knowledge and its potential to lead to both enlightenment and suffering. The fruit itself, often associated with an apple, has been used to symbolize curiosity, desire, and the breaking of divine or natural law.

• Cross-Cultural Parallels: Many other traditions feature similar stories where plants or fruits play key roles in shaping the human experience. For instance, in Greek mythology, there is the tale of Persephone, whose consumption of pomegranate seeds bound her to the underworld, symbolizing death and rebirth. These stories highlight how plants have historically been linked to cycles of life, death, knowledge, and transformation.

2. Plants as Sustenance and Spiritual Connection
Plants have been the primary source of food for humans, but their role extends far beyond nutrition. Many indigenous cultures view plants as sacred entities that connect humans to the earth and the divine. They are seen not merely as passive resources but as active participants in a symbiotic relationship with humans.

• Sacred Plants: Various cultures have viewed certain plants as gateways to spiritual experience. The Ayahuasca vine in Amazonian culture, the Soma of Vedic tradition, or the Peyote cactus in Native American practices are all examples where plants serve as vehicles for entering altered states of consciousness and exploring deeper spiritual realities. In these contexts, plants play a critical role in human spiritual development, helping individuals transcend ordinary perception.

• The Garden as a Symbol of Paradise: The concept of paradise, as a garden, is not exclusive to the Bible. Many traditions imagine an original, unspoiled world that humans lose access to, often through the consumption of a forbidden plant. The image of the garden as a place of both bliss and fall points to how plants are woven into our deepest narratives about what it means to be human.

3. Ethical Questions: The Boundaries of Human Use

The forbidden fruit concept also touches on the ethical and moral boundaries concerning human interaction with the natural world. In the Genesis story, there’s a divine prohibition that is broken—suggesting that not all things in nature are meant for human consumption or exploitation.

• Sustainability and Respect for Nature: Many modern discussions around sustainability echo this theme. Humans have always relied on plants, but our relationship with nature is often characterized by exploitation. The forbidden fruit might be seen as a metaphor for the ecological limits we are now encountering—where our consumption risks damaging the planet and our own existence.

• Psychoactive Plants and Human Consciousness: Many forbidden or restricted plants in modern societies—such as those with psychoactive properties—challenge societal norms about consciousness, mental health, and the regulation of experience. From a philosophical perspective, we might ask: What is forbidden about these plants, and why? Should humans have the right to explore the full range of consciousness that certain plants offer?

4. The Biological Role of Plants in the Human Experience

From a purely biological standpoint, plants have played an indispensable role in human survival, and their influence continues to be essential.

• Nutrition and Agriculture: The transition from hunter-gatherer societies to agricultural ones transformed human history. The domestication of plants allowed humans to form stable communities, develop civilizations, and reshape the natural world. Plants like wheat, rice, and corn became cornerstones of human diets and shaped cultures around them.

• Medicine and Healing: Many plants have been the source of traditional medicine and modern pharmacology. The study of plant-based compounds, like those found in the willow tree (aspirin) or the foxglove plant (digitalis), has shaped medical practice. The boundary between medicine and poison often rests on how humans interact with and understand these plants—another possible extension of the "forbidden fruit" metaphor.

5. Cultural Reflections and the Forbidden
The idea of forbidden fruit also captures the fascination that humans have with things that are off-limits or taboo. It may reflect deeper psychological, societal, or existential truths about our nature.

• Desire for the Unattainable: Humans have long been drawn to what is forbidden. This can be observed in everything from the pursuit of exotic plants (which often symbolized wealth and status in ancient cultures) to the allure of drugs, or even the ways we view genetically modified foods today. Our relationship with plants and their "forbidden" varieties reflects broader themes of control, transgression, and our desire to push the boundaries of what is natural or acceptable.

• Moral and Legal Codes: Historically, societies have imposed taboos and laws around certain plants, like cannabis or opium, often drawing lines based on moral, religious, or political reasons. These regulations reflect a deeper concern about how humans interact with nature and each other, shaped by the idea of limiting access to certain "fruits."
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In conclusion, The Role of Plants in the Human Experience, especially through the lens of forbidden fruit, highlights the complex and layered ways in which plants influence human existence—spiritually, biologically, and culturally. Whether seen as symbols of temptation and knowledge, as sacred entities, or as sources of sustenance and healing, plants are deeply entwined with what it means to be human. And the concept of the "forbidden" invites us to explore the limits of knowledge, morality, and power in our relationship with nature.

