IT'S ALL GOD'S FAULT !!

[2Dbunk]

It seems all one reads or sees in the news these days has to do with police shooting unarmed blacks for hardly felonious crimes. Yes, some are more serious than others, and most are just plain stupid.

But racial disparity is America's one big dirty secret (actually not a secret since our dirty linen is open for all to see and our adversaries cite it at every opportunity).

Please, can anyone tell me why it has to be this way. If God exists, why would "He" present us with this conundrum? Why would "He" lay such a burden upon a race (or races) of people that they can be subjugated, manipulated, enslaved, discriminated against, just because of their obvious difference in color?

If "He" exists, then it is on "Him" to explain "His" motive. It better be a good reason because as it stands now, more rational people are leaving the enclaves of the brain-washed, indoctrinated, superstitious, and unquestioning blind followers of Faith.

I await to hear ONE good reason for this unnecessary disparity.

[Divine Insight]

[Replying to post 10 by tam]

I appreciate you opinions Tam, but as far as I am concerned there is no possible way to rip Jesus out of this religion and pretend that he could somehow on his own two feet separate from it.

Jesus is nothing if not the Son of Yahweh.

Jesus has no authority to offer anyone eternal life if he's not the Son of Yahweh.

Far more importantly, Jesus would have nothing to offer people "salvation from" if not from the wrath and judgement of Yahweh.

What's Jesus saving you from if not the wrath of Yahweh?

You can't detach Jesus from this religion, nor can Jesus be used to create a stand-alone religion.

Jesus is nothing if you reject Yahweh.

Yahweh is the God of this religion, not Jesus.

Moreover, how does your position change the situation of Jesus supposedly dying for the purpose of making our salvation possible?

If you change that, then you have basically rejected "Christianity" entirely.

At that point, your "detached Jesus" has absolutely no meaning or value at all.

Jesus without Yahweh doesn't even make any sense.

Of course Jesus as the Son of Yahweh doesn't make any sense either.

In short, these religious myths can't be made to make sense no matter what you try to do with them.

[Divine Insight]

But it was not God's idea. And it was not His Son's idea. So whose idea was it? And why would you not blame them for this, rather than God and His Son whose words and deeds speak against such things?

I would blame this God for not keeping his own religion in order.

For you to claim that there is no "religion" associated with this God is no different at all from claiming that we have absolutely no reason to believe that Jesus had anything to do with this God.

Why should we believe that Jesus had anything to do with this God if there is no "religion" that we need to embrace?

Jesus is the demigod of Christianity. Period. Outside of this Jesus is nothing.

We have no reason to single out the demigod myths about Jesus as supposedly having something to do with any God. Unless they DO have something to do with a a God. And if they do, then my point stands. This God is behind a specific RELIGION (i.e. the religion that worships Jesus as the demigod Son of Yahweh).

That's a RELIGION Tam.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 1 by 2Dbunk]

Oppression and racism is a part of this present system of things - the fault for such thing lays clearly with those who refuse to love each other as He commands. God has allowed this for the same reason He has allowed all suffering.

Why has God allowed suffering?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 722#908722

The true religion can be identified by the fact that it unites people of all races together in a loving international interracial brotherhood.

Rafika Morris: I Wanted to Fight Injustice
https://www.jw.org/en/publications/vide ... 14_1_VIDEO

Johny and Gideon: Once Enemies, Now Brothers
https://tv.jw.org/#en/mediaitems/VODInt ... 06_1_VIDEO

[youtube][/youtube]


Jehovah's Witnesses at one of their Internatinal Conventions

[Willum]

[Replying to post 3 by tam]

OK, so answer the never-before answered question -
God isn't responsible for this, he isn't responsible for that, just what is he responsible for?

Please cite a modern example of what he can be relied on to do.
What are his duties as a Christian deity.

What is a single thing that he can be relied on to do?
No future unprovables, no past unprovables, what is God responsible for?

[2Dbunk]

tam: I am at peace when I argue against nebulous claims of Faith. As a rational participant in life's discourse, it is presented to me as a nonsensical conundrum. I can walk away and dismiss it, or I can argue my concern for it. I have no recourse except to blame those who promote the God concept.

morefish: It's disgusting that you believe in such nonsense.

Overcomer: Whitewash !! Hogwash !!

tam: You miss the point. If God is omniscient then HE KNEW what he was creating -- no excuses needed !!

