Infinite time?

[charris]

It seems to me possible that there is an infinite time, specifically that of the past. All that would be required is for a previous event or cause (depending on you interpretation of QM).

I mentioned this, and was met with the objection, "If the past was infinite, then it would have taken an infinite amount of time to get here." I personally think this objection is pointless, so maybe if you think this is the case you could expound upon it. If you disagree, then if you could post your reasons as well I would appreciate it.

Also, if you disagree because of other reasons, I would like to hear them.

[TheJackelantern]

YES, you got it!

You do realize this is an utter fail right?... Higher dimensional complexity requires more cause to exist.. And those dimensional planes can not exist without our lower dimensional planes.. That's right, your GOD wouldn't exist without us lol! In this context, our existence is the physics of his existence lol. Hence, you are looking in the wrong direction son! And let's not forget that existence itself is the entire sum total of it all! Fun Stuff!

How could I argue about the existence of nothing if I didn’t possess a good solid concept of it?

You have no understanding of the concept.. You are actually not intelligent enough to comprehend the context of saying "Nothings exists"... This requires the either real genuine stupidity, or someone trying to, in futility, play a game of intentional ignorance as if those they are playing with are some how not smart enough to notice.

I almost laughed when you said you were nothing.. I quote: "I arian am nothing".. To even use "I" suggests you are coming from a position of having an identity.. Just saying "I" is still more than nothing.. It's even worse when you attempt that argument while posting it on the internet as if that was proof that nothing exists lol. You clearly are desperate here to start playing these games.


PostPosted: Sat Jan 21, 2012 9:32 pm Post subject:
Part 2

TheJackelantern wrote:
arian wrote:
You know well I did not call you a God hater, you are my friend. It is that God-hating science


I can't be a GOD hater since I make no assumptions on the character of anything anyone might like to worship as a GOD. There may be a scientist being out there who induced a big bang either on purpose or by accident. However, GOD in such a concept is a matter of opinion. I don't hate the Pantheist GOD either. It is after all the top of the totem pole when it comes to GOD's.. But again that is a matter of opinion. And science can't hate GOD's, it doesn't even address the issue :/ Science studies existence to better understand it.. How is that hating?


Your imagined scientist creating a big-bang either on purpose or by accident would be correct by the sci-fi big bang theory. It is how you imagine the tiny pin-sized universe to be at the Planck epoch; ‘in a point in space’. The scientist resides in spacetime, creates a big-bang and there you have your ‘bubble within a bubble within a bubble.’ A very big question still remains, … “where does the FIRST bubble residing IN?�

You see, the Bible explains this, for GOD our Creator IS, as He said to Moses, “I Am�, thus all our questions to physics, to mechanics are answered along to our ‘none-physical’ consciousness. Consciousness is the first step to creation, now all we need is the material to create it, and the ‘energy’ to make it work. God again is the answer to all that, for in Him we live, think and have our existance;

1 Cor 11:12
12 For as woman was made from man, in the same way man is born of woman; and it is God who brings everything into existence.
TEV

1 Peter 3:18-20
18 For Christ died for sins once and for all, a good man on behalf of sinners, in order to lead you to God. He was put to death physically, but made alive spiritually, 19 and in his spiritual existence he went and preached to the imprisoned spirits. 20 These were the spirits of those who had not obeyed God when he waited patiently during the days that Noah was building his boat.
TEV

1 Peter 4:6
6 That is why the Good News was preached also to the dead, to those who had been judged in their physical existence as everyone is judged; it was preached to them so that in their spiritual existence they may live as God lives.
TEV

Rev 4:11
11 "Our Lord and God! You are worthy
to receive glory, honor, and power.
For you created all things,
and by your will they were given existence and life."
TEV

Studying existence is not hating, enjoying existence is not hating, but saying the Creator did not make it is hate, especially knowing how kind and gentle our God is.
Driving a Ford Mustang is not hating, changing to improve the car is not hating, ... but ripping it apart and then saying it evolved from energy and that Ford had nothing to do with it, is IMO, hate my dear friend.

