Muslims worship Muhammad…

[Pazuzu bin Hanbi]

OK, now no muslim would state that they worship Muhammad. They may even believe that they worship Allah alone, but their actions and creedal testimonies put Muhammad in a position that other religions reserve for God. Even Yeshua‘ in the Bible, and ancient Assyrians, as well as other pagan groups, exhorted that we as people imitate God to achieve the Good Life. Yeshua‘, for example, repeatedly states that people should copy God’s sense of mercy, justice, etc. Muslims, however, do their utmost to emulate Muhammad.

A couple of quotes. The first from the excellent contemporary scholarly book called Muslims: Their religious beliefs and practices by Andrew Rippin (don’t let the title fool you — he delves deep into the various elements that have combined to form Islam from its pre–history to the present day and includes current scholarship on Islam, challenging traditionally–accepted views on Islamic ‘history’):

While Muslims may think those who deny the existence of God or who utter blasphemies about Him are misguided, such discussions will not offend in the same manner in which discussions over Muhammad will. Those who insinuate evil of Muhammad or who cast aspersions on him are considered to be insulting Islam. This, upon consideration, is not surprising.

I know this myself, from having grown up in an Islamic community. It means muslims put Muhammad at the centre of Islam, not Allah! And the reactions Rippin notes above made me recall a passage I read in an autobiographical work by Ziauddin Sardar, a well–written and witty, not to mention interesting, book called Desperately Seeking Paradise. In this extract Sardar details his reaction to reading Rushdie’s The Satanic Verses:

Rushdie had plundered everything I hold dear and despoiled the inner sanctum of my identity. Every word was directed at me and I took everything personally. This is how, I remember thinking, it must feel to be raped… The life of the Prophet Muhammad is the source of Muslim identity. Muslims do not merely emulate his character and personality and follow his sayings and actions: it is the Prophet Muhammad who provides them with the ultimate reason for being a Muslim.

I do wonder if he or others would react like this if someone spoke out against Allah as opposed to Muhammad. Presented for your consideration: the reaction of muslims worldwide to the Danish cartoons (nobody lampooned Allah, only Muhammad), and the case of the Teddy Bear Named Muhammad (I recall some sources referring to this as ‘blasphemy’ — surely only a crime against God ranks as blasphemy?).

[muhammad rasullah]

OH, I forgot one of my favorite silly argument! An Imam that argued it was good to cut off the clitoris of young muslim girls because one muslim teenager told him that her clitoris rubbed up against her jeans while she was riding the bus and it made her get... "feelings."

The solution?

Cut it off.



I wonder if he ever thought of using that logic on himself...

Again what we are debating about is not what Imams say or what muslims do the debate is about belief and principles of islam. Now to argue what muslims believe is more respected but to argue what muslims do is pointless because anyone can argue against what people do because people disagree about that everyday. Plus this hadith which you talk about has already been discussed and explained yet you still want to bring it up. It seems that your basis for debating has no substance and is faulty. Also it is very easy to continue to point the finger at others without stating your belief or faith if you even have any what are you afraid of.

[carolineislands]

Again you do your little fancy dance, side step the issue, throw out a stinky red herring so nobody will notice that you've changed the subject! The you top the whole thing off by accusing others of the most glaring of your own faults.

I'm getting bored. Can't you be a LITTLE less predictable?

[muhammad rasullah]

Again you do your little fancy dance, side step the issue, throw out a stinky red herring so nobody will notice that you've changed the subject! The you top the whole thing off by accusing others of the most glaring of your own faults.

I'm getting bored. Can't you be a LITTLE less predictable?

You are the one who is trying to side step issues bringing up other topics which have nothing to do with the subject. The fact remains as such if you are gojng to say that muslims worship muhammad it'slike saying that when every prophet came those people worshipped that prophet and not God. When a prophet comes with a teaching it is implemented by the people Moses came with the law and people implemented that which he brought did they worship him by doing so no! They followed him because he was a messenger from God! The same as every people did with every prophet except the christians they wanted to elevate him without knowledge to being God which is what you believe and is not possible because by definition man cannot be God. Man is mortal God is immortal man has limited knowledge God is All-knowing, man needs to eat to live, God is not in need of anything God is not needy. So the foundation of your whole faith is false.

[Fallibleone]

If God is not needy, how does one explain his need for followers?

















.

