National anthem for the Kingdom of God

Elijah John · Post by **Elijah John** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 3:08 pm

Since the Kingdom of God is a present and future reality, it it were up to you, what song or hymn would be your choice for our "national anthem"?

YHVH Nissi means YHVH my banner. SO why not a song as well?

My choice would be "Guide Me Thou Great Jehovah"....and yours?

tam · Post by **tam** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 3:35 pm

[Replying to post 10 by JehovahsWitness]

Dear JW, I did not mention anything about rejection or condemnation or " J" being of the devil.

I also am not fighting the English language. But "Jehovah" is not even the correct English translation. Out of curiosity, have you guys considered how there can even be a translation when the vowel points in YHWH are unknown? It is the vowels that are placed into that name that are inaccurate, rendering the name itself inaccurate.

The name "Jehovah" is common and traditional, but inaccurate. Jah, however, IS accurate, as per the post shared above. (Even if it is spelled with a Y, then no big deal, because it is at least being pronounced the same, so it is HEARD the same.) As well, Jah(veh) helps to show that the One who came in the Name of Jah, also has Jah in His name.

**

On the matter of changing a given name into one's own language... well, where does this tradition (that word again) come from? Why do we do that? Would love not prompt one to seek out and at least try to pronounce a loved one's name as they know it?

If I had a friend or a loved one from another country, for instance, that friend or loved one might accept being called by my English translation of their name, but would he not love the one who made the effort (out of love and respect) to learn and speak the name he was born having? Rather than just going by tradition and assuming it is no big deal?

Just a thought.

Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ Jaheshua,
tammy

Elijah John · Post by **Elijah John** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 9:05 pm

[Replying to post 9 by tam]

Hi Tam, peace to you too.

We realize that Jehovah is not an exact pronounciation. For one thing, there is no "J" in the Hebrew alphabet, so it is probably "Yehovah". With the accent on the last sylable.

A good case for this pronounciation is made in two books I have read, "His Hallowed Name Revealed Again" by Keith E Johnson, and "Proclaim His Holy Name" by Peter and Linda Miller-Russo.

Also, God knows, hears and understands...I think he cuts us some slack. If not all the folks who call on the name of Jesus have gone unheard, as his real name is Yehoshua. (YHVH is salvation)

JehovahsWitness · Post by **JehovahsWitness** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 8:24 am

Elijah John wrote:God knows, hears and understands...I think he cuts us some slack. If not all the folks who call on the name of Jesus have gone unheard, as his real name is Yehoshua. (YHVH is salvation)
That is the point, all those hunderes of millions of English speakers calling on the name of Jesus (with a J-ay) pronouning the Son's name in a way totally unrecognizable to the original pronunication and knowing that is the case. If Jesus will hear those appealing to God through his name - with a /J/ ... will God the Father reject those English speakers that call on Him in their own language with the same J-?

We do not want to become Pharisitical and forget the main point (which is honour for the name of God) for logistics!

JW

Arabic - Yoahw
(Jesus: Eashoa in Arabic)

Awabakal - YehÃ³a
Cantonese - Yehwowah
Swahili - Yehova
Venda - Yehova
Xhosa - uYehova

Zulu - uJehova
Japanese - Ehoba
Maori - Ihowa
Motu - Iehova
Malaysian Yehowa
Norway IEHOVA
Futuna - Ihova
Romanian - Iehova
Samoan - Ieova

Elijah John · Post by **Elijah John** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 1:46 pm

JehovahsWitness wrote:
Elijah John wrote:God knows, hears and understands...I think he cuts us some slack. If not all the folks who call on the name of Jesus have gone unheard, as his real name is Yehoshua. (YHVH is salvation)
That is the point, all those hunderes of millions of English speakers calling on the name of Jesus (with a J-ay) pronouning the Son's name in a way totally unrecognizable to the original pronunication and knowing that is the case. If Jesus will hear those appealing to God through his name - with a /J/ ... will God the Father reject those English speakers that call on Him in their own language with the same J-?

We do not want to become Pharisitical and forget the main point (which is honour for the name of God) for logistics!

JW

Arabic - Yoahw
(Jesus: Eashoa in Arabic)

Awabakal - YehÃ³a
Cantonese - Yehwowah
Swahili - Yehova
Venda - Yehova
Xhosa - uYehova

Zulu - uJehova
Japanese - Ehoba
Maori - Ihowa
Motu - Iehova
Malaysian Yehowa
Norway IEHOVA
Futuna - Ihova
Romanian - Iehova
Samoan - Ieova
Agreed, JW,.... and to Tammy..."Jah" is an abbreviation of the full name of Yehovah, not the entirety of the Name.

I'm pretty sure both the abbreviation and the full Name are honored by God, who knows the heart.

I am convinced all the variations of the tetragrammaton YHVH, are honored as well, as long as our intentions are to honor the Living God.

tam · Post by **tam** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:08 pm

We do not want to become Pharisitical and forget the main point (which is honour for the name of God) for logistics!

Dear JW, is it not written in your own literature:

Similarly, true worshippers today teach others about Godâ€™s name, his purposes, and his qualities.

Is there is something pharasitical in sharing the name of God? All I have done here is shared what I have learned from my Lord about the name of God, with the two of you (and anyone else reading). Where would be the love in not sharing what has been given to me to share, with those who seek (or claim to seek) to know truth? What you do with that... hear or refrain... is up to each of you.

I cannot expect to remain in Truth (Christ), and at the same time use and promote something I know to be false. There is enough false information out there about Christ and God. Christ speaks only truth.