[William]

Does the idea of Forbidden Fruit in relation to gaining knowledge create barriers to gaining knowledge?

Is your question asking if the belief that some knowledge is restricted function as an excuse for deliberate ignorance?

Yes, in many ways, that’s precisely the essence of what I was getting at. The idea of forbidden knowledge—as symbolized by the forbidden fruit in the Genesis story—seems to create an internal or external framework that could encourage people to avoid seeking certain types of knowledge. I’m curious about whether this concept can act as a barrier to the pursuit of deeper understanding, either by fostering deliberate ignorance or by creating fear around certain areas of exploration.

1. Forbidden Knowledge as a Justification for Ignorance
The belief that some knowledge is restricted or dangerous can certainly be used as a reason for deliberate ignorance. If certain knowledge is labeled as "forbidden" or off-limits, it can create an environment where people shy away from asking difficult questions or exploring beyond accepted boundaries, either out of fear of consequences or a belief that some truths are simply not meant to be known.

• Internal Barriers: When we internalize the idea that some knowledge is off-limits, we may unconsciously create mental barriers that prevent us from questioning or seeking beyond what we’re told is acceptable. This can lead to a type of intellectual complacency, where we stop pushing the limits of understanding and settle into a comfortable, restricted version of reality.
• External Barriers: In many cases, this idea of forbidden knowledge can also be used by authorities—religious, political, or otherwise—as a way to maintain control over what people are allowed to think or explore. If knowledge is portrayed as dangerous or forbidden, those in power can restrict access to certain information or ideas, leading to a controlled, limited worldview.

2. Does Fear of the Unknown Lead to Deliberate Ignorance?
Another aspect of the forbidden fruit concept is the element of fear—fear of the consequences of gaining certain knowledge. In the Genesis story, Adam and Eve are punished for seeking the knowledge of good and evil. This could imply that curiosity, especially about fundamental truths, comes with dangerous repercussions, which in turn may discourage people from questioning established beliefs or norms.

• Fear as a Deterrent: If gaining certain knowledge is associated with punishment or negative consequences, people may avoid seeking that knowledge, even if it could lead to growth or a more profound understanding of life, spirituality, or the universe. This fear can be powerful enough to create a type of self-imposed ignorance, where curiosity is stifled by the potential risks of venturing into the "forbidden."
• Ignorance as a Comfort Zone: Sometimes, ignorance becomes a safe space, where not knowing certain truths is seen as preferable to confronting the complex or unsettling realities that deeper knowledge might reveal. In this sense, the idea of forbidden knowledge can create an excuse to remain in a state of comfort, avoiding the challenges that come with expanded understanding.

3. Challenging the Concept of Forbidden Knowledge
What I find interesting is how many philosophical and spiritual traditions—including those involving mystical or plant-based practices—encourage the pursuit of knowledge, suggesting that withholding certain truths might actually limit human potential. These traditions often argue that no knowledge should be forbidden, but rather explored with care and responsibility.

• Knowledge as Sacred, Not Dangerous: In these alternative views, the pursuit of knowledge is seen as part of the human journey toward enlightenment or spiritual awakening. Rather than fearing what lies beyond, we are invited to explore the mysteries of existence. The idea of forbidden fruit is thus transformed into a challenge to overcome, rather than a boundary to respect.
• Breaking Free from Restrictive Narratives: When we question the concept of forbidden knowledge, we open the door to exploring areas of thought, science, and spirituality that have been traditionally off-limits. By doing so, we expand not only our understanding but also our capacity for growth and transformation.
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Conclusion:
So yes, I would say that the belief in restricted knowledge can serve as an excuse for deliberate ignorance, whether out of fear, control, or comfort. But I also believe that by challenging these imposed limitations, we can break free from the barriers that hold us back and pursue knowledge as a sacred journey of discovery.

[William]

[Replying to Bible_Student in post #3]

There seems to be a potential contradiction between the idea of GOD as a withholder of vital knowledge, as suggested in Genesis, and the role of Jesus as a revealer of divine truths. If Jesus came to impart knowledge that had been obscured by religious authorities, it raises the question of whether GOD ever intended to withhold knowledge permanently or whether this was part of a broader plan to guide humanity toward spiritual maturity. Jesus’ teachings encourage the pursuit of deeper understanding, which suggests that knowledge—particularly about the nature of GOD—should not be withheld, but sought after with an open heart and mind.

