So I am thinking rabies and demon possession and holy water.
People who are allegedly possessed by demons have the same symptoms as rabies.
Actually, someone seems to have had this thought for vampires, ahead of me.
The idea that they are afraid of (holy) water, act violently, have aversion to light, seems pretty consistent with demons.
http://blog.writanon.com/tag/rabies/
Is this sufficient to knock the demon into mythology?
Rabies and demon possession
Moderator: Moderators
-
Demented_Literature
- Student
- Posts: 44
- Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:39 am
Re: Rabies and demon possession
Post #2[Replying to post 1 by Willum]
I think that while it may have had some part in inevitably some of the demonic possession occurrences of the past. I think more so that people are simply vulnerable to the notion as much as requiring a physical cause.
For instance; exorcism is on the rise. It is becoming a common trait around the world; the actual 'ritual' required for exorcism changes and can be from quite mundane (USA preacher yells at someone in a bed and they thrash about) to extremely violent (Mexico fatality http://www.capitalfm.co.ke/news/2017/03 ... -exorcism/) the depiction of the thrashing about and being 'burned' by holy water only really came about after The Exorcist movie after which exorcisms spiked massively. (I am unable to find the evidence for this any longer; there are statistics of the growth of exorcism I'd need time to find them)
The nature of the actions of someone being exorcised can change quite dramatically and often the person(s) doing the exorcism will contribute to the story to give it stronger validation. Giving it conforming attributes to the 'norm' is a good way to 'validate' the action being taken. Often subconsciously. And you don't necessarily have to be 'religious' to have this kind of 'experience'. (see John Safran vs God)
We are quite susceptible as humans to suggestion (see Hypnosis) and can often fall into these kinds of traps of believing we are something we are not (Haiti: Voodooism 'zombification' using Tetrodotoxin and other mind numbing drugs to create a mindless servant in combination with spiritual beliefs - would need to dig up the reference)
I think that while it may have had some part in inevitably some of the demonic possession occurrences of the past. I think more so that people are simply vulnerable to the notion as much as requiring a physical cause.
For instance; exorcism is on the rise. It is becoming a common trait around the world; the actual 'ritual' required for exorcism changes and can be from quite mundane (USA preacher yells at someone in a bed and they thrash about) to extremely violent (Mexico fatality http://www.capitalfm.co.ke/news/2017/03 ... -exorcism/) the depiction of the thrashing about and being 'burned' by holy water only really came about after The Exorcist movie after which exorcisms spiked massively. (I am unable to find the evidence for this any longer; there are statistics of the growth of exorcism I'd need time to find them)
The nature of the actions of someone being exorcised can change quite dramatically and often the person(s) doing the exorcism will contribute to the story to give it stronger validation. Giving it conforming attributes to the 'norm' is a good way to 'validate' the action being taken. Often subconsciously. And you don't necessarily have to be 'religious' to have this kind of 'experience'. (see John Safran vs God)
We are quite susceptible as humans to suggestion (see Hypnosis) and can often fall into these kinds of traps of believing we are something we are not (Haiti: Voodooism 'zombification' using Tetrodotoxin and other mind numbing drugs to create a mindless servant in combination with spiritual beliefs - would need to dig up the reference)
Re: Rabies and demon possession
Post #3[Replying to post 2 by Demented_Literature]
"We are quite susceptible as humans to suggestion (see Hypnosis) and can often fall into these kinds of traps of believing we are something we are not (Haiti: Voodooism 'zombification' using Tetrodotoxin and other mind numbing drugs to create a mindless servant in combination with spiritual beliefs - would need to dig up the reference)"
We know so little about human mind it is easy to get into areas and not find the way back.
The human mind has many levels and entering those states can be dangerous because
it is new to us and we do not know what to do. Mystics and Shamans can deal with it. For others this is where mental disorders can come in.
Just imagine walking in two or three realities at the same time.
"We are quite susceptible as humans to suggestion (see Hypnosis) and can often fall into these kinds of traps of believing we are something we are not (Haiti: Voodooism 'zombification' using Tetrodotoxin and other mind numbing drugs to create a mindless servant in combination with spiritual beliefs - would need to dig up the reference)"
We know so little about human mind it is easy to get into areas and not find the way back.
The human mind has many levels and entering those states can be dangerous because
it is new to us and we do not know what to do. Mystics and Shamans can deal with it. For others this is where mental disorders can come in.
Just imagine walking in two or three realities at the same time.
-
Neatras
- Guru
- Posts: 1045
- Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 11:44 pm
- Location: Oklahoma, US
- Been thanked: 1 time
Re: Rabies and demon possession
Post #4Please support this assertion with evidence. I remain unconvinced that mystics and shamans have any ability to affect the mind outside of smoke and mirrors.Monta wrote: Mystics and Shamans can deal with it.
-
Demented_Literature
- Student
- Posts: 44
- Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:39 am
Re: Rabies and demon possession
Post #5They actually use drugs. As per previously I have mentioned tetrodotoxin which causes simulated death. What my understanding (from reading what little I could acquire; it's a mostly ignored section) a target is drugged and simulate death. These targets are often buried (alive) and the shaman himself will dig up the 'corpse' and wake the person assuming they are still alive.