TheJackelantern wrote:
arian wrote:
you are my friend.


I don't mind being your friend either since I don't use division of ideology and religious beliefs as a judgement tool for friendship. Though I think our relationship here is a challenge each other relationship because I think we both like the challenge. Wink


And neither do I believe in using it as a judgement tool. I would like nothing more that to meat everyone I have debated on this forum, I have posted my real name and address many times, but neither Christian nor atheist has once taken me up on the offer. Sad

I would sure like to meet you my friend, I am not intimidating in person, kids smile at me wherever I go. I look more like papa-Smurf, and feel like one that was run over by a car. Sad Laughing
Take me up on it? Nice weather here in Phoenix. Angel

TheJackelantern wrote:
arian wrote:

Look at North Korea my friend, now there is a country without emotion.


I'm a hardcore secularist. Atheist states are as bad as theocracies..


I agree, so taking GOD out of the equation did not give us any satisfactory answers has it? It only created a life of hell on earth. I know, I lived in an atheist country.

We have a lot in common; I would hate to see this country governed by some religion. Man has suffered enough from religion throughout the centuries. I am a true believer in Jesus Christ and what He had to offer, pure unselfish love; "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" and not just in some church building on Sunday! (I don't belong to any religion, nor go to any church) where they teach you to; "go and make disciples in all the nations" and later send their sons and daughters to kill those very converts ‘in all those nations’. Christians killing Christians, Muslims killing Muslims, while Satan is laughing his butt off. Rolling Eyes d'oh!

TheJackelantern wrote:
Hence, it's commonsense to know that the world is secular, and polytheistic. Peace comes by tolerance and co-existence and knowing that a secular system is the best possible system there can be... It's irrelevant if people realize the fact of what reality is or not in terms of science. And it's scientifically clear that human nature is relative in beliefs for various and many reasons. And that is where theists and non-theists need to work together. Extremists on any side is a bad thing.


I agree my friend, “It's irrelevant if people realize the fact of what reality is or not in terms of science�. The problem is that spiritual plain, where thoughts are being influenced one way, then another. This is where the powers and principalities come into play, and the decisions made that influences our physical reality.

The Nazi regime and Hitler was a recent good example of this. What do we understand in “working together�? Your understanding could be very different than mine, … do you agree?
The Nazis wanted good for all mankind, a perfect world without the sick, the maimed, where neither rich or poor would exist, but everyone to share everything, a perfect Utopia. So to make this dream happen, they needed to do some major cleansing on this earth. First, the greedy little money mongers like the Jews, the Gipsy’s, the mentally ill, the contracting skin colors (anything other than white) the sick, the lame and the old all had to be removed from society. If you looked like the Jesus paintings (blond, blue eyed), you were in luck. Girls would spread their legs to have your baby. If not, … well you know the story.

We are once again facing this human, this physical version of ‘cleansing the earth’ of all the clutter, it is under the cause; “One World Order�. It seems nice, as did Communism, only the ‘absolute good, the absolute truth’ is left out. “There is NO absolute truth� they say (ignoring the Bible, Gods Word) “but we must come up with our own version of ‘truth’ based on purely physical standards, for the physical is all there is!� (Can you hear Satan laughing?)

With this kind of ‘Vulcan’ logic, the obviously ugly, the old, the sick and the crippled are to be exterminated, and quickly buried. Only the genetically perfect is to enjoy life on earth. When these perfect ones get old, or hurt where they become crippled, well there is ‘Renewal’ (see the movie Logan’s Run). Everyone gathers for that special event ‘Renewal’, for the horror of their fellow man being disintegrated or simply sacrificed on some alter is a joyous occasion, especially if a few of them come to their senses and decide to ‘run’. Now the hunt for the ‘Runner’ begins, and those that love hunting would understand the joy in this.