Peace to you both,
your servant and a slave of Christ Jaheshua (Jah Saves),
tammy

tam · Post by **tam** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:23 pm

Agreed, JW,.... and to Tammy..."Jah" is an abbreviation of the full name of Yehovah, not the entirety of the Name.

Yes, I have seen that some people assert this. However, I am not sure what truth it is based upon.

Jah is short for Jahveh. (From the two translations that men have come up with: Yahweh is more accurate than Jehovah; and in that name we can see that Jah - Yah - is not an abbreviation at all)

My name shortened is Tam, not T'my. Elijah's name shortened is Eli, not E'ah. David's name shortened is Dav(e), not D'id.

Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

Elijah John · Post by **Elijah John** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:29 pm

tam wrote:
We do not want to become Pharisitical and forget the main point (which is honour for the name of God) for logistics!
Dear JW, is it not written in your own literature:

Similarly, true worshippers today teach others about Godâ€™s name, his purposes, and his qualities.

Is there is something pharasitical in sharing the name of God? All I have done here is shared what I have learned from my Lord about the name of God, with the two of you (and anyone else reading). Where would be the love in not sharing what has been given to me to share, with those who seek (or claim to seek) to know truth? What you do with that... hear or refrain... is up to each of you.

I cannot expect to remain in Truth (Christ), and at the same time use and promote something I know to be false. There is enough false information out there about Christ and God. Christ speaks only truth.

Peace to you both,
your servant and a slave of Christ Jaheshua (Jah Saves),
tammy

Tam, if you declare that your understanding of the Divine Name is the ONLY interpretation, the only valid understanding, then that is dogmatic, if not Pharisitical.

Neither JW or I are claiming to have the only "valid" pronunciation, but rather that YHVH honors all reasonable derivations of the Tetragrammaton, yours included.

Even the Jehovah's Witness orginization allow for variations, if I understand their teaching correctly,( and JW, correct me if I am wrong on that)

Elijah John · Post by **Elijah John** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:33 pm

tam wrote:
Agreed, JW,.... and to Tammy..."Jah" is an abbreviation of the full name of Yehovah, not the entirety of the Name.
Yes, I have seen that some people assert this. However, I am not sure what truth it is based upon.

Jah is short for Jahveh. (From the two translations that men have come up with: Yahweh is more accurate than Jehovah; and in that name we can see that Jah - Yah - is not an abbreviation at all)

My name shortened is Tam, not T'my. Elijah's name shortened is Eli, not E'ah. David's name shortened is Dav(e), not D'id.

Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

Except that the "Jah" abreviation omits the "V" part of the Tetragrammaton, so that cannot be the complete Name. Abreviation, yes, complete? I don't think so.

tam · Post by **tam** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 3:29 pm

Elijah John wrote:
tam wrote:
Agreed, JW,.... and to Tammy..."Jah" is an abbreviation of the full name of Yehovah, not the entirety of the Name.
Yes, I have seen that some people assert this. However, I am not sure what truth it is based upon.

Jah is short for Jahveh. (From the two translations that men have come up with: Yahweh is more accurate than Jehovah; and in that name we can see that Jah - Yah - is not an abbreviation at all)

My name shortened is Tam, not T'my. Elijah's name shortened is Eli, not E'ah. David's name shortened is Dav(e), not D'id.

Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy
Except that the "Jah" abreviation omits the "V" part of the Tetragrammaton, so that cannot be the complete Name. Abreviation, yes, complete? I don't think so.

Yes, Jah is a shortened form of the name Jahveh, as I also said when I said Jah is short for Jahveh.

I meant to say that Yah (Jah) is not a contraction at all, but rather a shortened form of Jahveh (Yahweh).

As to the rest, EJ, no one has to take my word for it; I am certainly not going to shun you or think less of you or turn away from you. Not that I am anyone that it should matter what I think or do. But why not ask for yourselves? The information that I shared is what my Lord has shown me, and so I shared it also with you. It is there for you to consider, and hopefully ask about for yourself, if you so choose.

I also used the name 'Jesus' until I learned that it was not the name of my Lord. (Then I could not use it; it was false and so I could not say it.) I could never use the name Jehovah. It always sounded 'wrong'. But Jahveh... I knew that was true the moment I heard and spoke it. Jahehsua took some time for me to accept (for reasons I will not go into at the moment), until my Lord showed me what I shared in my original post on this thread. Then, because He showed me Himself (rather than just some other person stating so), I was convinced.

So I do not expect you or anyone to take my word for it. But if you would like to know what is true - whatever that might be - then ask and listen for Him to reveal His truth to you.

Oh, and in the course of this discussion, I was directed to this site, and so perhaps you might find this helpful (though you have probably seen it before, but perhaps not taken notice of the pronunciation):

http://www.behindthename.com/name/joshua

PRONOUNCED: JAH-shÉ™-wÉ™ (English), JAW-shwÉ™ (English) [key]

And the key states that the upside down e there (which i do not know how to re-create on my keyboard), is pronounced:

É™ ... about (schwa)

Since we call upon the name, then it would be the pronunciation that would matter more than the spelling.

I just... most of us, if coming before a human king, would learn to pronounce his name out of respect for at least his position. Why would we not afford that same honor to God and to His Son, who are worthy of greatest honor and respect and love?

Peace to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

Elijah John · Post by **Elijah John** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 4:19 pm

[Replying to post 19 by tam]

Certainly no offense taken based on disagreements.

Sorry I forgot about the "Jahveh" being the full name, I remember now you DID point that out.

But I would point out that there is no "J" in the Hebrew alphabet. So wouldn't it be "Yahveh"?

And on the matter to what degree correct rendition and pronunciation matters, I think we may have to just agree to disagree. I still say YHVH honors our attempts, even if we don't get it exactly right, as long as our intent is to honor Him.