Well, just want to see if anyone is interested why Islam is right.
canadianhorsefan
Islam
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Powerofdaword
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Post #31
i dont personally believe that allah is god, as for the quran having stuff about emryology it would appear that allah doesnt even know what he created man from:
What was man created from, blood, clay, dust, or nothing?
"Created man, out of a (mere) clot of congealed blood," (96:2).
"We created man from sounding clay, from mud moulded into shape, (15:26).
"The similitude of Jesus before Allah is as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him: "Be". And he was," (3:59).
"But does not man call to mind that We created him before out of nothing?" (19:67, Yusuf Ali). Also, 52:35).
"He has created man from a sperm-drop; and behold this same (man) becomes an open disputer! (16:4).
How can allah be god if he doesnt know this?
What was man created from, blood, clay, dust, or nothing?
"Created man, out of a (mere) clot of congealed blood," (96:2).
"We created man from sounding clay, from mud moulded into shape, (15:26).
"The similitude of Jesus before Allah is as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him: "Be". And he was," (3:59).
"But does not man call to mind that We created him before out of nothing?" (19:67, Yusuf Ali). Also, 52:35).
"He has created man from a sperm-drop; and behold this same (man) becomes an open disputer! (16:4).
How can allah be god if he doesnt know this?
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chrispalasz
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Post #32
Well... I put no.
Even though I know God - I assumed that when you said "Allah", you were specifically referring to the god that the Qu'ran talks about.
I only believe there is one God. And just because somebody believes in a creator... doesn't mean they believe in God. The only God is Jesus Christ. Anyone who does not have faith that Jesus Christ is God - doesn't know Him at all. They have their own god. For you... that god is called "Allah".
Believing that multiple religions lead to God does mean a person believes in a creator... but definately does not make someone a Christian, and shows that they truly do not know.
Before Christ, any person that had faith in God and a Savior believed in God. But the god of Islam and the god of the Jews that rejected Christ... is definately not the same God. And that's what Jesus was saying when He kept telling them that they do not know God.
It's like if I were to call you "Joe" when you're name is "Bill" and I said your favorite drink is rum when your favorite drink is milk and I said you are a practicing bisexual when you believe that homosexual relations is wrong. Am I talking about YOU? Or am I talking about somebody else... completely mistaken? The answer is the latter. You are not the same as the person I described.
God is not the same as the Islam god or the Jewish god or the Hindu god or any other god.
Piper Plexed:
I don't know what you were getting at, exactly, by your first few posts. So... do you believe Jesus Christ is God? Do you believe Jesus is the only Truth and Salvation of men? Please clarify. You are a member of the Christian group... so I should be able to assume the answer is yes to those questions... but you confused me.
Even though I know God - I assumed that when you said "Allah", you were specifically referring to the god that the Qu'ran talks about.
I only believe there is one God. And just because somebody believes in a creator... doesn't mean they believe in God. The only God is Jesus Christ. Anyone who does not have faith that Jesus Christ is God - doesn't know Him at all. They have their own god. For you... that god is called "Allah".
Believing that multiple religions lead to God does mean a person believes in a creator... but definately does not make someone a Christian, and shows that they truly do not know.
Before Christ, any person that had faith in God and a Savior believed in God. But the god of Islam and the god of the Jews that rejected Christ... is definately not the same God. And that's what Jesus was saying when He kept telling them that they do not know God.
It's like if I were to call you "Joe" when you're name is "Bill" and I said your favorite drink is rum when your favorite drink is milk and I said you are a practicing bisexual when you believe that homosexual relations is wrong. Am I talking about YOU? Or am I talking about somebody else... completely mistaken? The answer is the latter. You are not the same as the person I described.
God is not the same as the Islam god or the Jewish god or the Hindu god or any other god.
Piper Plexed:
I don't know what you were getting at, exactly, by your first few posts. So... do you believe Jesus Christ is God? Do you believe Jesus is the only Truth and Salvation of men? Please clarify. You are a member of the Christian group... so I should be able to assume the answer is yes to those questions... but you confused me.