[Truth_Teller]

Muslim do not worship Muhammad (may all the peace and blessings be upon him), Allah forbid. Infact, even while dying the only thing he kept repeating was that we, Muslims, would do a grave sin by worshipping him or his grave like people of other religions have done with their respective Prophets (peace be upon them all). The Holy Qur´an itself states that: "Those amongst you who worship Allah, let them know that Allah is still alive, and will ever remain alive. But those amongst you who worshipped Muhammad, let them know that it from Me that Muhammad is dead."

Above is the verse which Allah revealed to Muhammad (peace be upon him) in his lifetime itself to warn against him being worshipped.

I think above things will make clear to you.

We only worship Allah The Almighty!!!

[CONVERTED TO ISLAM]

Oh truth teller

you,r right

and welcome to this forum

[Truth_Teller]

Oh truth teller

you,r right

and welcome to this forum

Thanks for your welcome wishes, mate. I hope I will enjoy my stay here enlightening others and learning from them as well.

As for the question, it didn´t quite make sense to me since Islam and Judaism are the two only religions which teach monotheism.

[carolineislands]

Muslim do not worship Muhammad

... But those amongst you who worshipped Muhammad,

Hmmmm...interesting contradiction, but lets not waste time on that.

We only worship Allah The Almighty!!!

Just because you claim only to worship Allah does not make it true. Anybody can claim anything they want to, but actions speak louder than words.

We have to define the word worship:
from www.dictionary.com (my comments in bold)

wor·ship [wur-ship] - noun, verb, -shiped, -ship·ing or (especially British) -shipped, -ship·ping.
–noun
1. reverent honor and homage paid to God or a sacred personage, or to any object regarded as sacred.
Muslims definitely pay homage and show reverent honor to Muhammad. The cartoon slaughters and riots are solid proof than Muhammad is considered sacred to Muslims.

2. formal or ceremonious rendering of such honor and homage: They attended worship this morning.
Muslims include Muhammad in virtually every prayer, you must proclaim his position as THE messenger of allah to even become a Muslim.

3. adoring reverence or regard:
Yes again. Muslims adore Muhammad, reverence him to the point that they will kill people for insulting him. They consider him to be perfect and the best human being that ever lived on the earth.

4. the object of adoring reverence or regard.
Yes again. Just go to youtube and search "muhammad" and start watching the videos

5. British. a title of honor used in addressing or mentioning certain magistrates
Definitely. Muslims can't even say the name of Muhammad without sticking "The Prophet on the front and "(pbuh)" on the end.

6. to render religious reverence and homage to.
again.. of course religious reverence and homage is paid to Muhammad! Muslims even wipe their bums the way he did! Muslims highest goal is to emulate everything about Muhammad because he was the perfect example for all times, right?

7. to feel an adoring reverence or regard for (any person or thing).
–verb (used without object)
Of course. Again - remember a few posts right here that threatened torture and death, hell, etc.. for saying unflattering things about Muhammad (even though they were true).

So tell me muslims, do you feel an adoring reverence and regard for Muhammad? Do you think he was a sinful person just like the rest of us? Do you think he sinned at all? Do you feel deep in your heart that he was the most perfect example for all times and that everything he did should be emulated?

I would even go so far as to say that Muslims not only worship Muhammad but they also

i·dol·ize [ahyd-l-ahyz] verb, -ized, -iz·ing.
1. to regard with blind adoration, devotion, etc.

him. There is clear proof of 'blind adoration' of Muhammad in the fact that muslims will defend his worst crimes with everything they have in them, even when they have to blind themselves to the most basic understanding of morality. Example: No Muslim will ever admit that it is wrong for a 57 year old man to have sex with a 9 year old girl... none - ever. Even when you present them with proof that it is physiologically and psychologically devastating for a little girl to be molested at that age. Even when you present them with proof that girls in hot climates are no different than girls in cold climates. They will defend that behavior to the end, even when you ask why a prophet of God would do something like that. And no muslim will even consider the fact that it was wrong for Muhammad to decapitate 800 people who had surrendered to him and were no threat, simply because they didn't fight for Islam (even though they were NOT Muslims)! No Muslim will admit to the cruelty of Muhammad having sex with a woman on the very same day that he decapitated her husband and father and took her as a slave.

This refusal to admit to any faults in Muhammad's character, even though he clearly committed extremely barbaric acts is clear proof that they not only worship him - they IDOLIZE him.

