Quran Burining and Associated Killings

[fredonly]

Afghan President asks US Congress to condemn Quran burning

Afghan protests continue against Qur'an burning

I have absolutely no problem with Muslims peacefully protesting the rude act of Quran burning. But what I cannot understand is why Muslims are not protesting the deaths of innocent people that were the result of these protests. Do Muslims consider a copy of their "sacred" book to be more important than a human life? I certainly hope not, but I'd like to hear that from the Muslims who participate on this site.


Are there stories about the protests my Muslim leaders over these deaths? I haven't seen any, so please post the links if you see one.

[happy forever]

Afghan President asks US Congress to condemn Quran burning

Afghan protests continue against Qur'an burning

I have absolutely no problem with Muslims peacefully protesting the rude act of Quran burning. But what I cannot understand is why Muslims are not protesting the deaths of innocent people that were the result of these protests. Do Muslims consider a copy of their "sacred" book to be more important than a human life? I certainly hope not, but I'd like to hear that from the Muslims who participate on this site.


Are there stories about the protests my Muslim leaders over these deaths? I haven't seen any, so please post the links if you see one.

I don't know the whole story but it is a matter of principles.
for example,
No one accepts any prophet to be insulted whether Muhammad, Jesus, Muses,,,
No one accepts to throw dirts in mosques, churches,,,,
No one accepts his wife to be raped.
No one accepts his money to be stolen.
No one accepts his dignity to be disdained.
No one accepts to think of uttering one bad word against The God.
No one accepts to disdain the Words of The God.

If your country is not doing its duty in protecting you, your family, your property, your religion, your dignity, is it enough to say "I condemn."?

[sarabellum]

I think in a perfect world that people should be okay with this form of expression...
(Quran burning)

I'll let you in on a secret....
This is not a perfect world....

People respond to insults differently...
Emotional maturity varies in humans...
Anger control is a hard skill to master...

My dear old dad use to say...
Three things you should never do....

Insult a mans wife...
Insult a mans country...
Insult a mans religion....

How one reacts to insult varies...
(and perhaps doesn't mean your an extremist)

In America you can burn a flag....

I personally have known "good" Americans that respond with anger and violence towards this idea...
I would not suggest employing this mode of expression in their presents...
For whatever reason the flag is a big deal to them...
Seeing it desecrated causes an emotional response...
This response is violence and anger...
Being a patriot means different things to different people...



You have freedom of speech....
People have the freedom to react...


Perhaps pulling on a tigers tail is a bad idea...

[fewwillfindit]

I don't know the whole story but it is a matter of principles.
for example,
No one accepts any prophet to be insulted whether Muhammad, Jesus, Muses,,,
No one accepts to throw dirts in mosques, churches,,,,
No one accepts his wife to be raped.
No one accepts his money to be stolen.
No one accepts his dignity to be disdained.
No one accepts to think of uttering one bad word against The God.
No one accepts to disdain the Words of The God.

If your country is not doing its duty in protecting you, your family, your property, your religion, your dignity, is it enough to say "I condemn."?

The chasm between "no one accepts..." and murder is immense. Are you condoning murder as an acceptable reaction to your god being insulted?

[fredonly]

I think in a perfect world that people should be okay with this form of expression...
(Quran burning)

I'll let you in on a secret....
This is not a perfect world....

People respond to insults differently...
Emotional maturity varies in humans...
Anger control is a hard skill to master...

My dear old dad use to say...
Three things you should never do....

Insult a mans wife...
Insult a mans country...
Insult a mans religion....

How one reacts to insult varies...
(and perhaps doesn't mean your an extremist)

In America you can burn a flag....

I personally have known "good" Americans that respond with anger and violence towards this idea...
I would not suggest employing this mode of expression in their presents...
For whatever reason the flag is a big deal to them...
Seeing it desecrated causes an emotional response...
This response is violence and anger...
Being a patriot means different things to different people...



You have freedom of speech....
People have the freedom to react...


Perhaps pulling on a tigers tail is a bad idea...

I have no problem with reacting, but I do have a problem with killing people. An appropriate response for Muslim clerics would be to say something like, "we condemn the act of this extremist Christians who desecrated our sacred book, however we regret and condemn the taking of innocent lives that resulted from the protests over the Quran burning." If they want to be even more reasonable, they would add, "important as the Quran is, no printed copy of the Prophet's words is as important as the life of a man."