[tam]

Peace to you DI,

[Replying to post 10 by tam]

I appreciate you opinions Tam, but as far as I am concerned there is no possible way to rip Jesus out of this religion and pretend that he could somehow on his own two feet separate from it.

Why not? (not that my Lord Jaheshua stands apart from His Father, but from religion... why not?)

Jesus is nothing if not the Son of Yahweh.

Jaheshua, but yes... my Lord is the Son of Yahveh.

Jesus has no authority to offer anyone eternal life if he's not the Son of Yahweh.

So my Lord is not apart from His Father; that does not mean that "Christendom" is from Him or from His Father.

Far more importantly, Jesus would have nothing to offer people "salvation from" if not from the wrath and judgement of Yahweh.

He saves us from the wages of sin: death; and He reconciles us to His Father; and we have forgiveness in Him. No judgement.

What's Jesus saving you from if not the wrath of Yahweh?

Death.

You can't detach Jesus from this religion, nor can Jesus be used to create a stand-alone religion.

What religion? Why do you equate God with religion as if they are one and the same? The ONLY religion that God ever sanctioned was the Temple/priesthood given to Israel. BUT once His Son came, God told us to listen to HIM. God removed His spirit from the temple, places it in His Son. We are to come to and listen to His Son. The ONLY one who reveals God to us.

"No one knows the Father except the Son, and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal Him."

Jesus is nothing if you reject Yahweh.

I do not reject Yahveh.

Yahweh is the God of this religion, not Jesus.

What religion?

God is the Father of Christ, and Christ is the Truth to whom God told us to come and to listen.

Moreover, how does your position change the situation of Jesus supposedly dying for the purpose of making our salvation possible?

If you change that, then you have basically rejected "Christianity" entirely.

One does not need to accept "Christianity" (the religion), in order to accept that Christ gave His life for us.



Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

[Divine Insight]

I appreciate you opinions Tam, but as far as I am concerned there is no possible way to rip Jesus out of this religion and pretend that he could somehow on his own two feet separate from it.

Why not? (not that my Lord Jaheshua stands apart from His Father, but from religion... why not?)[/quote]

Because you wouldn't have a clue that some guy named Jesus ever existed if it wasn't for the religious doctrines that tell you what he supposedly had said.

Moreover, if Jesus wants to use the Gospels to spread his "WORDS" then it's entirely his responsibility to make certain those words are true and correct. Therefore Jesus has full responsibility for the religion of Christianity which claims to be teaching people what Jesus had supposedly said.

You can't escape the religious aspect of it. Jesus would need to take responsibility for anything and everything that Christianity teaches IN HIS NAME.

Jesus is nothing if not the Son of Yahweh.

Jaheshua, but yes... my Lord is the Son of Yahveh.

Well, there you go. Now not only does Jesus need to take responsibility for the entire content of New Testament, but Yahweh needs to take responsibility for the entire content of the Old Testament.

These characters can't be expecting people to know what they mean outside of what these texts claim these characters have said.

So any attempt to try to separate Jesus or Yahweh from this religion is futile. You would never know that these character existed if it wasn't for the religious text from which you have learned about them either directly, or indirectly.

Jesus has no authority to offer anyone eternal life if he's not the Son of Yahweh.

So my Lord is not apart from His Father; that does not mean that "Christendom" is from Him or from His Father.

But now you're talking about "Christendom", that's not "Christianity".

Christianity is the written doctrines (i.e. whatever is written in the Bible). And even that is fairly meaningless since there are many versions of the Bible.

Jesus and Yahweh would need to be fully responsible for ever work written in their supposed "Holy Tests" which defines their "religion".

Jesus and Yahweh have no meaning outside of the religion of Christianity. Well, Yahweh clearly goes back to Judaism too, but that's also a religion. So there's no escaping the religious aspect of it.

Far more importantly, Jesus would have nothing to offer people "salvation from" if not from the wrath and judgement of Yahweh.

He saves us from the wages of sin: death; and He reconciles us to His Father; and we have forgiveness in Him. No judgement.

There absolutely needs to be a 'judgment' that proclaims that a so-called 'sin' has even occurred before there could be forgiveness or salvation for having committed the so-called 'sin'.

It sounds to me like you are in total denial regarding what this religion is even about.

What's Jesus saving you from if not the wrath of Yahweh?

