Why are gay people a Christian target?

[Colorado127]

I am perplexed by fundamentalist christians that are always targeting gay people. They want to pass all sorts of laws restricting rights and privileges that everyone else has. What frustrates me the most is that they seem to be tunnel-visioned on gays. There are many things in the christian bible that they could talk about. I bet you there are more adulterers in the US than gay people and adultery is a ten commandments topic. What about honoring your parents? Can we focus on that for a while? This gay marriage thing being a religious idea only? I know of several religions that encourage gay people to find partners to marry including Unity, Unitarian Universalists and the Quakers.

I believe that gay people are the target because the christian religion, or its higher ups, have nothing else to target? They have lost the battle with alcohol and porn, they used to say black people couldn't marry white people but can't do that anymore. They try to stop drugs but you can't pass any more laws about that. Ok I'm being a bit out there, but really, Christianity has been losing its control over its flock for decades, if not centuries. Every sociologist and psychology person can easily see that when someone or some group sees its former control waning they will do anything to regain it. It's a desparate act. These fundamentalist christians have to find something to rally the troops.....wha-laa!.....gay people. A marginalized group in our over masculinized, sports culture that many people feel uncomfortable with. From history, the Nazi's for example, we know that hate is an excellent way to mobilize a group.

Isn't it blatantly unconstitutional to forbid the marriage of two people? In Virginia they want to outlaw any 'marraige like' contracts between two people of the same sex, doesn't that seem unconstitutional? The sodomy laws that Chief Justice Souter condemned was obviously directed at gay men. The 14th amendments says no state shall pass a law abridging the rights of its citizens. The only people saying I cannot marry another guy is christians? Right there we have a church-state conflict.

Ok, let me have it!

[melikio]

You are right about love.
I notice that you deny the perfection of man.
Perhaps you can tell me when God lost His ability to produce perfection.
All that is was created by God. He can only produce perfection. It is up to us to see it.

I think many "see" or "experience" it; I'm generally emphasizing that we (humans) aren't necessarily capable of consistently grasping and retaining "perfection".

Love holds "goodness" in the balance of things (as far as I can tell).

-Mel-

[palmera]

You are right about love.
I notice that you deny the perfection of man.
Perhaps you can tell me when God lost His ability to produce perfection.
All that is was created by God. He can only produce perfection. It is up to us to see it.

If God can only produce perfection, then why do organisms evolve? If you read in the Bible about God creation, God never says his creation is perfect ("good" yes, but never even "great") and he even murders the whole of creation save for a boat full because his creation was so corrupt.

Now if we're born perfect and corrupt ourselves, what of children born imperfect? If our souls alone are perfect when born, does that mean God cannot create perfect bodies?

Where is it written that God creates perfection?

[Greatest I Am]

As I stated it is up to us to see this perfection.
What we call imperfect is where we must look harder to see His perfection.
Why things evolve is because God placed that ability to evolve.
When we see what we call corruption and evil we must remember that the whole of the universe is in balance. God's plan continues in teaching us good and evil. Without evil or corrupted we would not learn of these things and would not accomplish God's plan for us. The perfection of Gods works must be here if there is to be an omnipotent God. I know it's hard to get to get the mind to see that God even made Evil perfect but it must be. This is a fundamental truth and if we remove Perfection from Gods attributes then God is no longer God.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I Am]

As I stated it is up to us to see this perfection.
What we call imperfect is where we must look harder to see His perfection.
Why things evolve is because God placed that ability to evolve.
When we see what we call corruption and evil we must remember that the whole of the universe is in balance. God's plan continues in teaching us good and evil. Without evil or corrupted we would not learn of these things and would not accomplish God's plan for us. The perfection of Gods works must be here if there is to be an omnipotent God. I know it's hard to get to get the mind to see that God even made Evil perfect but it must be. This is a fundamental truth and if we remove Perfection from Gods attributes then God is no longer God.

