Evidence for Creationism?

[DanieltheDragon]

Taking evolution, Big Bang, and abiogenesis out of the equation. What is the evidence for creationism?

Can creationism stand on its own merit?

[Talishi]

Taking evolution, Big Bang, and abiogenesis out of the equation. What is the evidence for creationism? Can creationism stand on its own merit?

No. Creationism has a 6,000 year old universe. We can see light that originated from billions of light-years away. Creationism has animals created on Day Five in Genesis 1, and man created before all animals in Genesis 2. Creationism has water, a molecule containing oxygen, existing four days before the stars that cooked oxygen via fusion even existed.

[theStudent]

[Replying to post 1 by DanieltheDragon]

Did you mean creationism, or creation?
The reason I am asking, is because creationism is more commonly known as:
The literal belief in the account of Creation given in the Book of Genesis.
That being that the creation of life on earth was literally six 24-hour days.
I don't believe that, but I do believe there is evidence for creation.
So I'm just trying to determine what specifically you are asking.

[DanieltheDragon]

[Replying to post 3 by theStudent]

YEC, OEC, intelligent design, creationism, or whatever floats your boat.

The op is pretty clear specifically what is the supporting evidence?

[Delphi]

In order to demonstrate that anything has been created, one must first demonstrate the existence of a potential creator.

Next, it would be reasonable to require that a causal connection between the alleged creator and the creation be shown.

[hoghead1]

[Replying to post 2 by Talishi]

I am inclined to agree. I have spend considerable time studying creation-science literature. I found the field to be largely a propaganda mill run by individuals trying to make a dishonest living by bilking the public. It is bad science and even worse theology. I can cite you chapter and verse if you want.

[theStudent]

[Replying to post 4 by DanieltheDragon]

The op is pretty clear

You may believe it is clear, but it doesn't mean it's clear.
A person may say, "There is water in the house." They may believe they are clear, but are they? How many ways we can understand just one statement... or question.

Also, to be clear, Jehovah's Witnesses do not consider themselves believers in Creationism. We do not believe the universe, or earth, to be 6,000 years old.

Taking evolution, Big Bang, and abiogenesis out of the equation. What is the evidence for creationism?

Can creationism stand on its own merit?

What is the evidence for creation?
That to me, is similar to asking, "What is the evidence for this being painted - and painted by anyone?


The Papyrus of Ani is a papyrus manuscript with cursive hieroglyphs and color illustrations created c. 1250 BCE, in the 19th dynasty of the New Kingdom of ancient Egypt.
Author: Unknown
Description: Book of the Dead
Date: circa 1200 B.C

We don't know the author.
We never saw anyone do it.
How do we know it was painted... and by anyone?
Could it not have dropped out of the sky; magically appeared out of nothing, and nowhere, and painted itself?

Why do we conclude that the above are not reasonable conclusions, and that reasonably it must have been painted, by someone?

The obvious answer...
We know - it is a fact - that nothing just appears out of nothing. Nor does something just drop out of the sky without a cause.
We also know - it is a fact - that the work was purposefully designed. Therefore, someone must have done it.
Our familiarity with these facts lead us to the reasonable conclusion that someone painted, or designed it.
We do not come up with fanciful myths to propose other possibilities.

The same reasoning applies to all things we see around us. (Stated in these texts - Psalms 19:1; Romans 1:18-20; Hebrews 3:4). Logically, someone designed them.

Can creation stand on its own merit?
The evidence for creation can be observed by everyone.
The fact is some choose to ignore that evidence, and be unreasonable in asserting illogical fantasies - not facts.

Whereas, the universe and all things within it gives evidence of a creator.
The Bible gives us details about the creator.
Two prime sources of evidence.

[Delphi]

Paintings and illustrations do not constitute veridical evidence of a creator of the Universe.

The Universe is evidence that the Universe exists. The Universe is not evidence that a Universe Creator exists. That would require additional causal evidence.

[Talishi]

[Replying to post 2 by Talishi]

I am inclined to agree. I have spend considerable time studying creation-science literature. I found the field to be largely a propaganda mill run by individuals trying to make a dishonest living by bilking the public. It is bad science and even worse theology. I can cite you chapter and verse if you want.

The source material for creationism has intractable contradictions as I highlighted. Some believers get around them by claiming such things as "a day really means billions of years" or some other similar dodge, in which case they are putting forth an entirely new creation claim than the claim made in the Bible, much like Tolkien did in the Silmarrillion. And my interest in debating an extra-biblical creation claim approaches zero.

[DanieltheDragon]

[Replying to post 7 by theStudent]

I was using this definition:

cre·a·tion·ism
krēˈ�SHəˌnizəm/
noun
noun: creationism
the belief that the universe and living organisms originate from specific acts of divine creation, as in the biblical account, rather than by natural processes such as evolution.
another term for creation science.

Can creation stand on its own merit?
The evidence for creation can be observed by everyone.
The fact is some choose to ignore that evidence, and be unreasonable in asserting illogical fantasies - not facts.

Whereas, the universe and all things within it gives evidence of a creator.
The Bible gives us details about the creator.
Two prime sources of evidence.

What evidence is observed by everyone?
What is being ignored?
How does the universe and all things in it give evidence of a creator?
How is the bible an empirical source about the creator?