Trump's new approach: law-and-disorder

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Tcg
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Trump's new approach: law-and-disorder

Post #1

Post by Tcg »

Federal Officers Hit Portland Mayor With Tear Gas

PORTLAND, Ore. — The mayor of Portland, Ted Wheeler, was left coughing and wincing in the middle of his own city Wednesday night after federal officers deployed tear gas into a crowd of protesters that Mr. Wheeler had joined outside the federal courthouse.
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The city has become a target of President Trump, who has embraced a law-and-order message in his re-election campaign. While federal officers were deployed to Portland to purportedly quell unrest and protect federal property, their arrival has only galvanized the movement, with the numbers of protesters each night swelling into the thousands.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/23/us/p ... mayor.html
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What are Trump's goals with this law-and-disorder?

What are the legal ramifications of Trump's use of Federal Agents not just against U.S. citizens, but also against one of our nation's mayors?


Tcg
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Re: Trump's new approach: law-and-disorder

Post #2

Post by AgnosticBoy »

Tcg wrote: Thu Jul 23, 2020 4:39 pm
Federal Officers Hit Portland Mayor With Tear Gas

PORTLAND, Ore. — The mayor of Portland, Ted Wheeler, was left coughing and wincing in the middle of his own city Wednesday night after federal officers deployed tear gas into a crowd of protesters that Mr. Wheeler had joined outside the federal courthouse.
.
.
The city has become a target of President Trump, who has embraced a law-and-order message in his re-election campaign. While federal officers were deployed to Portland to purportedly quell unrest and protect federal property, their arrival has only galvanized the movement, with the numbers of protesters each night swelling into the thousands.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/23/us/p ... mayor.html
.
What are Trump's goals with this law-and-disorder?

What are the legal ramifications of Trump's use of Federal Agents not just against U.S. citizens, but also against one of our nation's mayors?


Tcg
There are no ramifications because force can be used against non peaceful protests. So the problem here is that your point is built on a lot of fiction. Here's the same Portland mayor condemning the protestors:


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Re: Trump's new approach: law-and-disorder

Post #3

Post by Wootah »

[Replying to Tcg in post #1]

These democrat run towns are deliberately allowing chaos in order to win an election. How immoral is that?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics_ ... te%20taxes.

What's more there seems to be a deliberate attempt to have the virus flare up by allowing public gatherings. Again, if the virus goes away in an election year, it would be bad for democrats/republicans and good for Trump.

It's just base politics.
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Re: Trump's new approach: law-and-disorder

Post #4

Post by koko »

Even the ultra right wing Fox network commentators have condemned Trump's actions as unconstitutional and illegal. This was a matter discussed on another thread so I will not re post those data.

However, a new issue has arisen in regard to this and that is a temporary restraining order issued against Trump's jack booted thugs:


https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/7 ... #read-more


Federal judge issues restraining order against Trump's federal agents in Portland

Jessica Sutherland



PORTLAND, OR - JULY 17: Federal officers prepare to disperse the crowd of protestors outside the Multnomah County Justice Center on July 17, 2020 in Portland, Oregon. Federal law enforcement agencies attempt to intervene as protests continue in Portland. (Photo by Mason Trinca/Getty Images)

Six days after the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) of Oregon added agents from the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) and United States Marshals to its existing lawsuit against the City of Portland and the Portland Police Bureau, a federal judge has issued a temporary restraining order (TRO) against the Donald Trump-deployed secret police.

The original class-action lawsuit was filed June 30 on behalf of journalists and legal observers.

The attorneys (asked) the federal judge to issue a temporary restraining order to immediately prohibit law enforcement from:

Using any form of physical force against a journalist or legal observer, including tear gas, pepper spray, rubber bullets, and flash-bang grenades;
Arresting or threatening to arrest journalists and legal observers or seizing their equipment;
Threatening, harassing, or intimidating a journalist or legal observer;
Using indiscriminate force against crowds that are likely to contain journalists or legal observers;
"Kettling" or "killboxing" crowds that are likely to include journalists or legal observers; and
Ordering or forcing journalists or legal observers to disperse, or to stop recording or observing a protest.
The lawsuit, Woodstock v. City of Portland … seeks an order declaring law enforcement’s actions unconstitutional and prohibiting them from targeting and attacking journalists again. The lawsuit also seeks damages for injuries sustained.

Unfortunately, the TRO issued Thursday lasts two weeks, and applies only to the press and legal observers.