But where do these ideas come from, energy reacting on energy? I think not.
Here is a clue: “Look at the movies coming out today; Vampires, zombies, werewolves and witches, Wizards and Warlocks like the Harry Potter movies, Hellboy and all them books. Then there is all the PC games like ‘Grand theft Auto’, ‘Doom’, ‘Warcraft’ and hundreds of other demonic games and movies that are preparing the Unbelievers for this coming Final Battle called Armageddon. These are conflicting ideas to the truth found in the Bible. Conflicting as the BB evolution theory is to God creating the Universe and everything in it. Lies and deceptions, and because the unseen ideas are more real and powerful, it manifests itself in this physical Universe.

You don't understand that ‘atheism’ is just as big of a problem as ‘theism’. I would love to remove theism AND atheism from this world and let all men join with 'real science' to seek out and find the Creator. I have, as many others have. The Universe through science reveals more of the Power, the Love of our Heavenly Father GOD.

If you desire to start with 'energy', fine, let's start there. Let's see how Energy created this universe? Is there other sources of energy out there somewhere that created energy? Hey, maybe there is an Energy of all energies, where this (let's say) unknown Energy also possesses awareness? Wouldn't that be cool?

I mean look, ... you agree we evolved from some simple energy and became conscious beings, then why couldn't the Energy we came from also be conscious? I mean why not? Is there that possibility?

Imagine the possibilities? Imagine OUR consciousness unite with His (or its, or hers, if you wish) I don't care where we start, and what you call this energy, and I don't think your present understanding to be; He, she or It minds either, as long as we unite outside of religions on one mind, one plan to find the TRUTH, ... wouldn't that be a worthy goal for man to unite on?

Oh, ... and none of that "Imagine all the people, … living for today," garbage, for living for today" is a selfish notion. Living for OTHERS is where it’s at. Pushing for TOMORROW, for a better tomorrow starts today. If I only lived for today, I would never have learned to walk, ... right? Every moment I push forward to the future, this way I include the entire human race.

This is my understanding of GOD, not some theistic god or gods made up by man, carved out of some trees, each with their own ideas of worship and their own scare techniques scaring their worshipers, but the GOD of our very existence that includes all of us.

TheJackelantern wrote:
arian wrote:
for those debating the BB theory of evolution, showing emotion would be weird to say the least.


They do, but they also take their work very seriously.. You can't assume that scientists are all emotionally dead. The fact is that they are not. They like to enjoy life as much as you do. They love their families as much as you love yours. Yes we are energy beings.. But the full physical experience of that is being conscious energy beings. This does not make us worth less, it makes us real! Being made of energy is being made of something that has actual value. And even after death, regardless of what you believe, we will always have value simply because energy can neither be creator or destroyed. We will always belong to existence, and be of existence eternally.. Whether you believe you transcend consciously, or believe you may one day be that twinkling star in the sky that gives birth to new life. You, I, and everyone will always have purpose and value.


Yes we have value, ... that is why I would never kill another human being. Please tell me what is the difference between you calling your Creator Energy, and being of that same energy, and me calling that Energy GOD and me being created in His Image?

The Bible is NOT creating the mess we have on this earth with religion, but the opposite. God wants us to destroy religion, all those indoctrinations whether scientific, or religious. Mother Teresa was a good person who helped a lot of poor people, but she also worshipped her Church and the Pope religiously. She prayed to her idols, and taught others to do the same.

GOD stopped the religious lunatic King that started to build the Tower of Babel, for he wanted men to worship some man made idea, a One World Religion that would have robbed everyone of their identity, their person, their being, their soul and their freedom.

Don't you see man wants to worship anything and everything except the One they should, the One who wants nothing of us, only acknowledgement, so we won't forget who makes the rain fall. Either they worship a 'Day' like the 'Sabbath', or a 'name' like the god they invent and named 'Jehovah' or 'Mormo' as god, or a man like 'Joseph Smith, .. Jim Jones, the wacko-Waco, or whatever and whoever as long as it's not the ONE, the nameless who cares less of human worship (deeds), but seeks only those that worship Him in truth which can be achieved by our spirit.

What is true worship? Here, it's: "Love one another as I have loved you." He makes the sun rise on the good and on the evil, and the rain too. Some areas more and others less, but enough for all men many times over, as long as we SHARE!"