Is there anything wrong with this? Why aren't Muslims making such statments?

[happy forever]

I think in a perfect world that people should be okay with this form of expression...
(Quran burning)

I'll let you in on a secret....
This is not a perfect world....

People respond to insults differently...
Emotional maturity varies in humans...
Anger control is a hard skill to master...

My dear old dad use to say...
Three things you should never do....

Insult a mans wife...
Insult a mans country...
Insult a mans religion....

How one reacts to insult varies...
(and perhaps doesn't mean your an extremist)

In America you can burn a flag....

I personally have known "good" Americans that respond with anger and violence towards this idea...
I would not suggest employing this mode of expression in their presents...
For whatever reason the flag is a big deal to them...
Seeing it desecrated causes an emotional response...
This response is violence and anger...
Being a patriot means different things to different people...
..

As I said I don't know the whole story and misunderstand your message.
You wrote "why Muslims are not protesting the deaths of innocent people that were the result of these protests".
I thought innocent peole are among the protesters, I couldn't imagine that you call those who burnt the book of Allah innocents.
According to the rules of Islam, No killing except with right and this right is through just judgment in a court excuting the law of the country because if everyone applied his own law, we would live in jungle.
The rules of Islam are the best rules.
Concerning your question, this is not a question. Ex:
Someone lied under oath causing unjust punishment to an innocent whether this punishment is murder, exile,, prison,,,then we discovered his lie, what will we do?
According to you, he shouldn't be punished for uttering some words.
Another clearer example, someone killed a person with a knife, according to you we shouldn't punish the murderer for stabbing a trivial knife using his palm!!!!
At least punish his palm not the whole innocent body!!!
If you Know Allah The Creator The Most Gracious the Most Merciful, you wouldn't say that.
If you know the greatness of The Munificent Quran, you wouldn't say that.

[fredonly]

As I said I don't know the whole story and misunderstand your message.
You wrote "why Muslims are not protesting the deaths of innocent people that were the result of these protests".
I thought innocent peole are among the protesters, I couldn't imagine that you call those who burnt the book of Allah innocents.

The people who burnt the book are guilty of burning a book and of being disrespectful of Muslim beliefs. I don't condone such antics, and I think the pastor who led this is an idiot and provocateur. However, I strongly believe that a death of a human is more significant than the burning of a book. Do you disagree?

According to the rules of Islam, No killing except with right and this right is through just judgment in a court excuting the law of the country because if everyone applied his own law, we would live in jungle.
The rules of Islam are the best rules.

Then it should be perfectly fine for Muslims to condemn the violence that led to the deaths, shouldn't it? Where are the condemnations?

Concerning your question, this is not a question. Ex:
Someone lied under oath causing unjust punishment to an innocent whether this punishment is murder, exile,, prison,,,then we discovered his lie, what will we do?
According to you, he shouldn't be punished for uttering some words.

I don't know how this would be treated legally, but morally, the person who lied has essentially committed murder. "What will we do" - I'm not talking about law enforcement, I am speaking of moral guidance. It seems to me that the message from the Muslim community is tacitly condoning the violence.

Another clearer example, someone killed a person with a knife, according to you we shouldn't punish the murderer for stabbing a trivial knife using his palm!!!!
At least punish his palm not the whole innocent body!!!

That's downright silly. A person should be held accountable for his actions.[/quote]

If you Know Allah The Creator The Most Gracious the Most Merciful, you wouldn't say that.
If you know the greatness of The Munificent Quran, you wouldn't say that.

I don't believe in your god, but I also don't say that silliness. Does your "most Merciful" god truly think it's a good idea for people to react violently to the burning of a book? Does he consider a copy of a book more important than a human life?

[happy forever]

As I said I don't know the whole story and misunderstand your message.
You wrote "why Muslims are not protesting the deaths of innocent people that were the result of these protests".
I thought innocent peole are among the protesters, I couldn't imagine that you call those who burnt the book of Allah innocents.

The people who burnt the book are guilty of burning a book and of being disrespectful of Muslim beliefs. I don't condone such antics, and I think the pastor who led this is an idiot and provocateur. However, I strongly believe that a death of a human is more significant than the burning of a book. Do you disagree?