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Piper Plexed
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Post #33
No prob, let me try again, I believe there is one God, How various groups or cultures perceive that one God is expressed in their religion. God is the constant religion being mans expression of love for the one God. Jesus is my savior he is the son of God, I worship and praise him as I do God. Just because I believe that Christ is the way to God I do not deduce that only Christians can know God just that Christianity is the only way for me to know God. God is the Father of man, all of man. I hope this is clearer.GreenLight311 wrote: Piper Plexed:
I don't know what you were getting at, exactly, by your first few posts. So... do you believe Jesus Christ is God? Do you believe Jesus is the only Truth and Salvation of men? Please clarify. You are a member of the Christian group... so I should be able to assume the answer is yes to those questions... but you confused me.
Last edited by Piper Plexed on Thu Nov 11, 2004 7:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
*"I think, therefore I am" (Cogito, ergo sum)-Descartes
** I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that ...
** I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that ...
Post #34
Allah (which means god in Arabic), your god and the god of Judeism is the one and the same, It is the god of Abraham. These three belief systems all stem from the Abrahamic god and that is why they are known, collectively, as the Abrahamic religions.GreenLight311 wrote: Even though I know God - I assumed that when you said "Allah", you were specifically referring to the god that the Qu'ran talks about.
Those exact words are, in effect, part of the first tenet of IslamGreenLight311 wrote: I only believe there is one God.
And you, in your own words, have claimed 'knowledge'. On what basis do you judge this so called knowledge to be correct?GreenLight311 wrote: Believing that multiple religions lead to God does mean a person believes in a creator... but definately does not make someone a Christian, and shows that they truly do not know.
I'll agree on the Hindu god - Hindusim is a religion based on atheism. They do however, have over 300 million 'deities' which are manifestations of various traits of nature and divinity.GreenLight311 wrote: God is not the same as the Islam god or the Jewish god or the Hindu god or any other god.
The JCI god however is one and the same for all three belief systems.
I find it interesting that Muslims I have spoken to are only to keen to acknowledge that Allah and the god of christianity are one and the same. Why the christian hang up on this?
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Piper Plexed
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Post #35
Yeah, I do tobernee51 wrote: I find it interesting that Muslims I have spoken to are only to keen to acknowledge that Allah and the god of christianity are one and the same. Why the christian hang up on this?
I suspect that it is an expression of the Superego. Or in short "It is My Way or the Highway cause that is what I believe".*"I think, therefore I am" (Cogito, ergo sum)-Descartes
** I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that ...
** I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that ...
Tisk Tisk GreenLight
Post #36No you believe there are many GODS one for Christians, one for Muslims and one for Jews. YOu say so in your next quoteGreenLight311 wrote: I only believe there is one God.
Seeing that you believe in Jesus, who was a Jew and seeing that he taught of the GOD of Abraham, Issac anf Jacob(jacob being the father of the isrealites). It seems quite ridiculous that you deduce that the GOD of the JEWs is not the Same God of the Christians.GreenLight311 wrote: God is not the same as the Islam god or the Jewish god or the Hindu god or any other god.
I am not trying to be mean but that has to be one of the most uneducated and erroneous statements I have seen on this site.
If I were a Christian I Would be highly upset with that statement, and I were religious I would forced to condemn you to hell for it. You just blasphemed your own GOD!!!
But since I am not either I would just suggest that you study more or pay more attention to the statements you make in the heat of the debate
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Piper Plexed
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Re: Tisk Tisk GreenLight
Post #37This comment violates the ruleArch wrote: I am not trying to be mean but that has to be one of the most uneducated and erroneous statements I have seen on this site.
1. No personal attacks of any sort are allowed.
Rules
We are here to explore ideas not to judge each other. Personal attacks do not further civil discourse.
*"I think, therefore I am" (Cogito, ergo sum)-Descartes
** I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that ...
** I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that ...
Re: Tisk Tisk GreenLight
Post #38Piper Plexed wrote:This comment violates the ruleArch wrote: I am not trying to be mean but that has to be one of the most uneducated and erroneous statements I have seen on this site.
1. No personal attacks of any sort are allowed.
Rules
Sorry... I wasn't meaning that as a personal attack on the person just on the statement itself.
