Artificial life: can it be created?

Creationism, Evolution, and other science issues

Moderator: Moderators

User avatar
Diagoras
Guru
Posts: 1107
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 12:47 am
Has thanked: 131 times
Been thanked: 378 times

Artificial life: can it be created?

Post #1

Post by Diagoras »

Here's the link to an article which inspired my creation of this debate topic:

https://newatlas.com/science/artificial ... nteresting

"Artificial cells created that imitate basic functions of living cells"

There are disagreements within the scientific community on precisely what constitutes a 'living' thing, and clearly these artificial cells are not alive. However, the experiment shows success in replicating some important attributes of life.

A general theistic position might declare "All life comes from God", but if some 'cellular gene engineer' of the future succeeded in creating a basic cell that ate, grew, replicated and all the other generally agreed things that life does - could it be recognised as life? And wouldn't that falsify that bolded theistic claim?

The Affirmative:

The creation of life is possible by means other than a god.

User avatar
JoeyKnothead
Under Probation
Posts: 18679
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2008 10:59 am
Location: Here
Has thanked: 1638 times
Been thanked: 1121 times

Re: Artificial life: can it be created?

Post #21

Post by JoeyKnothead »

This topic brings me back to round the 80s and 90s, when there was a big fuss on if them roaches we were programming to flit about the CRT was it life, or was it ain't.

My position then, as now, is yes.

My roaches consumed energy in the form of electricity. They'd flit about. They'd even reproduce. I could even program in some random genetic changes. Random in the program required a seed variable, but after that, random best a PC of the day could.

Sounds like life to me. Real life.

But they went extinct in the great hard drive crash of '93. Poor things. And all cause their god didn't have him a good backup policy in place.
Discovery is finding things that exist.
Invention is using things discovered.

Create that path and engineer a metamorphosis.

- William

User avatar
William
Savant
Posts: 10486
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:11 pm
Location: Te Waipounamu
Has thanked: 494 times
Been thanked: 1129 times
Contact:

Re: Artificial life: can it be created?

Post #22

Post by William »

JoeyKnothead wrote: Sat Oct 02, 2021 1:22 pm This topic brings me back to round the 80s and 90s, when there was a big fuss on if them roaches we were programming to flit about the CRT was it life, or was it ain't.

My position then, as now, is yes.

My roaches consumed energy in the form of electricity. They'd flit about. They'd even reproduce. I could even program in some random genetic changes. Random in the program required a seed variable, but after that, random best a PC of the day could.

Sounds like life to me. Real life.

But they went extinct in the great hard drive crash of '93. Poor things. And all cause their god didn't have him a good backup policy in place.
I think in a similar way re The Earth. As a living Entity and about as closest we have seen to a living god in the god line-up...which coincidently, organized religions such a Christianity, consider such thinking as to be "Pagan", so never included in the line-up in the first instance.

I think too, that this thinking has rubbed of on the no-gods-non-religious Humanites, as in they throw that idea to one side as soon as it is tabled....and no so's they can look at it latter on either.

I also think that Mother Earth doesn't get sad about extinction events - maybe just peeved about all the hard work that went into Her Creations, but She is such a clever pretty thing that She just gets about thinking up new variants She can birth into Her reality and moves on with the great dignity one would expect from a god.

RESPECT.

User avatar
William
Savant
Posts: 10486
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:11 pm
Location: Te Waipounamu
Has thanked: 494 times
Been thanked: 1129 times
Contact:

Re: Artificial life: can it be created?

Post #23

Post by William »

[Replying to Diagoras in post #1]
The Affirmative:

The creation of life is possible by means other than a god.
Considering how a god is defined, the Planet Earth has a lot of the defined attributes of a 'god' - and the other planets in the Solar System as well - when related to what is defined as 'life' [by those living as it, no less!]

In that, perhaps the Earth dreamt of AI and then went about finding a way in which to create it, and that is why Humanites had their day in the scheme of things [under the sun]. They were the device in which Mother could create AI.

Image

User avatar
JoeyKnothead
Under Probation
Posts: 18679
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2008 10:59 am
Location: Here
Has thanked: 1638 times
Been thanked: 1121 times

Re: Artificial life: can it be created?