TheJackelantern wrote:
arian wrote:
This is why I said that your responses sound like they come from a tree, then a human.


Do you know why we respond like this? It's to keep the discussion honest. I will walk away from this and play with my cat shimmy for about an hour. She's adorable and a ball of fun Smile So even though it seems cold to say that we are energy beings made of atoms, and atoms made of energy ect... It's actually pretty damn amazing.. And I think on the scale of amazing to great for creation, or to be owned by any one being. Existence is amazing! And so are we!


Again I agree with you. If you only give me a chance to explain to you about this Energy, you would see that we're on the same page my friend.
An ‘Enemy’ has separated us, and if you believe that lies do exist, then this being is the ‘Father of all Lies’.

Do you actually believe you are NOT 'owned'? You are a victim and a slave as everyone on this earth. And I agree that to be a slave to some 'man made' religion is truly hell ( I have been there), but that is NOT our GOD. Look around you, especially through science and you will see that God serves US, because He loves us. He created us and takes full responsibility for our well being. Don't you have kids? Well, it’s the same thing. Our instinct comes from our Creator to love and care for our children.

There is no real physical freedom; freedom is when we are ‘content’, when we are free to express our thought, our ideas. This is the ‘freedom’ that Satan is after, to rob us from knowing the truth. This is why you act like a Vulcan in our debates. Not just you, but other atheists here as well. I know they have a sense of humor, but when I make a joke, they react like computers, “That-was-illogical-please-restate-your-comment-honestly!� Come on, … can’t you see that reality as the human mind perceives it is the joke? When you drive on the highway, does the road ahead of you ‘really’ narrows to a point? Is the sun really 10 inches in diameter?
Wake up my friend, before it’s too late.

TheJackelantern wrote:
arian wrote:

So because you can’t or because you don’t understand the Spiritual (unseen) realm you think it’s a magical place?


That specifically deals with immateriality.. Which is the same thing as saying a place made of nothing. Lacking substance is lacking value. And it's pretty difficult to see things in 3D in a realm that doesn't have any dimensional value or electromagnetism. There is a lot wrong with the concept, and I think you nailed it when you said "unseen realm"..


Why limit your being to this material world? You said we are 'energy', and we came from this energy before this material world (matter) even existed, remember?
In your BB theory, could we see this energy at the Planck epoch?

The ‘Nothing’ exists and thank God it remains nothing, so we have nothing to worry about. It is these sci-fi scientists that invent those scary ideas of black holes sucking the entire galaxy into a dark abyss. The sun turning into a red-giant and blowing up burning us all into hell, Solar Flares wiping us out, Meteors crashing and destroying the earth, … I could go on and on. So who is talking about hell now? These are the same minds that invented all the THEISTIC gods.

Look at a perfectly white dice, and put it in a room that is the same white color, with even light hitting the dice from every side. We would only see the black dots, right?

I can draw a dice on a piece of paper and give it that 3D effect, like today’s 3D movies.

But draw a cube on a white sheet of paper without the shade that defines the inner sides, you know, ... just the outline. that is how the cube really looks like without the 3D illusion. The sun is 1,392,000 km in dia. not the 10 inches we see. There is a 1,392,000 km dia. of sun ray that is going past us, only about 12,700 km dia. hits us. So looking at the sun during a solar eclipse, we have a 108 times the size of the earth light still passing all around our planet. That is not the reality we see, it is an illusion, a given handicap so this limited mind could translate ‘reality’.

TheJackelantern wrote:
Maybe a more plausible argument would be transcending into a different physical dimension / reality that doesn't violate plausibility. I can even give you an example to think about:

A child born a complete mute unable to sense this world lays on the bed. We can't see into this child's mind / world (currently speaking). And the child can't see or interact with ours either even though this child is literally apart of this world in every physical and literal way... So what if this child imagines it's own existence within its own world in relation to the brief information it has obtain during the stages of it's development in the woumb, before it was born a mute due to complications... This child wouldn't even know it had a mother, or was even born....
But what happens if this child dies in its imagined world and wakes up? What would it think of the reality, that being ours, in relation to the one it's known till it's imagined death? .. And what does that say to our own state of existence and the possibility of transcending reality? Well in this case it wouldn't violate any laws of existence, or physical laws for that matter. It wouldn't violate conservation of energy either. So that is food for thought for you.


