Fatihah wrote:
The Muslims fought in defense. And when the weapon of choice by the attacker is a sword, than it is very logical that one should use a sword in defense, and self-defense does not contradict one's intent for peace.
Islam had remarkable growth during its first 150 years. These came primarily as a result of military conquests.
Light Expansion under Muhammad, 622–632/A.H. 1-11
Medium Expansion during the Rashidun Caliphate, 632–661/A.H. 11-40
Dark Expansion during the Umayyad Caliphate, 661–750/A.H. 40-129
Question for debate: were these conquests the result of purely defensive wars?
Examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good. First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians The truth will make you free. Gospel of John
The reality is that not every war that was fought by Muslims was a defensive war nor was Islam spread by the sword. Ever since Islam appeared in Makkah it has continued to increase and spread, today Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world, as verified by numerous sources, is Islam currently spreading by the sword?
There is a book written by a non-muslim historian, cant remember the name, the book is called 'Islam at the Crossroads' the author says, "History makes it clear that the legend of fanatical muslims sweeping across the world, forcing Islam at the point of the sword is the most fantastic, absurd myth that historians have ever repeated."
If Islam was spread by the sword why haven't the 14 million Coptic christians living in the arab world which has been predominantly muslim for over 1400 years been forced into Islam? Or the Jews that live until today in places like Yemen? The biggest populations of Muslims today live in Indonesia and Malaysia, which Muslim army went there and forced those people to become Muslims? The answer is none.
If a Muslim attempts to claim that EVERY war the Muslims entered into when they were united under one banner was a defensive war they are falling into a trap. However, its not from the doctrine of Islam to force people to enter it, as the Koran states, "There is no compulsion in religion, the true and correct path is distinct from the wrong path" and the koran also says, "Invite to the Way of your Lord with wisdom and fair preaching" This is the manner in which Muslims are supposed to invite and inform people about Islam.
Islam is a religion of peace, a peace which is brought about by submitting oneself to the one true god and not associating any partner with him, the creator, the almighty, the one who fashioned the heavens and the earth, whatever you want to call Him, because the biggest form of oppression is to oppress oneself by directing worship at any other than the one who created you and ultimately controls all of your affairs.
McCulloch wrote:were these conquests the result of purely defensive wars?
‘Arabs lived in vicious times in those early desert days. Scant resources. Cycle after cycle of vendetta and counter–vendetta. Considering that Muhammad had OSTENSIBLY united disparate Arab tribes and forbidden those who made up the Ummah (Islamic community) to attack each other, after his death people had to expand outwards in order to survive. This, to me, makes it more an economic necessity (at least to start off with).
Is not peaceful because it is an injustice to the people and not the dimensions of oppression and killing of innocents
This did not do the Islamic conquests, the Islamic conquests to lift the injustice
That is simply not true, the Russians stated reason for going into Georgia was to stop the oppression the ethnic Russians were experiencing from the Georgians. In fact the Russians say they were asked to enter by the ethnic Russian Georgians.
AkiThePirate wrote:Would you consider the American invasion of Iraq to be 'peaceful'?
Is not peaceful because it is an injustice to the people and not the dimensions of oppression and killing of innocents
This did not do the Islamic conquests, the Islamic conquests to lift the injustice
Response: Islam was not only spread through defense, but to also remove oppression. For there were many times in which the people governed by an unislamic government would request the aid of established islamic government to remove them from oppression. As such, a war would break out between the two governments, and on most occasions, the muslims were successful, thus helping to expand their empire.
How can Islam be spread through defence. Marching into another country and conquering it is not defence. Also alot of country's must of wanted help from Islamic governments, to redeem them from unislamic governments.
Can you give me a link to where you get this information from please?
I agree that Islam did not force conversion upon the City's it conquered, but it did conquer City to gain more Territory, and not in defence of people.
Response: Islam was not only spread through defense, but to also remove oppression. For there were many times in which the people governed by an unislamic government would request the aid of established islamic government to remove them from oppression. As such, a war would break out between the two governments, and on most occasions, the muslims were successful, thus helping to expand their empire.
How can Islam be spread through defence. Marching into another country and conquering it is not defence. Also alot of country's must of wanted help from Islamic governments, to redeem them from unislamic governments.
Can you give me a link to where you get this information from please?
I agree that Islam did not force conversion upon the City's it conquered, but it did conquer City to gain more Territory, and not in defence of people.
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Response: It spread through defense by conquering those who waged war on them. Since it was an act of defense, then its expansion is a result of defense. Again, not all wars were defensive wars, but wars in which to remove oppression upon requests of those being oppressed by the nations they were governed by. I do not know of any links. My knowledge comes the old-fashioned way, reading of books. Not all info is on the net. However, a simple request in your search engine on the expansion of the islamic empire will help to bring a lot of information. What you feel is worth discussing, you can surely bring to the table, and we can compare and study.
Response: It spread through defense by conquering those who waged war on them. Since it was an act of defense, then its expansion is a result of defense. Again, not all wars were defensive wars, but wars in which to remove oppression upon requests of those being oppressed by the nations they were governed by. I do not know of any links. My knowledge comes the old-fashioned way, reading of books. Not all info is on the net. However, a simple request in your search engine on the expansion of the islamic empire will help to bring a lot of information. What you feel is worth discussing, you can surely bring to the table, and we can compare and study.
Who were the muslims defending during the sieges of Constantinople?
Response: It spread through defense by conquering those who waged war on them. Since it was an act of defense, then its expansion is a result of defense. Again, not all wars were defensive wars, but wars in which to remove oppression upon requests of those being oppressed by the nations they were governed by. I do not know of any links. My knowledge comes the old-fashioned way, reading of books. Not all info is on the net. However, a simple request in your search engine on the expansion of the islamic empire will help to bring a lot of information. What you feel is worth discussing, you can surely bring to the table, and we can compare and study.
Who were the muslims defending during the sieges of Constantinople?
