Dying 13-year-old boy wants sex

[RobertUrbanek]

Aside from legality, if a dying 13-year-old boy wanted sex with an attractive woman, would it be immoral to arrange for his wish to be fulfilled?

Would your answer be different if the dying teen was a girl or gay or lesbian?

[bluethread]

If he is dying, I am not sure how he could be responsible for the possible consequences of those actions. However, we are all dying. So, the morality would be a matter of degree. There are enough children growing up without a father due to irresponsible sex.

[dusk]

So from the non religious point of view it is most definitely okay.
I remember that from 12 onwards I most definitely wanted to. And I was just at the same pace as anybody else my age, cannot really say about girls. The entire underage no sex legality issues is so older people cannot abuse their being mightier in any way. As soon as a boy does masturbate (or wants to) he should be allowed to have sex if he so wishes and with whom he wishes.

As far as fundi Christianity goes I think the age is actually not the issue. They would think it is immoral even for a grown up to just have sex without getting married and intending to make babies.

[bluethread]

As far as fundi Christianity goes I think the age is actually not the issue. They would think it is immoral even for a grown up to just have sex without getting married and intending to make babies.

So, you believe a 12 year old boy can be trusted to take the proper precusions to aviod pregnancy and VD. Also, if you permit that kind of risky behavior, what makes you think that the 12 year old will not just push things further? That is the nature of many 12 yr olds.

[Filthy Tugboat]

Aside from legality, if a dying 13-year-old boy wanted sex with an attractive woman, would it be immoral to arrange for his wish to be fulfilled?

Would your answer be different if the dying teen was a girl or gay or lesbian?

With a woman? No. If someone his own age was interested, I don't see any reason to stop them so long as they are correctly informed and have a real understanding of what it is they are doing and especially the partner of the dying child, they must be aware that this will not be the start of a relationship.

[Nickman]

The question was whether it was immoral or not. The question has absolutely nothing to do with hell. If you would take me up on the offer there is an issue in your post that I would like to debate with you one on one. I would promise to only use scripture out of the book of Romans for the entire debate.

That's why I specifically state that my answer is from bible's point of view. When someone says moral or not, there are usually 2 possibilities of moral standard : divine standard and human standard. I'm just giving the christian standard. Hell is just the implication of the sin. I assume that you're christian? but, okay, I dont mind debating. I'm sure I can learn something new. Tell me how. But I may only be able to reply at most once a day. will that be a problem? I'm currently engaged in a new project in my job.

I feel that the Christian standard is far inferior to human standard. We are the ones who came up with all laws to begin with and have revised them to be better adapted to our society.

On the OP, I don't think it is immoral for the boy to have his wish granted or to even think about it as some have seemed to hint to. As long as the parents are consenting and the woman performing (or women ) then I see nothing wrong with it. For the religious mind, this scenario is a clear cut certainty that it would be wrong and he would be playing with fire. For the agnostic it may be a gamble, but for the atheist it is not a matter of right or wrong, it is a matter of consent and providing a "happy ending" for someone who may not have another chance ever again.

[Nickman]

As far as fundi Christianity goes I think the age is actually not the issue. They would think it is immoral even for a grown up to just have sex without getting married and intending to make babies.

So, you believe a 12 year old boy can be trusted to take the proper precusions to aviod pregnancy and VD. Also, if you permit that kind of risky behavior, what makes you think that the 12 year old will not just push things further? That is the nature of many 12 yr olds.

I think I am in agreement with you for the first time in a while BT. I don't think a 12 year old can be trusted to practice sex safe enough, hell most adults are not.

[dusk]

So, you believe a 12 year old boy can be trusted to take the proper precusions to aviod pregnancy and VD. Also, if you permit that kind of risky behavior, what makes you think that the 12 year old will not just push things further? That is the nature of many 12 yr olds.

Given the right instructions yes. Probably better than a totally wasted teenager after a party. It is not rocket science and I don't know about you but we learned STD, contraception and all this stuff in 3rd or 4th garde which is afaik 12-13 years if I remember correctly.
Are they totally trustworthy on a general level? No. Are they physically and mentally capable of doing so? Yes.
I don't argue against the law or the parenting rules of waiting a little longer, but I don't think it is immoral or wrong (in act or for the boy to want it). One has a better chance teaching some 13 year old who doesn't yet get drunk every weekend than some 20 year old downbeat.