According to the rules of Islam, No killing except with right and this right is through just judgment in a court excuting the law of the country because if everyone applied his own law, we would live in jungle.
The rules of Islam are the best rules.

Then it should be perfectly fine for Muslims to condemn the violence that led to the deaths, shouldn't it? Where are the condemnations?

Concerning your question, this is not a question. Ex:
Someone lied under oath causing unjust punishment to an innocent whether this punishment is murder, exile,, prison,,,then we discovered his lie, what will we do?
According to you, he shouldn't be punished for uttering some words.

I don't know how this would be treated legally, but morally, the person who lied has essentially committed murder. "What will we do" - I'm not talking about law enforcement, I am speaking of moral guidance. It seems to me that the message from the Muslim community is tacitly condoning the violence.

Another clearer example, someone killed a person with a knife, according to you we shouldn't punish the murderer for stabbing a trivial knife using his palm!!!!
At least punish his palm not the whole innocent body!!!

That's downright silly. A person should be held accountable for his actions.

If you Know Allah The Creator The Most Gracious the Most Merciful, you wouldn't say that.
If you know the greatness of The Munificent Quran, you wouldn't say that.

I don't believe in your god, but I also don't say that silliness. Does your "most Merciful" god truly think it's a good idea for people to react violently to the burning of a book? Does he consider a copy of a book more important than a human life?[/quote]

I think you didn't get my piont.
First, it is not a matter of burning papers, but what is in the papers.
We Muslims are not afraid that The Quran would be finished by burning it because Allah said: "! We, even We, reveal the Reminder, and lo! We verily are its Guardian. (9)"[15-9]
The matter is related to The Quran, you don't know it. As I told you it is not related to materials (papers, utterances, knife), but morals (violation).
It is the words of Allah our Creator must be kept in a clean respectful place. When it is recited, all attendants must listen.
"Had We sent down this Qur'ân on a mountain, you would surely have seen it humbling itself and rendt asunder by the fear of Allâh. Such are the parables which We put forward to mankind that they may reflect[]. (21) He is Allâh, beside Whom Lâ ilâha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He) the All-Knower of the unseen and the seen. He is the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful. (22) He is Allâh beside Whom is Lâ ilâha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He) the King, the Holy, the One Free from all defects, the Giver of security, the Watcher over His creatures, the All-Mighty, the Compeller, the Supreme. Glory be to Allâh! (High is He) above all that they associate as partners with Him. (23) He is Allâh, the Creator, the Inventor of all things, the Bestower of forms. To Him belong the Best Names[] . All that is in the heavens and the earth glorify Him. And He is the All-Mighty, the All-Wise. (24)" [59-21]

[fredonly]

As I said I don't know the whole story and misunderstand your message.
You wrote "why Muslims are not protesting the deaths of innocent people that were the result of these protests".
I thought innocent peole are among the protesters, I couldn't imagine that you call those who burnt the book of Allah innocents.

The people who burnt the book are guilty of burning a book and of being disrespectful of Muslim beliefs. I don't condone such antics, and I think the pastor who led this is an idiot and provocateur. However, I strongly believe that a death of a human is more significant than the burning of a book. Do you disagree?

According to the rules of Islam, No killing except with right and this right is through just judgment in a court excuting the law of the country because if everyone applied his own law, we would live in jungle.
The rules of Islam are the best rules.

Then it should be perfectly fine for Muslims to condemn the violence that led to the deaths, shouldn't it? Where are the condemnations?

Concerning your question, this is not a question. Ex:
Someone lied under oath causing unjust punishment to an innocent whether this punishment is murder, exile,, prison,,,then we discovered his lie, what will we do?
According to you, he shouldn't be punished for uttering some words.

I don't know how this would be treated legally, but morally, the person who lied has essentially committed murder. "What will we do" - I'm not talking about law enforcement, I am speaking of moral guidance. It seems to me that the message from the Muslim community is tacitly condoning the violence.

Another clearer example, someone killed a person with a knife, according to you we shouldn't punish the murderer for stabbing a trivial knife using his palm!!!!
At least punish his palm not the whole innocent body!!!

That's downright silly. A person should be held accountable for his actions.

