Global warming - Archbishop speaks out

[VermilionUK]

Taken from the BBC website:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7964880.stm

Here's a snippet

In a lecture, Dr Rowan Williams urged a "radical change of heart" to prevent runaway climate change.

At York Minster he said humanity should turn away from the selfishness and greed that leads it to ignore its interdependence with the natural world.

And God would not guarantee a "happy ending", he warned.

Dr Williams has often spoken out about environmental issues.

'Ultimate tragedy'

Speaking on Wednesday he said just as God gave humans free will to do "immeasurable damage" to themselves as individuals it seemed "clear" they had the same "terrible freedom" as a human race.

"I think that to suggest that God might intervene to protect us from the corporate folly of our practices is as unchristian and unbiblical as to suggest that he protects us from the results of our individual folly or sin," he said.

"God's faithfulness stands, assuring us that even in the most appalling disaster love will not let us go - but it will not be a safety net that guarantees a happy ending in this world."

Just heard about this story on the Jeremy Vine show on Radio2 -
anyone got any views on what he said, or on climate change in general - and possible Godly-intervention?

[McCulloch]

I'm not quite clear on the distinction between Rowan Williams' version of God and a god who does not exist. Perhaps that is why he seems to be on our side of such issues.

[VermilionUK]

I'm not quite clear on the distinction between Rowan Williams' version of God and a god who does not exist. Perhaps that is why he seems to be on our side of such issues.

Yeah, I know what you mean. Most of what he says - he says as if there is no God, or at the very least, a God that sits idle and does nothing.

Just on the global warming thing:

What happened to global warming?
This headline may come as a bit of a surprise, so too might that fact that the warmest year recorded globally was not in 2008 or 2007, but in 1998.

But it is true. For the last 11 years we have not observed any increase in global temperatures.

I think Al-Gore and all the eco-warriors have some explaining to do.

Think we'll get our "green-taxes" back?

No, me neither.

[Goat]

I'm not quite clear on the distinction between Rowan Williams' version of God and a god who does not exist. Perhaps that is why he seems to be on our side of such issues.

Yeah, I know what you mean. Most of what he says - he says as if there is no God, or at the very least, a God that sits idle and does nothing.

Just on the global warming thing:

What happened to global warming?
This headline may come as a bit of a surprise, so too might that fact that the warmest year recorded globally was not in 2008 or 2007, but in 1998.

But it is true. For the last 11 years we have not observed any increase in global temperatures.

I think Al-Gore and all the eco-warriors have some explaining to do.

Think we'll get our "green-taxes" back?

No, me neither.

While 1998 might be the warmest on record (variatons in a line do happen after all statistically), 2005 was the warmest in over a century, and 2008 was the second warmest. 2009 tied for the 8th warmest.

[VermilionUK]

I'm not quite clear on the distinction between Rowan Williams' version of God and a god who does not exist. Perhaps that is why he seems to be on our side of such issues.

Yeah, I know what you mean. Most of what he says - he says as if there is no God, or at the very least, a God that sits idle and does nothing.

Just on the global warming thing:

What happened to global warming?
This headline may come as a bit of a surprise, so too might that fact that the warmest year recorded globally was not in 2008 or 2007, but in 1998.

But it is true. For the last 11 years we have not observed any increase in global temperatures.

I think Al-Gore and all the eco-warriors have some explaining to do.

Think we'll get our "green-taxes" back?

No, me neither.

While 1998 might be the warmest on record (variatons in a line do happen after all statistically), 2005 was the warmest in over a century, and 2008 was the second warmest. 2009 tied for the 8th warmest.

Yeah - but it seems to of started a revision of global warming, and more experts are suggesting that we could actually be at the start of a cooling down phase (we're apparently several hundred years overdue for an ice age). While others suggest that we won't see any increase in temperature until at least 2030/2050, if at all. Make of it what you will - but I think the simple answer is:
"We don't know what's happening"

[Goat]

I'm not quite clear on the distinction between Rowan Williams' version of God and a god who does not exist. Perhaps that is why he seems to be on our side of such issues.

Yeah, I know what you mean. Most of what he says - he says as if there is no God, or at the very least, a God that sits idle and does nothing.

Just on the global warming thing:

What happened to global warming?
This headline may come as a bit of a surprise, so too might that fact that the warmest year recorded globally was not in 2008 or 2007, but in 1998.

But it is true. For the last 11 years we have not observed any increase in global temperatures.

I think Al-Gore and all the eco-warriors have some explaining to do.

Think we'll get our "green-taxes" back?

No, me neither.

While 1998 might be the warmest on record (variatons in a line do happen after all statistically), 2005 was the warmest in over a century, and 2008 was the second warmest. 2009 tied for the 8th warmest.

Yeah - but it seems to of started a revision of global warming, and more experts are suggesting that we could actually be at the start of a cooling down phase (we're apparently several hundred years overdue for an ice age). While others suggest that we won't see any increase in temperature until at least 2030/2050, if at all. Make of it what you will - but I think the simple answer is:
"We don't know what's happening"

Well, the cause of the ice ages tend to be the wobble in the earths orbit, and if it wasn't for the increase in the greenhouse gases, we would be in a cooling period.
When every year in the last decade made the 'top 15' , you know it's a trend.

I disagree that 'more experts' think we are in the start of a 'cooling trend'. It's the same old conservative ones that are politically motivated , rather than concerned about doing good science.

[VermilionUK]

I disagree that 'more experts' think we are in the start of a 'cooling trend'. It's the same old conservative ones that are politically motivated , rather than concerned about doing good science.

I was meaning that more experts are beginning to lean towards that view (of cooling or non-warming). Of course a great proportion think global warming is caused by humans but I think that we forget that there have been ice ages and periods of heat before humans existed, and it'll continue after humans (unless we destroy the earth)

Although - I'd be interested to see what happens when (if) the earth cools again:
- Will we be taxed for releasing too little carbon dioxide?

Knowing the way governments work, we probably will

[Goat]

I disagree that 'more experts' think we are in the start of a 'cooling trend'. It's the same old conservative ones that are politically motivated , rather than concerned about doing good science.

I was meaning that more experts are beginning to lean towards that view (of cooling or non-warming). Of course a great proportion think global warming is caused by humans but I think that we forget that there have been ice ages and periods of heat before humans existed, and it'll continue after humans (unless we destroy the earth)

Although - I'd be interested to see what happens when (if) the earth cools again:
- Will we be taxed for releasing too little carbon dioxide?

Knowing the way governments work, we probably will

I think we could use a little cooling, but that won't happen in the foreseable future.

[elle]

My religious parents do not believe in global warming and cannot understand my environmental activism or vegetarianism because they believe the only ones that are important are the humans with the ability to worship their god and that the environment was created for them to do what they wish with it.

See Genesis 8 and http://politicalirony.com/2009/03/31/go ... roy-earth/ to better understand why they believe this.

They do apparently believe that god will intervene to keep men from destroying the earth. In defense of my folks, I have to say they do not (at least to the best of my knowledge) support the idea that CO₂ emissions are good for the earth and that we should make lots and lots more of them to help our "carbon-starved" planet as the Illinois congressman suggests.