72 virgins

[Iam]

Can anybody claim to think it would be heaven to be "given" 72 purpose built automaton virgins who revert to virginhood after sex? Can any sane person possibly consider that heaven?
(I hope I haven't broken rules)

[Burninglight]

@ Iam

If you don't moonlight as a standup comic you should, honestly I laugh beyond belief at your evasion attempts. It must be incredibly frightening when you meet someone who is scared of the god you've picked to believe in. 
Necrophilliac beastiality is the reward your god is going to make you desire when you die. Have fun with that. 
I think the scientologists have a much better fantasy, but then so does everybody even the hell scenario.

Have you answered my question?

We don't fear people Iam we fear All-Mighty God in which all Power, Sovereignty, Might, and Will belong. 

I am has a point concerning Islam. Even Abu Bakr Muhammad's right hand man said he couldn't trust the makr (Deception) of Allah if he had one foot in paradise and one on earth. Who wants to be with the "Best of Deceivers" and a god you cannot trust. He might let you fall in love with 72 grapws if you died for his cause like I am said about chopped liver. I would rather serve a God who loves me so much that he would send His beloved son as a gift of salvation. With islam's Allah, you'll never knoew if you did enough good or follow his rules cdlose enough. It sounds like you are getting a raw deal, and I am an atheist can see it and I a theist see it.
Of course God exists, but it makes all the difference on who is you God!

[HaLi8993]

@ Iam

What about these creatures you are going to have sexual relations with in paradise? Just want to ignore that? Since according to you whatever god is gonna give you in paradise he will also make you desire what he gives you. So he could give you chopped liver for your sexual partners and you would love the idea, cos god would make you love it. That is just so funny. Unfortunately that contradicts the two muslims in your video. 
Your god is SUPREMELY fearful and you want to spend eternity with it. Have you examined your sanity recently? I'm just asking, based upon what you've said. Oh BTW I don't fear your god now and I won't in the future, well after all he doesn't exist, but live your life in fear if that is the way for you. I'd just like to let you know that life really is wonderful without fear, you should try it.

Firstly Iam I'm not a man, secondly I'm not ignoring anything, this is one of the things God has promised men that will enter Paradise. What is the problem?? God is our Creator hence He is the One that knows what would be the best for us in this life and the Hereafter. I would love whatever my Lord loves for me. If the All-Mighty God says we will be happy, content, pleased and satisfied then we will. It is clear from your response that you don't know who God is. What is the contradiction? My sanity is perfectly fine it's you I'm worried about...just to let you know Iam, we as Muslims live between hope and fear. We are instructed to not go to extremes, if we have all fear and no hope that God forgives sins then this would be one extreme, on the other hand if you live your life based on complete hope with no fear then one will be negligent and will commit the worst of sins thinking his Lord will forgive him. 

[HaLi8993]

@ Burninglight

I am has a point concerning Islam. Even Abu Bakr Muhammad's right hand man said he couldn't trust the makr (Deception) of Allah if he had one foot in paradise and one on earth. Who wants to be with the "Best of Deceivers" and a god you cannot trust. He might let you fall in love with 72 grapws if you died for his cause like I am said about chopped liver. I would rather serve a God who loves me so much that he would send His beloved son as a gift of salvation. With islam's Allah, you'll never knoew if you did enough good or follow his rules cdlose enough. It sounds like you are getting a raw deal, and I am an atheist can see it and I a theist see it. 
Of course God exists, but it makes all the difference on who is you God!

Burniglight how many times have we been through  this lol, have you read Matthew 19:29?? Wishful thinking is not what will get you Paradise Burninglight, following God the way He commands will get you Paradise something that Christians do not do. Jesus (peace be upon him) was not God's son nor was he sent as a salvation for mankind. Something you cannot prove so I would be more concerned about this if anything, when this is one of the worst forms of blasphemy and things you could say about God. Jesus (peace be upon him) never said any of this, rather it was people who made this up to live a life of ease and comfort, free from any responsibilities or effort in worshipping God.