As the thread goes the discussion is about whether it is wrong to allow it for such a young boy when as far as my country goes one isn't legally allowed before age 14. But this age is to protect in court and make it impossible to give legal consent in any situation that might be in dispute later. The pregnancy and STD thing can be handled. Just a general permission would be irresponsible but at 13 I was definitely smart enough to understand all the stuff they taught us and the risks involved. The only person I know personally who got pregnant involuntarily is a girl who went to kindergarden with me and she was in her last year at college and 23 years old. Maybe I just live around smarter people but we got the education and had no overprotective parents who worried about locked doors or all this stuff like strictest boy/girl segregation. They handed out condoms to us 4th graders. I doubt anyone used them.

BTW as far as the fundis go I am not aware of any rules regarding age from the bible. Which is what you quoted.

I don't think a 12 year old can be trusted to practice sex safe enough, hell most adults are not.

I agree many adults it seems cannot but they usually are quite wasted when stuff happens. Many people in my opinion aren't fit to raise children yet they are allowed to. Just assuming young people are simply and generally too stupid and arguing that it is therefore plain wrong seems not like a sufficient reason. There is a difference to something not being a good idea and something being wrong, with the latter requiring it to be forbidden in just about any situation.
A 40 year old teacher and a 13 year old doing it is wrong. A 13 year old having sex per se is not wrong, it might not be a good idea in general but it isn't wrong.

[Intojoy]

The question was whether it was immoral or not. The question has absolutely nothing to do with hell. If you would take me up on the offer there is an issue in your post that I would like to debate with you one on one. I would promise to only use scripture out of the book of Romans for the entire debate.

That's why I specifically state that my answer is from bible's point of view. When someone says moral or not, there are usually 2 possibilities of moral standard : divine standard and human standard. I'm just giving the christian standard. Hell is just the implication of the sin. I assume that you're christian? but, okay, I dont mind debating. I'm sure I can learn something new. Tell me how. But I may only be able to reply at most once a day. will that be a problem? I'm currently engaged in a new project in my job.

Yes, I am Christian, fundamentalist mostly, but my view on salvation is very different from yours. I will set up a debate in the one-on-one forum probably this weekend and send you a PM when it is ready for you to respond. I expect to learn something as well.

Let me try this.
13 going to die, wants sexual experience. I'd probably promise it to him and then take it back again later. It's not the morality that is dangerous, it's the lack of knowledge concerning what was really needed - love. There's none good among us, all of us fall short. Unconditional all accepting love. Is this what he needs? Wouldn't a night with the most desirable woman (physically beautiful, and emotionally and spiritually attractive) cause him to feel emptier when she left? I remember at 13 I was ready to make a deal with the devil for a night of this but I was young, confused, God's word told me to flee youthful lusts. I'm living with the consequences of decisions I've made but not heading to hell. It's a smoke screen question that exposes the mind of the questioner
A mind that lacks the ability to give what we all desperately need in order so that we can become the kind of beings we were created to be, unconditional love.

[Nickman]

Let me try this.
13 going to die, wants sexual experience. I'd probably promise it to him and then take it back again later. It's not the morality that is dangerous, it's the lack of knowledge concerning what was really needed - love. There's none good among us, all of us fall short. Unconditional all accepting love. Is this what he needs? Wouldn't a night with the most desirable woman (physically beautiful, and emotionally and spiritually attractive) cause him to feel emptier when she left? I remember at 13 I was ready to make a deal with the devil for a night of this but I was young, confused, God's word told me to flee youthful lusts. I'm living with the consequences of decisions I've made but not heading to hell. It's a smoke screen question that exposes the mind of the questioner
A mind that lacks the ability to give what we all desperately need in order so that we can become the kind of beings we were created to be, unconditional love.

I think you might be overlooking one of the main poi ts here. Even though one may hold a certain belief, what if that belief is wrong and there is no hell or nothing else after death? Then the boy lost his last chance at having a really good sexual experience he can die happy with. As an atheist, obviously the anwer for me would be, Right On!!!!

Is a deity really that obsessed with humans sexual acts that he has to punish people for doing something that harms absolutely no one, under proper circumstances? An act that may be the happiest moment in this boys life?

[RightReason]

[Replying to post 1 by RobertUrbanek]

Aside from legality, if a dying 13-year-old boy wanted sex with an attractive woman, would it be immoral to arrange for his wish to be fulfilled?

Yes, it would be immoral. It is amazing to me how difficult life must be for those who believe in subjective morality.

First, how sad to think that would ever be a good situation. How would you not want the boy to experience sex with someone he loves? To reduce sex to scratching an itch does the boy a grave injustice. To not think of the consequences to the boy, the woman, and potential child is shortsighted.

Such a decision would be beneath the human dignity of man.

Would your answer be different if the dying teen was a girl or gay or lesbian?

Nope.