Guns and stuff

[2ndRateMind]

One's heart goes out the bereft relatives and blameless wounded of Las Vegas. And one's prayers for the innocent dead.

Yet, one notices that this is hardly an isolated occurrence. Quite why civilians need a right to buy and bear arms in the form of automatic assault weapons evades me. The more that are sold, the more likely they will fall into the hands of the mentally unstable, the criminal, and the downright malicious. No civilised country could or should or would tolerate such lax gun laws for long.

Best wishes, 2RM.

[McCulloch]

[Replying to McCulloch]

Ask the natives of Canada about massacres.

What are you talking about?

[McCulloch]

After all, if the weapons were obtained from an illegal source then how would changing gun laws make much difference in that case?

Actually, the fewer legal guns are held, the fewer illegal guns are held.

[McCulloch]

Mass shootings account for less than 2% of gun deaths.

But gun deaths are higher in the USA than any other Western Nation. As a country you should be finding ways to reduce the abominably high rate of gun deaths you have. If you only attempt to reduce the Mass shootings, you will fail miserably.

The majority of gun deaths are suicides, two-thirds.

Suicide attempts with guns are significantly more likely to succeed. Removing ready access to guns will reduce suicide deaths.

the argument that federal gun legislation is going to be able to control all circumstances or stop mass murders is just not supported by the evidence.

But the argument that significant restrictions on gun ownership reduces gun deaths is quite convincing.

[JP Cusick]

The NRA agrees to put regulations on the rapid fire "bump fire stocks" so that mass murder must have moved a mountain.

The gun owners of America are not really against law-and-order.

I have heard more about this on talk-TV-News and this too is just another false display to look like they are doing something when it does nothing in reality.

The "bump fire stocks" have now become a hot sales item with millions being sold just since the Los Vegas attack, and so even if they are made illegal then there will still be millions available in the underground markets, and it will not affect our security.

The problem is that our society is deteriorating, and it promotes gratuitous violence in every corner of video games and violent TV and movies, and the fundamental basic ideals of Capitalism is to be greedy and selfish and to exploit other people, so that the brainwashing is just all around evil.

What is truly needed is a new modern religion based on morality which is acceptable to the vast majority of the population - and if history repeats itself as it does - then we can expect such a phenomenon to come to the USA at any time.

The other problem is that our worldly salvation might not come as soon as we would like.

[Wootah]

[Replying to post 41 by McCulloch]

You can't extrapolate?

[Bust Nak]

That is also what the aristocracy in England thought.

That's the whole point - the amendment was made for a different time.

There are always multiple factors that play into such a situation.

All of which boils down to whether the US military is involved or not and if so, which side they take.

Unless one is led by someone like George "Cincinnatus" Washington.

I am not sure what you are trying to get at here, we were talking about assassinating a tyrant here, right?

Also, weapons in civilian hands have always been a relevant factor in war. From Jael with a tent peg to the Swiss civil defense, and the French underground, they have been the wild card that have tipped to balance in many cases.

Now replace the German military with the US military, then take away the ally military from the picture and estimate your odds.

[JP Cusick]

All of which boils down to whether the US military is involved or not and if so, which side they take.

Will the US military turn against the American citizens? the past says = yes they will.

The thing about guns and the 2A is that many if not most Police officers and military personnel are the kinds of American citizens who believe in their own right to the 2A and their right to have guns and guns and more guns.

So yes the US military and the police force will turn against our own people, but they might turn against our government if it orders to take away the guns.

History records many governments where the military took the side of the people.

[bluethread]

Mass shootings account for less than 2% of gun deaths.

But gun deaths are higher in the USA than any other Western Nation. As a country you should be finding ways to reduce the abominably high rate of gun deaths you have. If you only attempt to reduce the Mass shootings, you will fail miserably.

Yes, we need to focus on places like Detroit(Mike Duggan - D), Baltimore(Catherine E. Pugh - D), New Orleans(Mitch Landrieu - D), Oakland(Libby Schaaf - D), Memphis( A.C. Wharton - D), Cleveland(Frank G. Jackson - D), Philadelphia(Jim Kenney - D), Kansas City(Sylvester "Sly" James, Jr. - D), Chicago(Rahm Emanuel - D), Milwaukee(Tom Barrett -D). What do all of these have in common, apart from being the top ten Murder capitals in these United States? I wonder if the pesky D has anything to do with it?

The majority of gun deaths are suicides, two-thirds.

Suicide attempts with guns are significantly more likely to succeed. Removing ready access to guns will reduce suicide deaths.

Maybe so, but suicide is not the point of the thread. Including those numbers in the statistics biases the issue of gun murder, let alone mass murder.

the argument that federal gun legislation is going to be able to control all circumstances or stop mass murders is just not supported by the evidence.

But the argument that significant restrictions on gun ownership reduces gun deaths is quite convincing.

But the point of the thread is murder, especially mass murder. Restrictions on sleeping pills, razor blades and rope, might also reduce the number of deaths involving the use of those things also. However, few favor limiting their ownership to licensed professionals.

[Wootah]

[Replying to post 46 by Bust Nak]

It was made for a different time, for a dark time. Dark times will come again. Don't ignore history.

[Bust Nak]

[Replying to post 49 by Wootah]
Work on stopping a simular dark time from occuring in the first place, make doubly sure the military serves the people and not the president, because history tells you that you aren't gonna beat the strongest military in the world with your AR-15's.