Do demons exist? Can that be tested?

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John Human
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Do demons exist? Can that be tested?

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Post by John Human »

When I lived in Bali, I couldn't help observing the pervasive evidence of belief in demons. And of course demons put in an appearance in the Bible, not to mention in the gargoyles of old cathedrals.

On the other hand, modern science would seem to categorically reject the existence of demons, without a clear reason why, unless it has to do with the axiomatic presuppositions of science's governing ideology of reductionist materialism.

Question: Do demons exist? What evidence is there, for or against?

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Re: Do demons exist? Can that be tested?

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Post by JoeyKnothead »

mgb wrote: Fri Jan 14, 2022 7:36 am Hitler, I believe, never murdered anyone. But he was evil. Evil is many things. Hitler chose his own megalomania over his conscience and that is evil (yes, psychopaths do have a conscience, they just repress it because otherwise it would get in the way. If you offend a psychopath his moral outrage will become apparent and he will tell you in no uncertain terms why you are the culprit.)
According to your comments, couldn't we consider you suffer a bit of psychopathy when you declare psychopaths display their moral outrage... as you declare Hitler "evil" and suffering "megalomania"?

And that if you reject the diagnosis, you're just "repressing"?
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Re: Do demons exist? Can that be tested?

Post #392

Post by mgb »

JoeyKnothead wrote: Fri Jan 14, 2022 9:01 am
mgb wrote: Fri Jan 14, 2022 7:36 am Hitler, I believe, never murdered anyone. But he was evil. Evil is many things. Hitler chose his own megalomania over his conscience and that is evil (yes, psychopaths do have a conscience, they just repress it because otherwise it would get in the way. If you offend a psychopath his moral outrage will become apparent and he will tell you in no uncertain terms why you are the culprit.)
According to your comments, couldn't we consider you suffer a bit of psychopathy when you declare psychopaths display their moral outrage... as you declare Hitler "evil" and suffering "megalomania"?

And that if you reject the diagnosis, you're just "repressing"?
No. This is just academic gymnastics. Evil is a spiritual pathology. To say good and evil are merely subjective is like saying sanity and insanity are merely subjective. If some guy tells you his dog told him to kill people you don't say his state of mind is merely subjective. He is insane by any meaningful standard.

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Re: Do demons exist? Can that be tested?

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Post by Difflugia »

mgb wrote: Fri Jan 14, 2022 11:03 amIf some guy tells you his dog told him to kill people you don't say his state of mind is merely subjective. He is insane by any meaningful standard.
You spelled "god" wrong.
My preferred pronouns are he, him, and his.

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Re: Do demons exist? Can that be tested?

Post #394

Post by mgb »

Difflugia wrote: Fri Jan 14, 2022 1:26 pm
mgb wrote: Fri Jan 14, 2022 11:03 amIf some guy tells you his dog told him to kill people you don't say his state of mind is merely subjective. He is insane by any meaningful standard.
You spelled "god" wrong.
Why is it that atheists espouse 'rationality' so much but so often descend into vitriol and sarcasm?

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Re: Do demons exist? Can that be tested?

Post #395

Post by Difflugia »

mgb wrote: Fri Jan 14, 2022 2:06 pm
Difflugia wrote: Fri Jan 14, 2022 1:26 pm
mgb wrote: Fri Jan 14, 2022 11:03 amIf some guy tells you his dog told him to kill people you don't say his state of mind is merely subjective. He is insane by any meaningful standard.
You spelled "god" wrong.
Why is it that atheists espouse 'rationality' so much but so often descend into vitriol and sarcasm?
Are those independent?

Your argument applies equally well to dogs and gods and since we're ultimately talking about gods, it's funny to me that "dog" is "god" spelled backwards. While I suppose I'd quibble over whether or not it was vitriolic and I didn't mean it that way, it was definitely meant to be sarcastic. The sarcasm was because I assumed that we'd both agree that you would have recognized the flaw in your argument if you'd stopped to think about it first, like someone spilling a glass of water while looking at a wristwatch, and that we'd both think either situation was funny.

If you'd prefer that I not assume that about you in the future, I won't.
My preferred pronouns are he, him, and his.

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Re: Do demons exist? Can that be tested?

Post #396

Post by Diagoras »

I last posted in this thread back on Page 12, so there's clearly been a lot of further debate on the subject.

Would someone please point me to the post(s) since mine that present the strongest argument for the existence of demons? I don't really have the time to read nearly thirty pages with multiple tangents. Thanks.

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Re: Do demons exist? Can that be tested?

Post #397

Post by John Human »

John Human wrote: Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:18 pm
[snip]
In addition, as I have mentioned on other threads, I have recorded lengthy stories of two ancient Hebrew demons (both of whom were involved with the Roman Catholic Church in the centuries following the destruction of Jerusalem) at http://earthwarning.org/index.php/here-be-demons/

I have also recorded the stories of other demons (including demons involved with the founding of Islam and the Mormon church) at viewtopic.php?t=35478
Ancient Demon "spoke" earlier on this thread (as I recorded its words).
Ancient Demon will now speak:
Ancient Demon had a sense. The discussion did not have relevance. Two intended to argue, obfuscacting what was said in the first part of this "thread."

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Re: Do demons exist? Can that be tested?

Post #398

Post by nobspeople »

Difflugia wrote: Fri Jan 14, 2022 1:26 pm
mgb wrote: Fri Jan 14, 2022 11:03 amIf some guy tells you his dog told him to kill people you don't say his state of mind is merely subjective. He is insane by any meaningful standard.
You spelled "god" wrong.
I've oft wondered why, if a believer is speaking 'for god' (defending it, protecting it, whatever) they tend to misspeak, misspell, etc, don't seem to bat an eye at the faith they have in ancient writers being exact with their stories in the bible not making the same mistakes. :confused2: :drunk:
Have a great, potentially godless, day!

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Re: Do demons exist? Can that be tested?

Post #399

Post by John Human »

Diagoras wrote: Sun Jan 16, 2022 6:47 pm I last posted in this thread back on Page 12, so there's clearly been a lot of further debate on the subject.

Would someone please point me to the post(s) since mine that present the strongest argument for the existence of demons? I don't really have the time to read nearly thirty pages with multiple tangents. Thanks.
Ancient Demon "spoke" toward the beginning of this thread, and I recorded its words as they appeared in my mind. In this fashion, Ancient Demon will speak again:
Ancient Demon did not discuss the possibility of visiting. If a skeptic would receive, Ancient Demon will visit.

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Re: Do demons exist? Can that be tested?

Post #400

Post by Clownboat »

John Human wrote: Mon Feb 07, 2022 11:17 am
Diagoras wrote: Sun Jan 16, 2022 6:47 pm I last posted in this thread back on Page 12, so there's clearly been a lot of further debate on the subject.

Would someone please point me to the post(s) since mine that present the strongest argument for the existence of demons? I don't really have the time to read nearly thirty pages with multiple tangents. Thanks.
Ancient Demon "spoke" toward the beginning of this thread, and I recorded its words as they appeared in my mind. In this fashion, Ancient Demon will speak again:
Ancient Demon did not discuss the possibility of visiting. If a skeptic would receive, Ancient Demon will visit.
Modern demon has claimed that ancient demon is a figment of your imagination.
I'm sorry, but that is how the words appeared in my mind. Ancient demon can still be an invisible friend though.
IMO, you should forget ancient demon and seek out modern demon.

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