[Iam]

@ Iam

What about these creatures you are going to have sexual relations with in paradise? Just want to ignore that? Since according to you whatever god is gonna give you in paradise he will also make you desire what he gives you. So he could give you chopped liver for your sexual partners and you would love the idea, cos god would make you love it. That is just so funny. Unfortunately that contradicts the two muslims in your video. 
Your god is SUPREMELY fearful and you want to spend eternity with it. Have you examined your sanity recently? I'm just asking, based upon what you've said. Oh BTW I don't fear your god now and I won't in the future, well after all he doesn't exist, but live your life in fear if that is the way for you. I'd just like to let you know that life really is wonderful without fear, you should try it.

Firstly Iam I'm not a man, secondly I'm not ignoring anything, this is one of the things God has promised men that will enter Paradise. What is the problem?? God is our Creator hence He is the One that knows what would be the best for us in this life and the Hereafter. I would love whatever my Lord loves for me. If the All-Mighty God says we will be happy, content, pleased and satisfied then we will. It is clear from your response that you don't know who God is. What is the contradiction? My sanity is perfectly fine it's you I'm worried about...just to let you know Iam, we as Muslims live between hope and fear. We are instructed to not go to extremes, if we have all fear and no hope that God forgives sins then this would be one extreme, on the other hand if you live your life based on complete hope with no fear then one will be negligent and will commit the worst of sins thinking his Lord will forgive him. 

Firstly I apologise for misinterpreting your gender, it was unintentional, I'm sorry.

If God says men will look forward to this then they will

That would deny free will, that denies the capacity to desire anything. You will desire what god says you will desire, you will be good little robots, because that is the path you chose.
A man will desire to have sex with a walking brainless non-life because god says he will. Why do muslims so look forward (allegedly) to having in heaven everything that is Haraam on earth? From all of the conversations I have ever had with muslims the overriding god belief is FEAR and that includes you. If you are so afraid of your god why do you want to spend eternity with him? Is it the ultimate battered wife syndrome?

[Burninglight]

@ Burninglight

I am has a point concerning Islam. Even Abu Bakr Muhammad's right hand man said he couldn't trust the makr (Deception) of Allah if he had one foot in paradise and one on earth. Who wants to be with the "Best of Deceivers" and a god you cannot trust. He might let you fall in love with 72 grapws if you died for his cause like I am said about chopped liver. I would rather serve a God who loves me so much that he would send His beloved son as a gift of salvation. With islam's Allah, you'll never knoew if you did enough good or follow his rules cdlose enough. It sounds like you are getting a raw deal, and I am an atheist can see it and I a theist see it. 
Of course God exists, but it makes all the difference on who is you God!

Burniglight how many times have we been through  this lol, have you read Matthew 19:29?? Wishful thinking is not what will get you Paradise Burninglight, following God the way He commands will get you Paradise something that Christians do not do. Jesus (peace be upon him) was not God's son nor was he sent as a salvation for mankind. Something you cannot prove so I would be more concerned about this if anything, when this is one of the worst forms of blasphemy and things you could say about God. Jesus (peace be upon him) never said any of this, rather it was people who made this up to live a life of ease and comfort, free from any responsibilities or effort in worshipping God.

HaLi, thanks for sharing a response. Yes, you are right. We have been through this before. But you have to understand that equally deadly we Christians find of those who blaspheme saying God has no son and didn't die and rise from the dead for ours sin. Our God never said he was "the best of deceivers" Perhaps that is why Abu Bakr didn't trust Allah. I certainly don't and I am prepared to deal with the god of Islam in Jesus' name. The freedom you speak of that Christians have is not to do what we want but freedom to do what is right or God's will. Before He set us free, we were slaves of unrighteousness. We are no longer slaves but free! You are loved!

[HaLi8993]

@ Iam

Firstly I apologise for misinterpreting your gender, it was unintentional, I'm sorry.

No problem! this is very common.  