Often they will offer several other drugs with food to keep them doped up; using them as servants and slaves in combination with tightly wrapped beliefs in vodou belief that causes the mind to enforce a reality that isn't true. Think of it as a kind of Munchausen by proxy using belief and depending on the shaman drugs and other controlling techniques that we see in western society towards trapped individuals who believe the information they are given no matter how absurd.
While this can all be demonstrated (there are several documentaries and witness accounts) it's not a deeply explored topic and it doesn't really show anything mystical, unusual or different in comparison to western society behaviour manipulation that we see every now and again.
-
liamconnor
- Prodigy
- Posts: 3170
- Joined: Sun May 31, 2015 1:18 pm
Re: Rabies and demon possession
Post #6[Replying to post 1 by Willum]
Given the context of this forum (Christianity) I am curious as to how holy water, or light, has anything to do with demonic possession? The N.T. says nothing about these sensitivities.
Rabies as far as I know cannot be transferred from one person to a herd of pigs by verbal command.
So, no. In order to identify demon-possession with rabies you have to be very selective with your documentation: i.e., you have to assume your answer, and ignore any evidence that doesn't support it. I.e., you have to not act like a real scientist.
Given the context of this forum (Christianity) I am curious as to how holy water, or light, has anything to do with demonic possession? The N.T. says nothing about these sensitivities.
Rabies as far as I know cannot be transferred from one person to a herd of pigs by verbal command.
So, no. In order to identify demon-possession with rabies you have to be very selective with your documentation: i.e., you have to assume your answer, and ignore any evidence that doesn't support it. I.e., you have to not act like a real scientist.
-
Willum
- Savant
- Posts: 9017
- Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2014 2:14 pm
- Location: Yahweh's Burial Place
- Has thanked: 35 times
- Been thanked: 82 times
Re: Rabies and demon possession
Post #7[Replying to post 6 by liamconnor]
People with rabies are afraid of (holy) water.
Jesus miracles are made-up, so he can cure them in any way that suites the author.
People with rabies are afraid of (holy) water.
Jesus miracles are made-up, so he can cure them in any way that suites the author.
I will never understand how someone who claims to know the ultimate truth, of God, believes they deserve respect, when they cannot distinguish it from a fairy-tale.
You know, science and logic are hard: Religion and fairy tales might be more your speed.
To continue to argue for the Hebrew invention of God is actually an insult to the very concept of a God. - Divine Insight
You know, science and logic are hard: Religion and fairy tales might be more your speed.
To continue to argue for the Hebrew invention of God is actually an insult to the very concept of a God. - Divine Insight
Re: Rabies and demon possession
Post #8[Replying to post 5 by Demented_Literature]
Monta wrote:
Mystics and Shamans can deal with it.
Neatras wrote:
Please support this assertion with evidence. I remain unconvinced that mystics and shamans have any ability to affect the mind outside of smoke and mirrors.
Demented wrote:
They actually use drugs.
From what I've read Shamans use drugs.
The Mystics have spiritualy advanced/opened the inner/deeper levels
of their will and understanding in which the divine (from God) can inflow.
Monta wrote:
Mystics and Shamans can deal with it.
Neatras wrote:
Please support this assertion with evidence. I remain unconvinced that mystics and shamans have any ability to affect the mind outside of smoke and mirrors.
Demented wrote:
They actually use drugs.
From what I've read Shamans use drugs.
The Mystics have spiritualy advanced/opened the inner/deeper levels
of their will and understanding in which the divine (from God) can inflow.
-
Neatras
- Guru
- Posts: 1045
- Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 11:44 pm
- Location: Oklahoma, US
- Been thanked: 1 time
Re: Rabies and demon possession
Post #9Please support this claim with scientific evidence.Monta wrote: The Mystics have spiritualy advanced/opened the inner/deeper levels
of their will and understanding in which the divine (from God) can inflow.
-
Demented_Literature
- Student
- Posts: 44
- Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:39 am
Re: Rabies and demon possession
Post #10[Replying to Monta]
This is where your assertion falls flat.
Yes; they use drugs that incorporate a kind of mind haze, and use psychology wrapped in religious beliefs to 'control' people much as we have seen in western psychology and have a detailed understanding on how this kind of control works. It is evident that you don't need to be intelligent for this to occur; only oppressive and overbearing. Western society can also use the same drugs to have the same effects and isolate the drug giving it a name and classifying it's effects. There is no need for spirituality or god.
Your assertion to wrap it in mysticism and an understanding of the occult where there is no occult or spiritual entity or evidence is where you fall flat. Supernatural does not pick up where science leaves off.
This is where your assertion falls flat.
Yes; they use drugs that incorporate a kind of mind haze, and use psychology wrapped in religious beliefs to 'control' people much as we have seen in western psychology and have a detailed understanding on how this kind of control works. It is evident that you don't need to be intelligent for this to occur; only oppressive and overbearing. Western society can also use the same drugs to have the same effects and isolate the drug giving it a name and classifying it's effects. There is no need for spirituality or god.
Your assertion to wrap it in mysticism and an understanding of the occult where there is no occult or spiritual entity or evidence is where you fall flat. Supernatural does not pick up where science leaves off.