But that they will NEVER admit because it would make them the very thing that they supposedly despise the most - idolators!

Which supports my first point that, just because you claim you do not worship Muhammad definitely does not make it a fact. You have only posted an unsupported empty claim.

Now perhaps you can present some proof that muslims do not worship muhammad - even a little evidence might give someone something to work with.

[Truth_Teller]

Muslim do not worship Muhammad

... But those amongst you who worshipped Muhammad,

Hmmmm...interesting contradiction, but lets not waste time on that.

We only worship Allah The Almighty!!!

Just because you claim only to worship Allah does not make it true. Anybody can claim anything they want to, but actions speak louder than words.

We have to define the word worship:
from www.dictionary.com (my comments in bold)

wor·ship [wur-ship] - noun, verb, -shiped, -ship·ing or (especially British) -shipped, -ship·ping.
–noun
1. reverent honor and homage paid to God or a sacred personage, or to any object regarded as sacred.
Muslims definitely pay homage and show reverent honor to Muhammad. The cartoon slaughters and riots are solid proof than Muhammad is considered sacred to Muslims.

2. formal or ceremonious rendering of such honor and homage: They attended worship this morning.
Muslims include Muhammad in virtually every prayer, you must proclaim his position as THE messenger of allah to even become a Muslim.

3. adoring reverence or regard:
Yes again. Muslims adore Muhammad, reverence him to the point that they will kill people for insulting him. They consider him to be perfect and the best human being that ever lived on the earth.

4. the object of adoring reverence or regard.
Yes again. Just go to youtube and search "muhammad" and start watching the videos

5. British. a title of honor used in addressing or mentioning certain magistrates
Definitely. Muslims can't even say the name of Muhammad without sticking "The Prophet on the front and "(pbuh)" on the end.

6. to render religious reverence and homage to.
again.. of course religious reverence and homage is paid to Muhammad! Muslims even wipe their bums the way he did! Muslims highest goal is to emulate everything about Muhammad because he was the perfect example for all times, right?

7. to feel an adoring reverence or regard for (any person or thing).
–verb (used without object)
Of course. Again - remember a few posts right here that threatened torture and death, hell, etc.. for saying unflattering things about Muhammad (even though they were true).

So tell me muslims, do you feel an adoring reverence and regard for Muhammad? Do you think he was a sinful person just like the rest of us? Do you think he sinned at all? Do you feel deep in your heart that he was the most perfect example for all times and that everything he did should be emulated?

I would even go so far as to say that Muslims not only worship Muhammad but they also

i·dol·ize [ahyd-l-ahyz] verb, -ized, -iz·ing.
1. to regard with blind adoration, devotion, etc.

him. There is clear proof of 'blind adoration' of Muhammad in the fact that muslims will defend his worst crimes with everything they have in them, even when they have to blind themselves to the most basic understanding of morality. Example: No Muslim will ever admit that it is wrong for a 57 year old man to have sex with a 9 year old girl... none - ever. Even when you present them with proof that it is physiologically and psychologically devastating for a little girl to be molested at that age. Even when you present them with proof that girls in hot climates are no different than girls in cold climates. They will defend that behavior to the end, even when you ask why a prophet of God would do something like that. And no muslim will even consider the fact that it was wrong for Muhammad to decapitate 800 people who had surrendered to him and were no threat, simply because they didn't fight for Islam (even though they were NOT Muslims)! No Muslim will admit to the cruelty of Muhammad having sex with a woman on the very same day that he decapitated her husband and father and took her as a slave.

This refusal to admit to any faults in Muhammad's character, even though he clearly committed extremely barbaric acts is clear proof that they not only worship him - they IDOLIZE him.

But that they will NEVER admit because it would make them the very thing that they supposedly despise the most - idolators!

Which supports my first point that, just because you claim you do not worship Muhammad definitely does not make it a fact. You have only posted an unsupported empty claim.

Now perhaps you can present some proof that muslims do not worship muhammad - even a little evidence might give someone something to work with.