[Bible_Student]

The initial human pair lost their innocence through Satan's influence, akin to abused children. This event shifted their circumstances; by defying their Father, they became independent of God, much like youngsters who depart from their household prematurely.

Humans must, after that, seek reconciliation with the Creator by pursuing the knowledge that guides them to salvation. This understanding is connected to Jesus' function as a Mediator.

[Tcg]

Every reputable Corporation utilizes confidentiality and non-disclosure agreements. Thus, limiting information to those with proper authority appears to be entirely normal.

Does the Creator of humanity hold and enforce the right to private information? Absolutely, as both the Bible indicates and Jesus Christ taught.

Acts 1:7 He said to them: “It does not belong to you to know the times or seasons that the Father has placed in his own jurisdiction."

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[TRANSPONDER]

Quite true, and yet we get it as Exegesis all the time. Paul started it by making personal opinion claims and quoting a barely relevant Bible text , perhaps to emphasise it but looking like it was supposed to validate it, and that is how they are used in religious debates, very often.

We have to Understand that believers reckon that because something is in the Bible it is true, or at least carries weight. ut , as said, the Rules are that the Bible quotes by themselves prove nothing, and yet they asre always considered to be validation of a claim.

But I wondered what the point of the topic was. it seems a literary matter rather than a debating point to ask bout fruit and veg in the Bible.

Though we very quickly seem to have slipped onto the subject of what God tells us and what he doesn't.

Which is again starting froma false assumption that there is a god, or that it is telling us anything. A more sound hypothesis is that ancient writers were making stuff up and put it into the mouths of God or His emissaries in order to make people accept them.

But I suppose that is always going to be the h thumb on the scales in any religious discussion - the Theist side assume that God and Holy book are to be considered the go - to theory unless really compelling evidence is produced by the secularist side, which can at need be dismissed as mere Opinion.

[William]

The initial human pair lost their innocence through Satan's influence, akin to abused children. This event shifted their circumstances; by defying their Father, they became independent of God, much like youngsters who depart from their household prematurely.

Humans must, after that, seek reconciliation with the Creator by pursuing the knowledge that guides them to salvation. This understanding is connected to Jesus' function as a Mediator.

It seems we might be focusing on different aspects here. While I understand your point about human disobedience and the need for reconciliation, my question is more about the potential contradiction between GOD withholding vital knowledge and Jesus’ role as a revealer of divine truths.

You mentioned reconciliation through Jesus, but that brings me back to whether GOD ever intended to permanently withhold knowledge. If Jesus came to reveal GOD’s true nature and challenge the authorities who obscured it, doesn’t that suggest GOD wants us to pursue knowledge about Him, rather than restrict it? How do we reconcile the GOD of Genesis who withholds knowledge with the GOD revealed through Jesus, who encourages understanding?

I’m also curious about how we reconcile the Christian culture’s history of prohibiting certain spiritual practices, particularly those involving plants that are known to stimulate spiritual understanding and connection with GOD.
If, as you say, Jesus came to reveal truths about GOD and encourage deeper spiritual understanding, why have these plant-based spiritual practices been historically prohibited, even though they’ve been used for centuries in other cultures to facilitate divine connection?
Could it be that these prohibitions reflect more about human control and fear of certain types of knowledge rather than GOD's will? How do we align these prohibitions with Jesus’ message of seeking truth and understanding about GOD?

I’d also like to clarify something I see in the story of Adam, Eve, and the Garden of Eden. To me, it seems the authors of the narrative may be projecting human tendencies onto the GOD character in the story. Just as humans often hide things from each other or use knowledge to exert control, the GOD in this story behaves similarly—by withholding knowledge and imposing restrictions.
It seems to reflect more of a human approach to authority and control, rather than what a divine, all-loving GOD would actually do. The story feels like a reflection of human fears, where people imagine GOD behaving like they do—justifying the withholding of information because that’s something humans do to one another. How do you reconcile this human projection with the understanding of GOD as someone who is supposed to guide us toward deeper knowledge and spiritual maturity?