Does anyone else feel out numbered?

[achilles12604]

Its funny. According to the stats, there are more christians on this site than atheists. But from the posting on the forums it sure doesn't feel that way. I feel out numbered. Anyone else feel this way? Why do you suppose there arn't more Christian apologists? Are they busy doing good deeds or do you think they simply stopped caring?

[NotR]

Outnumbered doesnt meen defeated.

btw, i never understood public prayer. as in, prayer in a group. about "prayer request" topic... I understand that some need help, and the best we can do is pray. but it is somewhat fonny. its not the true me praying. more like a duty. honesty lacks, somewhat the base of speech to God.

[seventil]

I enjoy being the minority. Heck, even as a "liberal" Christian, I'm a minority within a minority. I often find myself taking heat from both fundie-Christians and Atheists. The cross of open-minded thinking and objective reasoning is a lonely and tough one.

[Chimp]

I don't see it as an us vs. them sort of thing...that's what I love about it...it's
a free for all...sometimes you are arguing a point with someone in opposition, then
on another thread, in agreement.

As far as conversion...I'm aiming a little lower...try not to piss anyone off with my
point of view.

[Chancellor]

Its funny. According to the stats, there are more christians on this site than atheists.

I guess that depends on how you're defining "Christian."

But from the posting on the forums it sure doesn't feel that way. I feel out numbered. Anyone else feel this way?

I think that many who are members here simply choose not to post or (like me) maybe have forgotten that they were even members of this forum. The atheists, secular humanists and other anti-Christian people here (and they are anti-Christian) tend to flood these kinds of forums perhaps as a means of trying to overwhelm Christians into giving up the fight. Then of course, there's this stupid implied insistence that we have to operate according to secularist rules, e.g. we must accept that so-called "logic," "reason," "evidence," and "science" are absolute, unquestionable truths.

Why do you suppose there arn't more Christian apologists? Are they busy doing good deeds or do you think they simply stopped caring?

See above.

[Goose]

Its funny. According to the stats, there are more christians on this site than atheists. But from the posting on the forums it sure doesn't feel that way. I feel out numbered. Anyone else feel this way? Why do you suppose there arn't more Christian apologists? Are they busy doing good deeds or do you think they simply stopped caring?

Perspective is everything. I was reading some threads recently where it seemed like the Christian was outnumbered. If the truth was simply decided by numbers then Christianity would be true because it has more followers than any other religion. But we know that logically speaking a simple head count does not prove truth. The way I see things around here, it only takes one Christian to handle several attacking sceptics.

[alexiarose]

Its funny. According to the stats, there are more christians on this site than atheists. But from the posting on the forums it sure doesn't feel that way. I feel out numbered. Anyone else feel this way? Why do you suppose there arn't more Christian apologists? Are they busy doing good deeds or do you think they simply stopped caring?

Maybe if we stopped fighting each other so much, we might see some consistency to make real change. We hardly seem to be supporting each other like the atheists do. Mom has a thread somewhere about it.

[joer]

Its funny. According to the stats, there are more christians on this site than atheists. But from the posting on the forums it sure doesn't feel that way. I feel out numbered. Anyone else feel this way? Why do you suppose there arn't more Christian apologists? Are they busy doing good deeds or do you think they simply stopped caring?

Maybe if we stopped fighting each other so much, we might see some consistency to make real change. We hardly seem to be supporting each other like the atheists do. Mom has a thread somewhere about it.

What about if we put a link here to the thread we feel overwhelmed at. I believe most of us will get an email notification and maybe a few of us will click on the link and go over and help our friend out. sure many of us have differences on details of our Faith, but on a thread Alexia's mom started about what Christians believed in common. I don't think there was any disagreement we believed in God and Christ. If those were the only truths we presented in a supporting role so as to avoid in fighting. That would be good enough. IMHO.

I hear what others are saying you get tired of going over the same stuff over and over again. We each have to decide when it's time to wish our atheist friends well and move on to another thread.

[joer]

PC1 fought a valiant battle against 3 or 4 other posters and not only came out on top in terms of the argument, he also lifted up the quality of the argument by his fine positive non-negative strong arguments.

If you feel like dropping him a pm or a few words of encouragement that may be another way we can back each other up.

Is scientific proof of God even possible?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 9&start=90

God bless you all! God's strength and peace be with you.

[GaHillBilly]

My two cents:

1. Debate is not 'nice', and there is a community expectation that Christians will be 'nice'.

2. Even apart from nice, I find it a struggle to avoid sarcasm and ad hominem attacks. It's possible to learn to 'fight' within the rules, and without anger: athletes do it all the time. But, it's not something for which Christians generally train.

3. I'm not going to debate this in THIS thread, though it will come up later, but my observation is that the Christian community tends to be soft-headed, in part because of the need to be nice, and in part because most of the sub-communities within Christendom are in-grown. Christians are not accustomed to having to defend their silly ideas -- and I believe they have some VERY silly ones -- since their brethren within the sub-community share the same silly ideas. When Christians get into a word-fight with non-Christians, some of these silly ideas are going to be exposed as, well, silly. Many believers have failed to distinguish between 'mere' Christianity, and the dispensable peripheral doctrines. Thus, when some of their silly ideas are successfully challenged, they feel -- incorrectly -- that their whole faith is in danger, and bail out.

If Christians understood, accepted, and fought for "mere Christianity" instead of all their indefensible "denominational distinctives", I believe they'd have an easier time of it. Personally, I've always thought that the basic Christian position was far, far easier to defend intellectually than most of the modern opposing positions. And, in one on one discussions, I've always found this to be true.

Debates in forums like these tend to be tiresome, because even when you kill the shark, you can bleed to death from the thousands of nibbles from all the other little (off topic!) fish!

I agree that a forum such as this is unlikely to convert anyone.

But, I do believe that many atheists are enormously dependent on some extremely indefensible and even silly positions. Exposing those vulnerabilities, if it can be done charitably (which I find hard), can open their minds and possibly make them open to Christians they encounter face to face.

Perhaps more importantly, learning to meet those challenges here can help Christian parents and teachers to their THEIR children and students to shore up their own faith against the challenges they will encounter in college and elsewhere.

I just went to check with my older son, who's spent a year of dual enrollment, and almost two years as a student, at a local state college. As I suspected, he confirmed that he's found the intellectual challenges posed by a variety of atheists and flamingly liberal humanists to be minimal. (After he read much of CS Lewis and Francis Schaeffer his senior year in high school, he came to me, and said, 'Dad, now I know where you got most of your ideas!) But, he and I both worry about some of his Christian peers who are woefully prepared by their parents and teachers.

My own goals here are much more specific. I want to see if people can find holes in some of my key ideas. This is the kind of place where that may well be possible, depending on who's here.

GaHillBilly

[Goose]

My own goals here are much more specific. I want to see if people can find holes in some of my key ideas. This is the kind of place where that may well be possible, depending on who's here.

GaHillBilly

Hi GaHillBilly, I appreciate your insight. If you'd like, I could play devil's advocate so to speak. Though I won't promise I can find holes in your arguments. But I can try. The ironic thing is I find I get a much higher level and more stimulating debate when exchanging with fellow Christians. If you have a topic we could go for it, though I'm not sure if the Holy Huddle room is the appropriate forum. Perhaps the head-to-head. Let me know.

I'd also like to encourage you to utilize your knowledge and insight in the Apologetics forum when you have time.

Cheers and welcome.