That would be true if we were only made of energy. Blind, deaf and dumb, we are still spiritual beings residing in this tent, this physical body. The child know the mother because it can ‘feel being loved’. This is what I am trying to explain to you, for we are more than this physical realm. Our spirit knows this universe and our body and existence as a whole, only God put us in this limited body for now, and we interpret everything within set limits, as I explained.
Remember Helen Keller?

Helen Adams Keller (June 27, 1880 – June 1, 1968) was an American author, political activist, and lecturer. She was the first deaf-blind person to earn a Bachelor of Arts degree.[1][2] The story of how Keller's teacher, Anne Sullivan, broke through the isolation imposed by a near complete lack of language, allowing the girl to blossom as she learned to communicate, has become widely known through the dramatic depictions of the play and film The Miracle Worker.

A prolific author, Keller was well-traveled, and was outspoken in her opposition to war. A member of the Socialist Party of America and the Wobblies, she campaigned for women's suffrage, workers' rights, and socialism, as well as many other leftist causes

If we were energy only, THAT my friend you would undeniable have to call a 'miracle', defying all logic and most of the physical laws.

‘You’ my friend are NOT what you see in the mirror. What you see is a body made of dust, the dirt we walk on. It is what GOD placed into this physical body, this tent, this temple that is the real thing. You are a spiritual being, a living soul that resides in a limited body of dust. This body can house you, and many evil spirits, a whole legion of them:

Mark 5:8-10
8 For he said unto him, Come out of the man, thou unclean spirit.
9 And he asked him, What is thy name? And he answered, saying, My name is Legion: for we are many.
10 And he besought him much that he would not send them away out of the country.
KJV

Or you can ‘clean house’ and cast them evil spirits out and call upon the Spirit of God, and let Jesus come to stay with you. But if you enjoy lies like the Big bang Evolution theory, then you are really entertaining these wicked spirits in the body God made you responsible for. Many people ‘clean house’ and leave one religion, only to jump into another, ‘and the last state of that man is worse than the first’;

Luke 11:24-26
"When an unclean spirit goes out of a man, he goes through dry places, seeking rest; and finding none, he says, 'I will return to my house from which I came.' 25 And when he comes, he finds it swept and put in order. 26 Then he goes and takes with him seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter and dwell there; and the last state of that man is worse than the first."
NKJV

TheJackelantern wrote:
This might even give you a good idea of separation of time lines... All time lines exist in existence at the same time.. But it's a matter of shifting from one to the other. All people live their lives according to their own activities ect. Hence, there are literally billions of time lines that also share a universal one since they all exist at the same time. The only difference is they progress differently from one another, or are relative to each other. This is how time works on a basic level that doesn't need go into particle dilation to where it can get more complicated ect.


That explains only the 'moment', not past and the future time, which as I explained before, exists within GOD, and our spiritual self. But for now, we are stuck in this tent, ... except, on special occasions our God allows us to step out a bit.

Helen Keller spirit, her soul knew who she was and where she was. It was her physical senses that were incomplete which her spiritual self completed for her. The physical limitation didn’t stop her from becoming a big part of our society, even an accomplished author and an advocate for many causes. She was still complete I'd say, even more than many who can hear, speak and see.
This is what we are to wake up to, a walk according to our spirit, and not let our spirit be guided by the pleasures of the flesh, which comes by feel, seeing, touching and so on. We are given these senses to enjoy this physical realm with, that was the whole idea of this physical creation, but we cannot let it take over our soul, where we forget who we are, spiritual living beings residing in a physical body for a time.

This is a TEST. For the next ‘physical lifetime’ you will be conducting a test, and if you look at the world today, there IS a Real Emergency! And we are taught that in case of a real emergency, go to your Bible and follow its instructions.