If you Know Allah The Creator The Most Gracious the Most Merciful, you wouldn't say that.
If you know the greatness of The Munificent Quran, you wouldn't say that.

I don't believe in your god, but I also don't say that silliness. Does your "most Merciful" god truly think it's a good idea for people to react violently to the burning of a book? Does he consider a copy of a book more important than a human life?
I think you didn't get my piont.
First, it is not a matter of burning papers, but what is in the papers.

We Muslims are not afraid that The Quran would be finished by burning it because Allah said: "! We, even We, reveal the Reminder, and lo! We verily are its Guardian. (9)"[15-9]
The matter is related to The Quran, you don't know it. As I told you it is not related to materials (papers, utterances, knife), but morals (violation).

Terry Jones and the other participants only burned paper, didn't they? They did not obliterate the Quran from the face of the earth. If you consider it immoral to burn the Quran, can you please explain why?

It is the words of Allah our Creator must be kept in a clean respectful place.

How far do you take the word, "must?" Terry Jones failed to do this. What is the appropriate consequence, and who should deliver this consequence?

When it is recited, all attendants must listen.

Who is included in "all attendants?" All Muslims? All people, regardless of their faith?

"Had We sent down this Qur'ân on a mountain, you would surely have seen it humbling itself and rendt asunder by the fear of Allâh. Such are the parables which We put forward to mankind that they may reflect[]. (21) He is Allâh, beside Whom Lâ ilâha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He) the All-Knower of the unseen and the seen. He is the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful. (22) He is Allâh beside Whom is Lâ ilâha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He) the King, the Holy, the One Free from all defects, the Giver of security, the Watcher over His creatures, the All-Mighty, the Compeller, the Supreme. Glory be to Allâh! (High is He) above all that they associate as partners with Him. (23) He is Allâh, the Creator, the Inventor of all things, the Bestower of forms. To Him belong the Best Names[] . All that is in the heavens and the earth glorify Him. And He is the All-Mighty, the All-Wise. (24)" [59-21]

I understand these are your beliefs, and you are welcome to them. Do you grant me the same courtesy and allow me to believe what I believe?

Please answer these questions:
Should the people who burned the Quran be punished? If so, by whom, and in what manner? For example, do you agree with the people who've threatened to kill Terry Jones? (see: http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162- ... 04083.html)

Which was worse: the burning of the Quran or the deaths that resulted from the "protests?" -- THIS is the point of my debate question, and you haven't answered this.

[happy forever]

[quote="fredonly"][quote="happy forever"][quote="fredonly"][quote="happy forever"]


If you consider it immoral to burn the Quran, can you please explain why?Can you explain why this man announced to burn the book then do that publically?
As I told you it is not a matter of papers.
Do you know that we Muslims burn the old copies of The book instead of being kept without use.
If he bought hundreds of hundreds of copies of the book and burned them at home, would this lead to the situation now?
It is not only a religious matter but also a political one.
Don’t tell me this man burned a book and that is it and those protesters exaggerate.
This man wants to deliver an evil symbolic message:
He wants to say to all Muslims that Islam and the book of The God are all…………..
This man hates Muslims and thinks that by this triviality will be able to make people hate Islam.
And these 300 threats is a lie. It is just another way of propaganda to raise hatred against Muslims.
I advise you when you read news, read what is between the lines and what is beyond the words and who is the writer and what is the site and what is the purpose (the hidden purpose).
Should the people who burned the Quran be punished? If so, by whom, and in what manner?Yes, he should be punished because if no, many others would imitate him which will lead to more hatred not only against the doers but also against the state which let those commit such crimes against Muslim and Islam.
I answered the second question before:
According to the rules of Islam, No killing except with right and this right is through just judgment in a court executing the law of the country because if everyone applied his own law, we would live in jungle.
So it is a matter between states not between individuals because it touches the countries peace and state security.
do you agree with the people who've threatened to kill Terry Jones?As I said this is false news but if if if yes they are guilty because they throw horror in the hearts of innocent people and of course I don’t mean that criminal man but anyone one who hears a threat of death even if not to him, this makes him feel unsafe and this is against the principles of Islam.
How far do you take the word, "must?"Actually I mean should not must, sorry my English is bad.
I think I replied to all your question, may you reply to this simple question?
Who created you? How? And why?