I don´t get what you mean? We definitely consider him to be the greatest ever person to have walked to the planet. We copy the things he used to do which are called Sunnahs. We do that because we think that he was the perfect Muslim and that is how we should be as well. To become a Muslim you have to believe Muhammad (peace be upon him) as to be last of Allah´s Messenger. If you mran by "worshipping" that we pray to him or consider him to be The God (Allah forbid) then it just doesn´t make any sense since it´s strictly forbidden as per Qur´an itself. I had pointed out a verse from The Book we consider to be Holiest and Greatest and all Muslims hence should believe in it. By just claiming that we worship him doesn´t make sense either! And if there is anyone who worships him then let him/her know that he/she isn´t following Islam.

As for the protests and slaughter etc. Well what can I say for that? This not allowed in Islam either. If anyone makes his cartoons etc it will only be because he doesn´t know him correctly and is blind-folded by the hate they have been fulfilled with by non-Muslims. There was this instance when he came to know that Abu Bakr (one of Islam´s four righteous caliphs) had said in front of Jews that they don´t believe in someone who is greater than Holy Prophet Moses (peace be upon him). He called upon Abu Bakr and said that no one´s believe should ever be offended and that he wasn´t greater than anyone. So humble he was..... There were Billions of occasions when The Holy Prophet was abused and insulted but did he get them all killed? No! He forgave all the Meccans. The only thing which he couldn´t tolerate was the insult of [/i]Allah The Almighty. He never taught to behead the one who insults him. He was such a forgiving character that he even forgave the murder of his daughter Zainab and her unborn child.

Which 800 people did he decapitate? Apart from the battles he got no one killed. These are just the stories made by his haters, nothing else!!! The one who surrender becomes a prisoner, right? And do you know how much care he had for prisoners? He used to say that prisoners should sleep and eat (in a) better (way) than you yourself. He said that "If a prisoner harms you then forgive him. And if you have harmed him knowingly or unknowingly you should immediately free him".

And slavery?????? One of the main purpose of his life was to get all the female slaves freed forever. That sounds like a joke.

And which nine years old girl did he have sex with????? Do you mean Aisha?

Read this: Most narrations carry misstatements about the age of Aisha at the time of her marriage to the Holy Prophet, (peach and blessings of Allah be upon him). They place this marriage in the tenth year of the Call and state that Aisha was only 6 years old at that time. On proper sifting of the material facts, these statements turn out to be incorrect and it becomes evident that she, in fact, was about 19 or 20 years of age when she arrived in the house of the Holy Prophet Muhammad (peace be upun him) as his wife in 2 A.H. Common sense anyway reveals that when most of his wives were over 30s why would he marry one particular minor???? Senseless!

[Truth_Teller]

Muslim do not worship Muhammad

... But those amongst you who worshipped Muhammad,

Hmmmm...interesting contradiction, but lets not waste time on that.

We only worship Allah The Almighty!!!

Just because you claim only to worship Allah does not make it true. Anybody can claim anything they want to, but actions speak louder than words.

We have to define the word worship:
from www.dictionary.com (my comments in bold)

wor·ship [wur-ship] - noun, verb, -shiped, -ship·ing or (especially British) -shipped, -ship·ping.
–noun
1. reverent honor and homage paid to God or a sacred personage, or to any object regarded as sacred.
Muslims definitely pay homage and show reverent honor to Muhammad. The cartoon slaughters and riots are solid proof than Muhammad is considered sacred to Muslims.

2. formal or ceremonious rendering of such honor and homage: They attended worship this morning.
Muslims include Muhammad in virtually every prayer, you must proclaim his position as THE messenger of allah to even become a Muslim.

3. adoring reverence or regard:
Yes again. Muslims adore Muhammad, reverence him to the point that they will kill people for insulting him. They consider him to be perfect and the best human being that ever lived on the earth.

4. the object of adoring reverence or regard.
Yes again. Just go to youtube and search "muhammad" and start watching the videos

5. British. a title of honor used in addressing or mentioning certain magistrates
Definitely. Muslims can't even say the name of Muhammad without sticking "The Prophet on the front and "(pbuh)" on the end.

6. to render religious reverence and homage to.
again.. of course religious reverence and homage is paid to Muhammad! Muslims even wipe their bums the way he did! Muslims highest goal is to emulate everything about Muhammad because he was the perfect example for all times, right?

7. to feel an adoring reverence or regard for (any person or thing).
–verb (used without object)
Of course. Again - remember a few posts right here that threatened torture and death, hell, etc.. for saying unflattering things about Muhammad (even though they were true).