U.S. District Judge Michael H. Simon signaled early in the day that he was leaning towards issuing the order. All eyes have been on Portland in recent days, as federal agents unleashed upon Portland have come under repeated, widespread, and intense scrutiny and criticism for not just their acts of force against peaceful protesters, but against press, legal observers, and even the Portland mayor. Attorneys for the fascists Trump administration didn’t make much of a case.

Andrew Warden, serving as counsel for the federal government, argued the federal law enforcement were in a volatile and dangerous situation on the ground and said the order the judge was considering would place law enforcement in an “impossible position” where they had to choose between protecting public safety and risking running afoul of the court’s orders.

Warden claimed that it’s “not realistic to ask law enforcement officers to verify press passes or hat color while trying to restore order in a chaotic situation where lasers are being shot at them to blind them, fireworks are being targeted at them, everyone’s wearing masks, helmets, face coverings.” Warden also lamented that “nearly everyone appears to have a camera or a cellphone out to record things further making it difficult to distinguish legitimate journalists from others.”

Judge Simon was unimpressed by Warden’s hot take.

After Warden made his opening remarks, Simon questioned whether any injuries were caused to federal officers or damage had been caused to the courthouse by anyone who was a journalist or a legal observer.

He also questioned whether federal officers had received specific training in crowd control.

The attorney said they had no evidence of a journalist or legal observer causing damage.

He didn’t know the extent of the training, , but pointed the judge toward a recent press conference by the acting Secretary of the Department of Homeland Security Chad Wolf.

This story is developing.



Anyone of true constitutional principles will readily agree. There is no valid basis for Trump to send in those thugs.

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Re: Trump's new approach: law-and-disorder

Post #5

Post by Wootah »

[Replying to koko in post #4]

Correction - the status quo condemns Trump's actions.

Can't you see we are being gamed and they fake this left-right nonsense? They don't care if you watch Fox or CNN so long as you hate.

Also, Trump is part of the show. He just knows how game shows work.

The only solution is to not accept binaries and stop feeding the beast.
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Re: Trump's new approach: law-and-disorder

Post #6

Post by AgnosticBoy »

[Replying to koko in post #4]

Even the Portland mayor admitted that the protestors are getting out of hand. I posted video of that in post 2. So much for your narrative of "peaceful" protests.

So in a lot of cases the Feds are more than justified to use force.

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Re: Trump's new approach: law-and-disorder

Post #7

Post by Tcg »

koko wrote: Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:23 pm
The attorneys (asked) the federal judge to issue a temporary restraining order to immediately prohibit law enforcement from:

Using any form of physical force against a journalist or legal observer, including tear gas, pepper spray, rubber bullets, and flash-bang grenades;
Perhaps they'll need to add mayors, governors, members of congress, vice presidents, supreme court justices and presidents to the list.


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Re: Trump's new approach: law-and-disorder

Post #8

Post by AgnosticBoy »

Tcg wrote: Fri Jul 24, 2020 12:01 am
koko wrote: Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:23 pm
The attorneys (asked) the federal judge to issue a temporary restraining order to immediately prohibit law enforcement from:

Using any form of physical force against a journalist or legal observer, including tear gas, pepper spray, rubber bullets, and flash-bang grenades;
Perhaps they'll need to add mayors, governors, members of congress, vice presidents, supreme court justices and presidents to the list.


Tcg
How does that fit into the Liberal standard given that they want no police? Tear gas and rubber bullets can't fly around when you take away the police.

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Re: Trump's new approach: law-and-disorder

Post #9

Post by Bust Nak »

Wootah wrote: Thu Jul 23, 2020 10:00 pm The only solution is to not accept binaries and stop feeding the beast.
Sounds good but what are the practical steps? The US is trapped in a two party system.

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Re: Trump's new approach: law-and-disorder

Post #10

Post by Wootah »

Bust Nak wrote: Fri Jul 24, 2020 5:22 am
Wootah wrote: Thu Jul 23, 2020 10:00 pm The only solution is to not accept binaries and stop feeding the beast.
Sounds good but what are the practical steps? The US is trapped in a two party system.
No - you put the bell on the cat.

I think be an individual and look at policies and stop demonising and scapegoating. The project is individual. Follow Jesus, listen to Jordan Peterson and carry your cross and make the sacrifice and grin and bear the suffering of life rather than lashing out. It's all going to hell anyway, the difference is the speed.
Proverbs 18:17 The one who states his case first seems right, until the other comes and examines him.

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