You also ask where in the bible it is stated that God is perfect. Many place that talk of Gods attributes.

Regards
DL

[palmera]

Greatest I Am wrote:

As I stated it is up to us to see this perfection.
What we call imperfect is where we must look harder to see His perfection.
Why things evolve is because God placed that ability to evolve.
When we see what we call corruption and evil we must remember that the whole of the universe is in balance. God's plan continues in teaching us good and evil. Without evil or corrupted we would not learn of these things and would not accomplish God's plan for us. The perfection of Gods works must be here if there is to be an omnipotent God. I know it's hard to get to get the mind to see that God even made Evil perfect but it must be. This is a fundamental truth and if we remove Perfection from Gods attributes then God is no longer God.

Where exactly in the Bible does it say that God's creation is perfect or that God thinks God's creation is perfect? It's an important question. Also, if everything is perfect how any of it be hidden? Perfection is an absolute state. If we fail to see imperfection, then our 'sight' must be imperfect. Your argument doesn't logically make sense- I guess one could take it on faith that something perfect has to work hard in order to see other perfect things. Why should we have to look harder if our eyes are already, as you've implied, perfect?

Things evolve because God made them evolve? Here's the thing- perfection negates the need for change. If something is perfect, that it- no change whatsoever- everything is taken care of. Evolution and "perfection" cannot coexist. It's not a divine mystery, it's not one of those paradoxical realities of life. The two are mutually exclusive.

The whole of the universe is in balance??? Where does the Bible say this? Where does this "understanding" come from? So God's plan is to teach us about good and evil?? Seriously? That's it? Where's the evidence of this?

You state that God must be perfect- it's a fundamental truth. What are the qualities of a perfect being? Some seem to think that God is all knowing, and all powerful (one quality you've already mentioned.) If you think about it, God can't be both. Seriously think about it.

[Greatest I Am]

I do not mind looking up verses for you but one at a time please.

Matthew 5:48 (Read all of Matthew 5)
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.


Hebrews 5:9 (Read all of Hebrews 5)
And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

From perfection can only come perfection.

An example of perfection evolving would be a baby. We are all perfect and yet we evolve.

As to tour many othr question if after thinking of the above tthey are still there place them to me one at a time otherwise I will only confuse you with too much information.
A lot of your queries are answered in the bible. Reserch is good.

Regards
DL

[McCulloch]

From perfection can only come perfection.

An example of perfection evolving would be a baby. We are all perfect and yet we evolve.

If any species were perfect, then it could not evolve. The fact that we can improve shows imperfections exist.

[Cephus]

We are all perfect and yet we evolve.

Where did you get the silly idea that we're perfect? We're not remotely close to perfect in any way, shape or form. That's why we continue to evolve and improve, because we can improve.

You can't improve on perfection.

[palmera]

Greatest I Am,
While I think you're an intelligent human being, your arguments regarding the perfection of existence lack any merit whatsoever. Since the Bible, the infallible word of God, says God and God's creation is perfect when you can plainly look around for yourself and see this isn't so, what does that tell you?

It seems like you're reaching out in the dark for anything to validate a belief that fails when placed under any modicum of scrutiny.

[Cephus]

It seems like you're reaching out in the dark for anything to validate a belief that fails when placed under any modicum of scrutiny.

Which is pretty much what apologists do. They aren't interested in finding the truth, they insist they already have it, regardless of how ridiculous it might be. As more and more evidence piles up that their beliefs are ludicrous, they have to keep finding ways to divert attention from the things that make their beliefs look silly.

It's like the Flat Earth Society. Once we had a way of flying high enough or going into orbit and proving, for an undeniable fact that the earth is not, in fact, flat, they had to keep making excuses, claiming conspiracies, anything so that they could continue to cling to their ridiculous beliefs. Reality has little to do with apologetics, it's the fierce and often irrational grasping at the straws of outmoded and demonstrably false belief systems, nothing more.