TheJackelantern wrote:
arian wrote:
And that those who do understand this Spiritual realm, don’t use their brains?


I don't think they really thought it through... If they got rid of immateriality in their beliefs system, it might be better argument. However, the Abrihamic religions specifically state immateriality. And that is a problem. :/


Not if you understand the “Meaning of Life� as described in the Bible, … I explained above. You have to be ‘Born Again� my friend, “Born not of flesh (you already have that) but of the Spirit�

TheJackelantern wrote:
arian wrote:
I understand that in the Spiritual realm the 3D illusion will be gone, and “we will see everything as it really IS� which is in all dimensions.


This would require you to increase in dimensional complexity. Like having a 11 dimensional brain with 11 dimensional sensory organs ect.. Basically you are speaking about evolving to higher beings.


YES, you got it!

1 Cor 15:52-55
52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54 So when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: "Death is swallowed up in victory."

Yay for volcanoes! ... err wait!

[arian]

My friend, I really do believe you could use a little help from the 'site-supporters' here.

Thank you for derailing a good OP.

[TheJackelantern]

My friend, I really do believe you could use a little help from the 'site-supporters' here.

Thank you for derailing a good OP.

No I have dyslexia and it's really hard to make sure the posts come out right. It was too late to edit the post... However, I do believe I hadn't derailed the op, and we already established existence is the eternal element and time is a consequence of existence..

[arian]

My friend, I really do believe you could use a little help from the 'site-supporters' here.

Thank you for derailing a good OP.

No I have dyslexia and it's really hard to make sure the posts come out right. It was too late to edit the post... However, I do believe I hadn't derailed the op, and we already established existence is the eternal element and time is a consequence of existence..

yes, that would make sense, because you are a very intelligent man, the post made me wonder for a second.
Thank you.

OK then, ...

Existence
1. being real: the state of being real, actual, or current, rather than imagined, invented, or obsolete
Microsoft® Encarta®

I place these simple definition to make sure we are focusing on the same word and the same meaning of that word. It is mostly for me (lack of schooling), please don't take it offensively.

If 'Existence' is a state of being real, 'rather than imagined', would suggest that our imagination, our thoughts, our plans, our dreams, hopes, desires are NOT real! How can energy create this complex universe, and us biological man as we are today, and then after the claimed 13 some billion years later create 'imagination', which is stated as NOT real?

Wouldn't you say that something or someone (energy or GOD) had to have a pretty good 'imagination' to create this 'existence' we are part of?

This is what I have been pointing out to everyone, that over time, people have reinterpreted words to fit their belief system of the times. How could anyone come to the truth in such a way? There has to be some 'absolutes', or we'll end up creating theories like the Big-bang and Evolution to replace our Creator GOD.

What if the meaning of the word 'Existence' is defined backwards?

It is actually GODS 'imagination' that 'invented' 'existence", just as we, His creation, 'imagine and invent' things.
Now I can prove this is true, because I never created a project without imagining it first. It is only after I imagine it do I start to invent it, then put some elbow-grease behind it and 'create' it. How could I create anything without 'imagining' it first?

Just like Atheism, if you claim to be an atheist, you HAVE to know about all the theistic god and gods, only you choose not to worship any of them. That was the original meaning. People got tired of all them gods, one in the garden protecting the vegetables, another in the bedroom helping the guy get an erection, another one to increase fertility, .. oh man, oh man, gods everywhere they turned.

So one day a guy said: "The hell with this. My garden is a dried up mess, my sex life is 'non-existent', I have no kids, ... I'm through with all these gods!"

As more and more people turned away from such foolishness, the priests labeled them 'Atheists', not that they didn't believe these gods existed, of course they did, only they no longer 'believed these gods could do' what the priest claimed they could. They no longer believed IN THEM, and not that they didn't exist.

Now remember that by this time these Gentiles have completely forgot their Creator, the God with no name, this is why they created all them gods. Since we know through history they did not know the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob ("I Am God"), Pagan Theism did NOT include OUR Creator. They did not know Him nor seen Him, so Our Creator did not really exist, or was 'unknown' for them.