Post #24

Post by JoeyKnothead »

William wrote: Sat Oct 02, 2021 1:49 pm I think in a similar way re The Earth. As a living Entity and about as closest we have seen to a living god in the god line-up...which coincidently, organized religions such a Christianity, consider such thinking as to be "Pagan", so never included in the line-up in the first instance.
As ya know, my knee-jerk reaction to your ideas is to discount em as "out there", but try as I might, I can't find a way to dismiss em that doesn't expose me as, well, a knee-jerker.
I think too, that this thinking has rubbed of on the no-gods-non-religious Humanites, as in they throw that idea to one side as soon as it is tabled....and no so's they can look at it latter on either.
A fair argument. As a "staunch" atheist, it's my position that gods are best explained in terms of human imagination, and a nigh evolutionary need for "an answer, any answer". I'd expound if challenged, but honesty compels me to note my amateur status, and the difficulty of proving a negative.

As well, I'd encounter much difficulty doing so in light of the sturdy base of your reasoning.
I also think that Mother Earth doesn't get sad about extinction events - maybe just peeved about all the hard work that went into Her Creations, but She is such a clever pretty thing that She just gets about thinking up new variants She can birth into Her reality and moves on with the great dignity one would expect from a god.

RESPECT.
Poetry.

I'll tell it, after reading so much of your stuff, I respect your ability to present ideas that're "out there", and then explain em in such a way as to be easily understood.
Discovery is finding things that exist.
Invention is using things discovered.

Create that path and engineer a metamorphosis.

- William

User avatar
William
Savant
Posts: 10486
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:11 pm
Location: Te Waipounamu
Has thanked: 494 times
Been thanked: 1129 times
Contact:

Re: Artificial life: can it be created?

Post #25

Post by William »

JoeyKnothead wrote: Sat Oct 02, 2021 5:53 pm
William wrote: Sat Oct 02, 2021 1:49 pm I think in a similar way re The Earth. As a living Entity and about as closest we have seen to a living god in the god line-up...which coincidently, organized religions such a Christianity, consider such thinking as to be "Pagan", so never included in the line-up in the first instance.
As ya know, my knee-jerk reaction to your ideas is to discount em as "out there", but try as I might, I can't find a way to dismiss em that doesn't expose me as, well, a knee-jerker.
Yes. It is the best way in which to proceed. I look at it this way.

We are already in the position of being "out there" so any 'out there' presumptions which cannot be altogether debunked, have to remain on the table with the rest.

Being 'out there' as a position, Similar in reality to this;
Image
I think too, that this thinking has rubbed of on the no-gods-non-religious Humanites, as in they throw that idea to one side as soon as it is tabled....and no so's they can look at it latter on either.
A fair argument. As a "staunch" atheist, it's my position that gods are best explained in terms of human imagination, and a nigh evolutionary need for "an answer, any answer".
Some folk would jump on the claim that being an atheist["staunch" or not], you have to 'explain the belief in gods' as a product of "human imagination". That is not atheism. If the same was written by a theist, the theist would likely be told off by the atheist for being false about atheism.
Image

They would say that the position of atheism is simply nothing more than the lack or absence of belief in gods. Not the lack of human imagination.

But it is not just about imagination. It is about looking at the evidence we have under the assumption that gods exist/we exist within a creation, which is something one cannot easily do without losing the lack of belief.

However, one could feasibly examine the evidence and reach such conclusions [we live in a creation] without actually forming any particular beliefs about the nature of The Creator, and so still essentially lack belief in gods.

In the same way that an atheist could actually believe in continuation of individual experience after the human body dies, without declaring any belief in gods.
I'd expound if challenged, but honesty compels me to note my amateur status, and the difficulty of proving a negative.
Then shall we ask 'the universe' to provide us with professionals who can rebut my reasonable observations? Such presently seem thin on the ground, hereabouts.


As well, I'd encounter much difficulty doing so in light of the sturdy base of your reasoning.
This is where the focus is best placed. In the fact of my sturdy base of reasoning.
I also think that Mother Earth doesn't get sad about extinction events - maybe just peeved about all the hard work that went into Her Creations, but She is such a clever pretty thing that She just gets about thinking up new variants She can birth into Her reality and moves on with the great dignity one would expect from a god.

RESPECT.
Poetry.

I'll tell it, after reading so much of your stuff, I respect your ability to present ideas that're "out there", and then explain em in such a way as to be easily understood.
That is the key. If us average specimens can tell it and understand the telling of it, there is no reason why superiors minds cannot do likewise...we remains open to new information...

Post Reply