That would deny free will, that denies the capacity to desire anything. You will desire what god says you will desire, you will be good little robots, because that is the path you chose. 
A man will desire to have sex with a walking brainless non-life because god says he will. Why do muslims so look forward (allegedly) to having in heaven everything that is Haraam on earth? From all of the conversations I have ever had with muslims the overriding god belief is FEAR and that includes you. If you are so afraid of your god why do you want to spend eternity with him? Is it the ultimate battered wife syndrome?

The only person that would deny such a thing would be an Atheist or a person that would indicate that he is not aware of the true nature of the blessings that God will bestow upon the one for whom He decrees Paradise. The attributes of the women in Paradise that God has told us of makes the Muslim long to attain this blessing and bounty. The one who limits this bliss only to sex is making a mistake in his understanding of that blessing or is not appreciating it properly. 

This would be a  rejection of the bounty that God will bestow upon those that will enter Paradise, and He has told us of the state of bliss in which they will be. You should also note that Paradise is quite different from this world, there is nothing of this world. We desire only what God knows what will make us happy and content. If someone was to give you something you liked, would you reject this??? Certainly Not!!! 

With regard to the question about why Islam encourages and gives glad tidings of things in Paradise which are forbidden in this world, such as men having intimate relationships with women outside of the framework of marriage, we must understand that God forbids whatever He wills in this world to its people, for He is the Creator and Sovereign of these things, so it is not permissible for anyone to object to the ruling of God on the basis o foolish thinking and imperfect understanding. The ruling and the decision of the matter, before and after, is only with God, and there is none who can overturn His ruling, may He be glorified and exalted. We submit and show obedience to God.

The prohibition of things in this life may be a kind of test from God to see whether they will obey these commands and avoid that which He has forbidden. The test could not be with regard to something for which people have no inclination and which they do not like, it has to be with regard to something to which they are inclined and attracted. This testing may include wealth – will a person take from that which is permitted and dispose of it in manners which are permitted, and will he fulfil the rights which God has over it? The test with regard to women is, will he restrict himself to that which God has permitted him of women, and will he lower his gaze and avoid seeking pleasure in that which God has forbidden. It is an aspect of God's mercy – may He be exalted and glorified – that He does not forbid something to which people are inclined without allowing something of that nature and there is much which is permitted.

As I have stated in the past we live a life between hope and fear, and we wouldn't want to be with anyone else other than God in Paradise.

[HaLi8993]

@ Burninglight

HaLi, thanks for sharing a response. Yes, you are right. We have been through this before. But you have to understand that equally deadly we Christians find of those who blaspheme saying God has no son and didn't die and rise from the dead for ours sin. Our God never said he was "the best of deceivers" Perhaps that is why Abu Bakr didn't trust Allah. I certainly don't and I am prepared to deal with the god of Islam in Jesus' name. The freedom you speak of that Christians have is not to do what we want but freedom to do what is right or God's will. Before He set us free, we were slaves of unrighteousness. We are no longer slaves but free! You are loved!

Your always welcome Burninglight!

Burninglight if you could prove to me that God wants you to believe in such a thing then you would have something but the fact of the matter is that your own scripture does not want this from you nor did Jesus (peace and blessings be upon him) Instruct you to believe in any such thing. 

Yes, God deceives his enemies Burninglight, he is not with the enemy rather he is with the true believers aiding and protecting them. 

Abu Bakr didn't trust Allah??, now Burninglight where did you get that from?? Abu Bakr is in Paradise Burninglight. I bear witness that those will enter Paradise who the Messenger of Allaah bore witness that they would enter, such as the ten who were given the glad tidings of Paradise, Abu Bakr being one of them.

In Jesus' name?? This is one example of where Christianity went wrong - associating partners with God. Where is there any evidence for this? 

Who determines what is right Burninglight?? It is God All-Mighty hence why are you not following what has been made unlawful by God, why are you not following what Jesus (peace be upon him) came with and his teachings? You are right in saying you are no longer slaves, you are no longer slaves to God but the slaves of society thinking that Jesus (peace be upon him) died for your sins. We on the other hand are slaves of God. 

I will pray that God opens your eyes to the truth.