This is why I say I am an Atheist, because I don't 'believe' that all those pagan gods could do anything that people claim they can, nor do I fear them, just as the atheists of old. Do I believe they exists? Sure, just like Santa exists, in the minds of all those Pagans who worship them. I know what Santa is about, where he supposedly lives, what he supposedly does and I see an image of him everywhere during Christmas. He exists as a fake/false god.
This is why todays Christianity accepts the Trinity Doctrine (the three-gods-in-one), Santa Claus, the worship of the Christ-Tree, the gods with names, even if its Biblical names, the gods that can be worshipped on a certain day like Sabbath-god, the warmonger Baptist god, the god Mormo and so on, ... because it fits within their 'Pagan-Theistic' beliefs.

So let us put everything in order and in the proper perspective, otherwise we end up with what we have today; Chaos creating the Universe.

So 'imagination' must come before creation, and Creation before existence.
Energy is the force (elbow grease) behind creation, and 'existence' is the result of 'Creation'. Energy must be produced by someone or something, and since we know the human body can produce an incredible amount of energy, .. than the 'image' we were created in GOD must be the source of ALL energy.

As you see, everything points to Bible-GOD (not any of the theistic gods) It's time to seek the One True God who has no name and cannot be seen, yet the undeniable source of existence.

Education, a brilliant mind, (which I believe you have, as many others here do) must be protected, because if it falls into the wrong hands, .. it can be a deadly catastrophic weapon. Einstein and many other scientists have proven this.

So use it to seek the Lord, for God is the answer, and His Son Jesus Christ is the Way ... to GOD.

Using my friend Otsengs quote: "Come, let us reason together!"

[TheJackelantern]

If 'Existence' is a state of being real, 'rather than imagined', would suggest that our imagination, our thoughts, our plans, our dreams, hopes, desires are NOT real! How can energy create this complex universe, and us biological man as we are today, and then after the claimed 13 some billion years later create 'imagination', which is stated as NOT real?

I am only going to respond to this considering the rest of your argument is just babble... The context of the meaning of this is that objects of the imagination have no relevance beyond just being objects of the imagination... Yes a pixie fairy exist as an idea, concept, art, or characters in various literature and media. However, pixie fairies have no relevance beyond that. Hence, I am not going to meet a real living pixie fairy.. The imagined thing is only real in the context of being an imagined thing.

imaginedpast participle, past tense of im·ag·ine (Verb)
Verb:

Form a mental image or concept of.
Believe (something unreal or untrue)

Hence a pixie fairy would be classified as a non-entity:

non·en·ti·ty
noun \-ˈen-tə-tē, -ˈe-nə-\
1 : something that does not exist or exists only in the imagination
2 : nonexistence
3 : a person or thing of little or no consequence or significance

Now I can prove this is true, because I never created a project without imagining it first.

You never created a project without first a source of inquiry either.. And that brings us back here my imagined friend:

A: There can be no choice, or decision made without information
B: There can be no consciousness or awareness without information
C: One can not have knowledge without information
D: One can not do anything without information
E: One can not exist without informational value
F: One can not think without information
G: One can not even know one's self exists without information
H: One can not reply, respond, or react without information
I: One can not convey, send, or express a message without information
J: There can be no morals, ethics, or laws without information
K: One can not have or express emotions, or feelings without information
L: One can not have experiences, or experience anything at all without information
M: One can not have a place to exist in order to be existent without information
N: One can not Create, or Design anything without information
O: One can not have the ability to process things without information
P: Intelligence can not exist without information to apply
Q: No system, or process can exist without information
R: Cause and effect can not exist without information
S: Logic can not exist without information
T: Reason can not exist or things can not have a reason / purpose without information
U: There can be no meaning without information
V: There can be no value without information
W: There can be no capacity without informational value
Y: There can be no complexity without informational structure
Z: There can be no "I" without the information that gives I an Identity.

