We're all Dead and this is Hell

[Purple Knight]

Question for debate: Does the thread's claim that we're all dead and this is Hell (or possibly purgatory) reconcile Jesus's statement that "this generation shall not pass away" before the apocalypse comes better or worse than other attempts to reconcile Jesus's claim with reality?

I rarely see this possibility discussed.

[JehovahsWitness]

What is the supposed connection between Jesus remarks and being dead and in Hell?

To learn more please go to other posts related to...

THE GENTILE TIMES , THE GENERATION and ...THE SECOND COMING *

*The Return of Christ

[The Tanager]

[Replying to Purple Knight in post #1]

I'm trying to see the connection. Is it that "passing away" wouldn't mean die a physical death, but would only come after purgatory is over and, therefore, a couple thousand years isn't too long for this generation to not pass away? Or do you mean something else?

[1213]

Question for debate: Does the thread's claim that we're all dead and this is Hell (or possibly purgatory) reconcile Jesus's statement that "this generation shall not pass away" before the apocalypse comes better or worse than other attempts to reconcile Jesus's claim with reality?

I rarely see this possibility discussed.

I don't think this life fits to the description of hell in the Bible. But, I think you have interesting point. By what is said in the Bible, even if body dies, it does not necessary mean that the person dies. For example can be in paradise or Hades waiting the final judgment as this scripture suggests and so the generation of Jesus is not dead.

“Now there was a certain rich man, and he was clothed in pur-ple and fine linen, living in luxury every day. A certain beggar, named Lazarus, was laid at his gate, full of sores, and desiring to be fed with the crumbs that fell from the rich man's table. Yes, even the dogs came and licked his sores. It happened that the beggar died, and that he was carried away by the angels to Abraham's bosom. The rich man also died, and was buried. In Hades, he lifted up his eyes, being in torment, and saw Abra-ham far off, and Lazarus at his bosom. He cried and said, 'Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue! For I am in anguish in this flame.' "But Abraham said, 'Son, remember that you, in your lifetime, received your good things, and Lazarus, in like manner, bad things. But now here he is comforted and you are in anguish. Besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, that those who want to pass from here to you are not able, and that none may cross over from there to us.' "He said, 'I ask you therefore, father, that you would send him to my father's house; for I have five brothers, that he may testi-fy to them, so they won't also come into this place of torment.' "But Abraham said to him, 'They have Moses and the prophets. Let them listen to them.' "He said, 'No, father Abraham, but if one goes to them from the dead, they will repent.' "He said to him, 'If they don't listen to Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded if one rises from the dead.'"
Luke 16:19-31

However, I think Jesus means with the generation the generation that sees all the things, not necessary the generation at that time.

[Purple Knight]

I'm trying to see the connection. Is it that "passing away" wouldn't mean die a physical death, but would only come after purgatory is over and, therefore, a couple thousand years isn't too long for this generation to not pass away? Or do you mean something else?

By what is said in the Bible, even if body dies, it does not necessary mean that the person dies. For example can be in paradise or Hades waiting the final judgment as this scripture suggests and so the generation of Jesus is not dead.

What is the supposed connection between Jesus remarks and being dead and in Hell?

That the apocalypse Jesus predicted already came and went, and it did so in around perhaps 40-70AD. The righteous already got resurrected and they're living in Paradise. We... aren't.

Jesus might have meant that his own generation would still be around in a couple thousand years because their spirits are not dead.

But I think it's important to both trust him, and examine what would be the case if he simply meant physical death. It would have meant the apocalypse already came. And if this isn't Paradise, well... It's something else.

[The Tanager]

[Replying to Purple Knight in post #5]

Ah, yes, thanks for helping us understand you better. I half agree with you. I do lean towards all of those things having happened leading up to the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD. That doesn't mean that paradise and hell or purgatory followed for all, as the predictions could have more symbolism than literalism behind them.

[JehovahsWitness]

That the apocalypse Jesus predicted already came and went, and it did so in around perhaps 40-70AD. The righteous already got resurrected and they're living in Paradise. We... aren't.

I see. Fair enough, I now understand your interpretation, thanks for sharing.


JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

[myth-one.com]

Question for debate: Does the thread's claim that we're all dead and this is Hell (or possibly purgatory) reconcile Jesus's statement that "this generation shall not pass away" before the apocalypse comes better or worse than other attempts to reconcile Jesus's claim with reality?

I rarely see this possibility discussed.

The dead know not any thing:

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing... (Ecclesiastes 9:5)

So if we are all dead, then none of us would know that we are dead nor where we are.

But since we can still discuss "We're all Dead and this is Hell", then we are not all dead and the statement is false.

[1213]

... It would have meant the apocalypse already came. And if this isn't Paradise, well... It's something else.

By how those are described in the Bible, I don't think apocalypse has happened and we are not in hell yet, all though there are many people who makes this life hellish.

[placebofactor]

Question for debate: Does the thread's claim that we're all dead and this is Hell (or possibly purgatory) reconcile Jesus's statement that "this generation shall not pass away" before the apocalypse comes better or worse than other attempts to reconcile Jesus's claim with reality?

I rarely see this possibility discussed.

How about giving us a verse to work off of?

The physically dead are without feelings, nor can they think or have a change of heart. The spiritually dead, if in hell, are without options; their end is to suffer their punishment. Only the living can be saved, and because Jesus Christ is alive and well, we, the living, have hope for an eternity with our Savior and future husband, Jesus Christ.

As for Matthew's comment, "this generation shall not pass away," it concerns the Jews who returned to Israel on May 14, 1948. They are now 77 years old, 80 being a generation. Yom Kippur is when the Jewish new year begins. Eighty would bring us to late October 2027.