John 8:56-59

[placebofactor]

John 8:56-58, Jesus was speaking to the Pharisees when he said, “Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad."

"Then said the Jews unto him, you are not yet fifty years old, and has thou seen Abraham?” The Jews thought this to be an absurd thing for Jesus to claim to have seen Abraham who had been dead for over 2000 years.

Jesus then said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, I am.” Before Abraham was born, I am. Abraham the creature and Jesus the Creator. Jesus did not say, “I was” but he said, “I am.”
“I am” is the name of God.

Before Jesus became the Messiah of the Jews, he was Jehovah who appeared several times to Abraham as a man.

Genesis 18:1-2 and 17, “And the LORD appeared unto him (Abraham) in the plains of Mamre; --- And he (Abraham) lifted up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground.”

Was it Jehovah Abraham saw? Verse 17, “And the LORD (Jehovah) said, Shall I hide from Abraham that thing which I do;”

The Hebrew word “appeared” in Genesis 18:1 is to let oneself be seen, to show oneself.

So, what Abraham saw was a manifestation of the Lord Jesus.

Genesis 12:7, “And the LORD appeared unto Abram, and said, unto your seed will I give this land;”

Genesis 22:18, The angel of the LORD said to Abraham, “And in thy seed shall all the nation of the earth be blessed; because you have obeyed my voice.”

At that moment, the conversation between Jesus and the Pharisees ended abruptly, they could no longer bear his words, now considering him to be a blasphemer and as such, was to be stoned to death. But the Lord’s hour had not come, so he departed and left the temple, going through the midst of them.

[1213]

...Jesus then said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, I am.” Before Abraham was born, I am. Abraham the creature and Jesus the Creator. Jesus did not say, “I was” but he said, “I am.”
“I am” is the name of God....

Some translations say, "I was" in that, and I think it is more reasonable, because, if the "I am" means in that God, it could be written like this:

Verily, verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, God.” Before Abraham was born, God.

Is that sensible in your opinion?

[placebofactor]

...Jesus then said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, I am.” Before Abraham was born, I am. Abraham the creature and Jesus the Creator. Jesus did not say, “I was” but he said, “I am.”
“I am” is the name of God....

Some translations say, "I was" in that, and I think it is more reasonable, because, if the "I am" means in that God, it could be written like this:

Verily, verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, God.” Before Abraham was born, God.

Is that sensible in your opinion?

No, I like the King James version because it fits in well with the rest of the Bible.

[1213]

...Jesus then said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, I am.” Before Abraham was born, I am. Abraham the creature and Jesus the Creator. Jesus did not say, “I was” but he said, “I am.”
“I am” is the name of God....

Some translations say, "I was" in that, and I think it is more reasonable, because, if the "I am" means in that God, it could be written like this:

Verily, verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, God.” Before Abraham was born, God.

Is that sensible in your opinion?

No, I like the King James version because it fits in well with the rest of the Bible.

Do you agree, if "I am" means God in the scripture, it would be written like this:
Verily, verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, God.” Before Abraham was born, God. ?

How does it make Jesus the God?

[placebofactor]

...Jesus then said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, I am.” Before Abraham was born, I am. Abraham the creature and Jesus the Creator. Jesus did not say, “I was” but he said, “I am.”
“I am” is the name of God....

Some translations say, "I was" in that, and I think it is more reasonable, because, if the "I am" means in that God, it could be written like this:

Verily, verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, God.” Before Abraham was born, God.

Is that sensible in your opinion?

No, I like the King James version because it fits in well with the rest of the Bible.

Do you agree, if "I am" means God in the scripture, it would be written like this:
Verily, verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, God.” Before Abraham was born, God. ?

How does it make Jesus the God?

I have no idea why you want to change the way the verse is written: Let's stick with what is, not what we would like it to say.

N.W.T. Jesus said, "Before Abraham came into existence, I have been."

K.J.B. Jesus said, "Before Abraham was, I am."

N.I.V. Jesus said, "before Abraham was born, I am!"

It's obvious the Jews understood Jesus as meaning he existed before Abraham and even before the creation. John 1:1 verifies this statement of fact. "In the beginning was the Word (Jesus), and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. Verse 14, "And the Word (Jesus) was made flesh, and dwelt among us, and we beheld his glory,"

[1213]

...It's obvious the Jews understood Jesus as meaning he existed before Abraham...

Ok, that I think is what the text means. And it is not the same as saying Jesus is the God.

[placebofactor]

...It's obvious the Jews understood Jesus as meaning he existed before Abraham...

Ok, that I think is what the text means. And it is not the same as saying Jesus is the God.

Okay then, if Jesus is not "God (Jehovah)," then he must be "a god," as are men and angels, and not worthy of our worship. Why? because we are to worship Jehovah only, and surely not any other "god" even if his name is Jesus. Is this what you're saying?

[1213]

....not worthy of our worship. ...

It depends on what is meant with "worship". But, a man should not be worshiped as the God.

[The Tanager]

...It's obvious the Jews understood Jesus as meaning he existed before Abraham...

Ok, that I think is what the text means. And it is not the same as saying Jesus is the God.

Why would the Pharisees want to stone Jesus for saying he existed before Abraham did?

[placebofactor]

...It's obvious the Jews understood Jesus as meaning he existed before Abraham...

Ok, that I think is what the text means. And it is not the same as saying Jesus is the God.

Why would the Pharisees want to stone Jesus for saying he existed before Abraham did?

When Jesus made the statement, "Before Abraham was, I am," the Pharisees understood him as meaning, "He was claiming to be equal to God." For this, they "Took up stones to cast at him"

Compare with John 5:18, "Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him (Jesus), because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God."

Today, we understand things differently, but the priests and the Jews 2000 years ago understood what Jesus meant. Jesus, by claiming to be the "Son of God, was equating himself to being equal with God. This was blasphemy, and for the sin of blasphemy, death by stoning was the sentence.

Philippians 2:6, Jesus "Who being in the form of God, that it not robbery to be equal with God:"