Death.

Who's threatening you with death?

You can't detach Jesus from this religion, nor can Jesus be used to create a stand-alone religion.

What religion? Why do you equate God with religion as if they are one and the same? The ONLY religion that God ever sanctioned was the Temple/priesthood given to Israel.

In that case, this God would be totally responsible for any failings in the Temple/priesthood of Israel, and according to this religious mythology that organization failed miserably. So that would be God's failure to maintain his Temple/priesthood.

BUT once His Son came, God told us to listen to HIM. God removed His spirit from the temple, places it in His Son. We are to come to and listen to His Son. The ONLY one who reveals God to us.

That's impossible for us Tam. We've never met Jesus. All we have are hearsay rumors recorded in the Gospels. Is Jesus taking responsibility for making certain that this dogma is pristine, unadulterated, and says precisely what Jesus means to say without any ambiguity?

If so, then why can't any two Christians agree on what Jesus message was?

And if not, then my point has been made.

"No one knows the Father except the Son, and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal Him."

You'll need to excuse me while I roll my eyes here.

I mean, seriously, all you are doing here is regurgitating the dogma of this religion just about verbatim.

Jesus is nothing if you reject Yahweh.

I do not reject Yahveh.

Then you necessarily embrace the religion that describes this God.

Yahweh is the God of this religion, not Jesus.

What religion?

The religion that claims to have the "Holy Texts" that supposedly contains the instructions, commandments, and ultimatums of this God.

God is the Father of Christ, and Christ is the Truth to whom God told us to come and to listen.

God never told anyone anything. All that exists are the "Holy Texts" of this religion that make proclamations in the name of this imaginary God.

And this brings this all right back to my point. If these "Holy Texts" actually belong to some God, then it's his job to maintain them and make sure they aren't abused.

Whether you like it or not, the God of this religion choose to use religion as his means of communication.

Apparently you do not approve of this God's methods.

Moreover, how does your position change the situation of Jesus supposedly dying for the purpose of making our salvation possible?

If you change that, then you have basically rejected "Christianity" entirely.

One does not need to accept "Christianity" (the religion), in order to accept that Christ gave His life for us.

You absolutely do.

It is this religion that makes these claims about Jesus.

Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

I'm sorry tammy, but from your posts it seems pretty clear that you are a slave to religion.

There is no "Christ". Even if there was a Christ some 2000+ ago, all he left us with was a religion based on unreliable hearsay rumors about him. Rumors that even require that we accept and belief previous rumors from the Old Testament.

At the very best, all you can really do is claim that Christianity is the religion started by Christ.

To make any other claim doesn't even make any sense.

You can't know Christ. All you can know is the hearsay rumors about him.

Period.

You can't even place your faith in Christ because he never wrote anything down. At best, all you can place your faith in is Mark, Matthew, Luke, John, Paul, or some other character who claims to speak on Christ's behave.

And this brings it right back to my original point. If Christ isn't keeping all those guys in line, as well as any priests who claim to be teaching his WORD, then he's failing to keep his 'religion' in good order.

We can't escape the fact that this is a 'religion'.

Even if Christ and Yahweh were real, they would still be responsible for having started a 'religion' and then not keeping it well-maintained.

There's simply no getting around that fact.

[Divine Insight]

He saves us from the wages of sin: death

By the way, where do you get the idea that the wages of sin is death?

This comes from this religion tam. This isn't some kind of absolute fact that everyone just happens to be aware of.

No God has ever told me that the wages of sin is death.

I've only ever heard this claim from the Abrahamic religions.

[marco]

Why has God allowed suffering?


The true religion can be identified by the fact that it unites people of all races together in a loving international interracial brotherhood.

Rafika Morris: I Wanted to Fight Injustice

Johny and Gideon: Once Enemies, Now Brothers

Moderator Comment

There may be the intention to offer saving advice here but it is preaching. Best stick to the topic.

Please review the Rules.


______________

Moderator comments do not count as a strike against any posters. They only serve as an acknowledgment that a post report has been received, but has not been judged to warrant a moderator warning against a particular poster. Any challenges or replies to moderator postings should be made via Private Message to avoid derailing topics.

[Donray]

[Replying to post 13 by JehovahsWitness]

Why do you always reference JW stuff? Can't you put things into your own words thoughts? Every one of your posts appears to be dogmatic proselytizing.