If it was taken to suggest that I was saying that the person was uneducated... I am sorry
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fizikally mental
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...
Post #39i would like to point out a few points here.
I dun think that the bible, from genesis to revelation that condemns anyone to hell. Jesus did not explicitly say that those who do not acknowledge me will go to hell. It is us who automatically conclude that those who do not believe in jesus will go to hell. We did this based on simple logic. For example, my friends can come to my house, thats what i said, but this does not mean that those who r not my friends cannot come to my house since i did not indicate in anyway that they r not welcome. Unfortunately being smart humans, we r quick to conclude that friends r welcomed, strangers r unwelcomed.
There is no point citing claims from the quran and the bible regarding space, embriology, and science. Not everything in the bible is accurate neither is the quran, we r not 100% sure that it is accurate to the highest degree. Claims about the word of God being preserved when it is passed around by word of mouth is very unconvincing. Humans being humans, we will always like to exaggerate.
Killing anyone regardless of motive is wrong, no one has the right to kill anyone.
If we want to determine whether something is from God, we can easily do so by lookinh deep into it. For example, we can see that the Dalai Lama has something undescribable, something righteous, pope john paul has also this 'energy' that radiates from him. The same goes to mother theresa, its like seeing the merciful face of God. Judge a tree by its fruit, and u will know whether its good or bad.
God is God, there aren't a few versions of God. The only part that is different is how u understand and interpret ur God. Einstein's understanding of a God that is totally out of the convention way of understanding God.
If u r a muslim, be a good muslim, if u r a christian be a good christian, if u r a bahai, be a good bahai etc.
I dun think that the bible, from genesis to revelation that condemns anyone to hell. Jesus did not explicitly say that those who do not acknowledge me will go to hell. It is us who automatically conclude that those who do not believe in jesus will go to hell. We did this based on simple logic. For example, my friends can come to my house, thats what i said, but this does not mean that those who r not my friends cannot come to my house since i did not indicate in anyway that they r not welcome. Unfortunately being smart humans, we r quick to conclude that friends r welcomed, strangers r unwelcomed.
There is no point citing claims from the quran and the bible regarding space, embriology, and science. Not everything in the bible is accurate neither is the quran, we r not 100% sure that it is accurate to the highest degree. Claims about the word of God being preserved when it is passed around by word of mouth is very unconvincing. Humans being humans, we will always like to exaggerate.
Killing anyone regardless of motive is wrong, no one has the right to kill anyone.
If we want to determine whether something is from God, we can easily do so by lookinh deep into it. For example, we can see that the Dalai Lama has something undescribable, something righteous, pope john paul has also this 'energy' that radiates from him. The same goes to mother theresa, its like seeing the merciful face of God. Judge a tree by its fruit, and u will know whether its good or bad.
God is God, there aren't a few versions of God. The only part that is different is how u understand and interpret ur God. Einstein's understanding of a God that is totally out of the convention way of understanding God.
If u r a muslim, be a good muslim, if u r a christian be a good christian, if u r a bahai, be a good bahai etc.
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chrispalasz
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good people
Post #40Actually, the Bible does say, in too many places to count, that if you do not have faith in God who is Jesus Christ, you will go to Hell. It also says numerous things about Hell to give us an idea of how terrible a place it is.
If I post all the passages that do say this, will you believe them? Any of them? If they are numerous and if they are straight forward (even though those should not be requirements when deciding what is right/true in the Bible)? If the answer is "yes", I will go ahead and post them all.
Otherwise I won't bother.
As far as I'm concerned, the Dalai Llama, good Muslims, and good Bahai's are all going to hell - much to my dismay. I would like to see all people come to repentence, I would like to see all people know Christ, but the Bible says that won't happen.
If I post all the passages that do say this, will you believe them? Any of them? If they are numerous and if they are straight forward (even though those should not be requirements when deciding what is right/true in the Bible)? If the answer is "yes", I will go ahead and post them all.
Otherwise I won't bother.
As far as I'm concerned, the Dalai Llama, good Muslims, and good Bahai's are all going to hell - much to my dismay. I would like to see all people come to repentence, I would like to see all people know Christ, but the Bible says that won't happen.