So tell me muslims, do you feel an adoring reverence and regard for Muhammad? Do you think he was a sinful person just like the rest of us? Do you think he sinned at all? Do you feel deep in your heart that he was the most perfect example for all times and that everything he did should be emulated?

I would even go so far as to say that Muslims not only worship Muhammad but they also

i·dol·ize [ahyd-l-ahyz] verb, -ized, -iz·ing.
1. to regard with blind adoration, devotion, etc.

him. There is clear proof of 'blind adoration' of Muhammad in the fact that muslims will defend his worst crimes with everything they have in them, even when they have to blind themselves to the most basic understanding of morality. Example: No Muslim will ever admit that it is wrong for a 57 year old man to have sex with a 9 year old girl... none - ever. Even when you present them with proof that it is physiologically and psychologically devastating for a little girl to be molested at that age. Even when you present them with proof that girls in hot climates are no different than girls in cold climates. They will defend that behavior to the end, even when you ask why a prophet of God would do something like that. And no muslim will even consider the fact that it was wrong for Muhammad to decapitate 800 people who had surrendered to him and were no threat, simply because they didn't fight for Islam (even though they were NOT Muslims)! No Muslim will admit to the cruelty of Muhammad having sex with a woman on the very same day that he decapitated her husband and father and took her as a slave.

This refusal to admit to any faults in Muhammad's character, even though he clearly committed extremely barbaric acts is clear proof that they not only worship him - they IDOLIZE him.

But that they will NEVER admit because it would make them the very thing that they supposedly despise the most - idolators!

Which supports my first point that, just because you claim you do not worship Muhammad definitely does not make it a fact. You have only posted an unsupported empty claim.

Now perhaps you can present some proof that muslims do not worship muhammad - even a little evidence might give someone something to work with.

I don´t get what you mean? We definitely consider him to be the greatest ever person to have walked to the planet. We copy the things he used to do which are called Sunnahs. We do that because we think that he was the perfect Muslim and that is how we should be as well. To become a Muslim you have to believe Muhammad (peace be upon him) as to be last of Allah´s Messenger. If you mean by "worshipping" that we pray to him or consider him to be The God (Allah forbid) then it just doesn´t make any sense since it´s strictly forbidden as per Qur´an itself. I had pointed out a verse from The Book we consider to be Holiest and Greatest and all Muslims hence should believe in it. By just claiming that we worship him doesn´t make sense either! And if there is anyone who worships him then let him/her know that he/she isn´t following Islam.

As for the protests and slaughter etc. Well what can I say for that? This not allowed in Islam either. If anyone makes his cartoons etc it will only be because he doesn´t know him correctly and is blind-folded by the hate they have been fulfilled with by non-Muslims. There was this instance when he came to know that Abu Bakr (one of Islam´s four righteous caliphs) had said in front of Jews that they don´t believe in someone who is greater than Holy Prophet Moses (peace be upon him). He called upon Abu Bakr and said that no one´s believe should ever be offended and that he wasn´t greater than anyone. So humble he was..... There were Billions of occasions when The Holy Prophet was abused and insulted but did he get them all killed? No! He forgave all the Meccans. The only thing which he couldn´t tolerate was the insult of Allah The Almighty. He never taught to behead the one who insults him. He was such a forgiving character that he even forgave the murder of his daughter Zainab and her unborn child.

Which 800 people did he decapitate? Apart from the battles he got no one killed. These are just the stories made by his haters, nothing else!!! The one who surrender becomes a prisoner, right? And do you know how much care he had for prisoners? He used to say that prisoners should sleep and eat (in a) better (way) than you yourself. He said that "If a prisoner harms you then forgive him. And if you have harmed him knowingly or unknowingly you should immediately free him".

And slavery?????? One of the main purpose of his life was to get all the female slaves freed forever. That sounds like a joke.

And which nine years old girl did he have sex with????? Do you mean Aisha?

Read this: Most narrations carry misstatements about the age of Aisha at the time of her marriage to the Holy Prophet, (peach and blessings of Allah be upon him). They place this marriage in the tenth year of the Call and state that Aisha was only 6 years old at that time. On proper sifting of the material facts, these statements turn out to be incorrect and it becomes evident that she, in fact, was about 19 or 20 years of age when she arrived in the house of the Holy Prophet Muhammad (peace be upun him) as his wife in 2 A.H. Common sense anyway reveals that when most of his wives were over 30s why would he marry one particular minor???? Senseless!