[myth-one.com]

Time distortion has been proven on ultra-precise watches on ultrasonic planes that travel around the earth and show discrepancies.

In 1967, the 13th General Conference on Weights and Measures first defined the International System (SI) unit of time, the second, in terms of atomic time rather than the motion of the Earth. Specifically, a second was defined as the duration of 9,192,631,770 cycles of microwave light absorbed or emitted by the hyperfine transition of cesium-133 atoms in their ground state undisturbed by external fields.

So a "second" in time is defined as 9,192,631,770 cycles as described above. Thus, we can build cesium clocks to measure time in well-defined seconds.

A "cesium(-beam) atomic clock" (or "cesium-beam frequency standard") is a device that uses as a reference the exact frequency of the microwave spectral line emitted by atoms of the metallic element cesium, in particular its isotope of atomic weight 133 ("Cs-133"). The integral of frequency is time, so this frequency, 9,192,631,770 hertz (Hz = cycles/second), provides the fundamental unit of time, which may thus be measured by cesium clocks.

We then design experiments to prove that time changes with relative speed. One of the first was as follows:

In 1971, experimenters from the U.S. Naval Observatory undertook an experiment to test time dilation . They made airline flights around the world in both directions, each circuit taking about three days. They carried with them four cesium beam atomic clocks. When they returned and compared their clocks with the clock of the Observatory in Washington, D.C., they had gained about 0.15 microseconds compared to the ground based clock.

But these experiments do not prove that time slows down with speed!

What they prove is that the frequency of the microwave spectral line emitted by atoms of the metallic element cesium, in particular its isotope of atomic weight 133 ("Cs-133") is not exact.

Those who defined a "second" in time recognized this possibility. A second is not every 9,192,631,770 cycles. A second is the period of time required for "9,192,631,770 cycles of microwave light absorbed or emitted by the hyperfine transition of cesium-133 atoms in their ground state undisturbed by external fields."

If the "time" required for these 9,192,631,770 cycles differs as a function of speed and elevation, then one's first conclusion should be that one or more of the airborne cesium clocks did not meet the requirement of being "in their ground state undisturbed by external fields."

Do you know of any efforts to show that external forces did not cause these shifts in the time required for the 9,192,631,770 cycles in the airborne cesium clocks?

[TheRootOfDavid]

It seems to me possible that there is an infinite time, specifically that of the past. All that would be required is for a previous event or cause (depending on you interpretation of QM).

I mentioned this, and was met with the objection, "If the past was infinite, then it would have taken an infinite amount of time to get here." I personally think this objection is pointless, so maybe if you think this is the case you could expound upon it. If you disagree, then if you could post your reasons as well I would appreciate it.

Also, if you disagree because of other reasons, I would like to hear them.

Time is not infinite. Time begin, when it was created.

[LittleNipper]

I'm not sure of a response. I believe the TRIUNE GOD has always existed; however, I believe that time itself was created by GOD. Time is a measurement of events (travel being one of them) and not existence. So, until GOD chose to perform an act, was there any time space continuum? It would appear not. GOD created it as some point of HIS existence.

[elphidium55]

Some cosmologists and philosophers posit a distinction between metric versus non-metric time. They hypothesize that the big bang is best understood as a boundary between the fully demarcated space time we now inhabit and some prior state in which there was so little structure and regularity that nothing could be measured. Yet even though duration would have been unknowable in such a non-metric space, it could still be a fact in that space that (some) causes precede their effects. So we would still have "before" and "after" but no measure of how much "before" and "after". So it might be that prior to the big bang we have amorphous time-like causal relationships without in theory being able to say how long this prior state lasted.

[Clownboat]

I'm not sure of a response. I believe the TRIUNE GOD has always existed; however, I believe that time itself was created by GOD. Time is a measurement of events (travel being one of them) and not existence. So, until GOD chose to perform an act, was there any time space continuum? It would appear not. GOD created it as some point of HIS existence.

Which god concept did this and how did you come about this knowledge? This is amazing! Unless you invented this idea out of thin air that is. If that is the case, I would like to unsubscribe from your newsletter.