Abiogenesis is a theistic claim

Creationism, Evolution, and other science issues

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Willum
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Abiogenesis is a theistic claim

Post #1

Post by Willum »

Judeo-Christians often mock evolution claiming only life can create life, and life will not just spontaneously arise from clay.

Let’s examine this to see if we can determine if this is a sophism.

1. Does God live?
He does not eat, breathe, his reproduction is from “creation,� or “immaculation,� so it seems he possesses none of the characteristics of being alive. Therefore the assumption of life can only come from life is a specious one.
2. Clay is dead material. Therefore the claim is that God induced abiogenesis upon clay to produce life.

In other words, Judeo-Christians mock abiogenesis for exactly the flaws in their own religious concepts.

Abiogenic concepts state it can take millions of years for life to arise from chemical processes. Given the other opinion is spontaneous generation from a creature who also has no raison d’etre, does the God explanation have any advantages over abiogenesis?

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Re: Abiogenesis is a theistic claim

Post #2

Post by bluegreenearth »

[Replying to post 1 by Willum]

I've never thought of the concept in that way before. Thanks for opening my mind to something new!

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Willum
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Re: Abiogenesis is a theistic claim

Post #3

Post by Willum »

[Replying to Willum]

Then we may consider the humble plant, no matter how simple or even microscopic. It can and does produce life from inanimate material.
Something we observe everyday, but never from a god.
So Judeo-Christians brag their god can do something the most rudimentary plant does effortlessly. It even creates that life in its own image.

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An interesting related article:

Post #4

Post by Diagoras »

https://www.quantamagazine.org/origin-o ... -20190916/

The message to take away from this research is that the emergence of life on Earth in some ways “is not as hard as we might think it is.� The importance of this recent discovery to the debate is to fill in what was previously a gap in an understanding about the processes involved in how life arose.

That ‘emergence of life’ might be better thought of as a gradual scale with ‘non-life’ at one end and ‘life’ at the other. Maybe self-replicating RNA can be argued to sit closer to the ‘life’ end, and DNA still further along, with a protein-coated DNA strand yet further. At some point, you may have a ‘proto-cell’ but still not be 100% sure that this can be defined as ‘life’. Which particular point along the scale it is that definitively denotes an exact transition between non-life and life may never be agreed. But at some point, we’ll have a good understanding of each of the processes involved along the whole scale. And at that point, we’ll have a naturalistic explanation for how life can arise from non-living things.

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Re: Abiogenesis is a theistic claim

Post #5

Post by Aetixintro »

[Replying to post 1 by Willum]

What if Abiogenesis makes it easier "for God to create life"?

I would not think that science and religion are contradictory. One way or another, if "God-explanation" is to hold, science and religion must go hand in hand and I think the modern Christians hold this view. God has created the Universe and all in it, how can the Universe and science in it turn against God, possibly? I don't see the possibility, alright.

:study: :D 8-)
I'm cool! :) - Stronger Religion every day! Also by "mathematical Religion", the eternal forms, God closing the door on corrupt humanity, possibly!

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Re: Abiogenesis is a theistic claim

Post #6

Post by Willum »

Aetixintro wrote: [Replying to post 1 by Willum]

What if Abiogenesis makes it easier "for God to create life"?
"What if," is an unnecessary conjecture validating an unnecessary deity.
I would not think that science and religion are contradictory. One way or another, if "God-explanation" is to hold, science and religion must go hand in hand and I think the modern Christians hold this view. God has created the Universe and all in it, how can the Universe and science in it turn against God, possibly? I don't see the possibility, alright.

:study: :D 8-)
One would have to believe that in this day and age to believe in God.
In previous ages, it would get you killed.

Creation is another unnecessary myth used to justify an unnecessary creator.
Nothing is ever created. Most people learn this in high school.

How does your premise of science and religion not being contradictory hold in the face that the church changes when science reveals?

One of the basis of Judeo-Christianity is God is a creator.

One of the basis of modern science is conservation of mass - nothing is created nor destroyed. Nor does it need to be to explain a non-extant god.

Move over myth.

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