[Burninglight]

@ Burninglight

HaLi, thanks for sharing a response. Yes, you are right. We have been through this before. But you have to understand that equally deadly we Christians find of those who blaspheme saying God has no son and didn't die and rise from the dead for ours sin. Our God never said he was "the best of deceivers" Perhaps that is why Abu Bakr didn't trust Allah. I certainly don't and I am prepared to deal with the god of Islam in Jesus' name. The freedom you speak of that Christians have is not to do what we want but freedom to do what is right or God's will. Before He set us free, we were slaves of unrighteousness. We are no longer slaves but free! You are loved!

Your always welcome Burninglight!

Burninglight if you could prove to me that God wants you to believe in such a thing then you would have something but the fact of the matter is that your own scripture does not want this from you nor did Jesus (peace and blessings be upon him) Instruct you to believe in any such thing. 

Yes, God deceives his enemies Burninglight, he is not with the enemy rather he is with the true believers aiding and protecting them. 

Abu Bakr didn't trust Allah??, now Burninglight where did you get that from?? Abu Bakr is in Paradise Burninglight. I bear witness that those will enter Paradise who the Messenger of Allaah bore witness that they would enter, such as the ten who were given the glad tidings of Paradise, Abu Bakr being one of them.

In Jesus' name?? This is one example of where Christianity went wrong - associating partners with God. Where is there any evidence for this? 

Who determines what is right Burninglight?? It is God All-Mighty hence why are you not following what has been made unlawful by God, why are you not following what Jesus (peace be upon him) came with and his teachings? You are right in saying you are no longer slaves, you are no longer slaves to God but the slaves of society thinking that Jesus (peace be upon him) died for your sins. We on the other hand are slaves of God. 

I will pray that God opens your eyes to the truth.

Thanks for your heart felt response. The Scripture that comes to mind is Gal 3&4 I will quote only some of Gal 4

Yes, I was free from righteousness and now a slave of righteousness; for example: I mean like the Scripture say that the heir, as long as he is a child, is no different from a slave, though he is the owner of everything, 2 but he is under guardians and managers until the date set by his father. 3 In the same way we also, when we were children, were enslaved to the elementary principles of the world. 4 But when the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of woman, born under the law, 5 to redeem those who were under the law, so that we might receive adoption as sons. 6 And because you are sons, God has sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, crying, “Abba! Father!� 7 So you are no longer a slave, but a son, and if a son, then an heir through God.
Christians believe we can only be right with God by meeting Him on His terms.

It is only by grace through faith that God will make us heirs with Christ. The law cannot save us; it is a curse to us because we cannot keep it.

21 Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not listen to the law? 22 For it is written that Abraham had two sons, one by a slave woman and one by a free woman. 23 But the son of the slave was born according to the flesh, while the son of the free woman was born through promise. 24 Now this may be interpreted allegorically: these women are two covenants. One is from Mount Sinai, bearing children for slavery; she is Hagar. 25 Now Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia; she corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children. 26 But the Jerusalem above is free, and she is our mother. 27 For it is written,
“Rejoice, O barren one who does not bear;
break forth and cry aloud, you who are not in labor!
For the children of the desolate one will be more
than those of the one who has a husband.�
28 Now you, brothers, like Isaac, are children of promise. 29 But just as at that time he who was born according to the flesh persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, so also it is now. 30 But what does the Scripture say? “Cast out the slave woman and her son, for the son of the slave woman shall not inherit with the son of the free woman.� 31 So, brothers, we are not children of the slave but of the free woman.

I can clearly see this is talking Sarah and Hagar the slave woman. Ishmael rejected and Isaac the child of promise. Here we see a family feud between the seed of Ishmael and Isaac and the whole world is caught in the middle. This is why we have Judo Christianity and Islam at odds. Muhammad is from the seed of Ishmael and Jesus from the seed of Isaac and Jacob. Ishmael was no prophet. This is my worldview and it is Scriptural. Islam borrowed the virgin birth story from Christianity. The virgin birth is what makes Jesus special above other prophets.

God does not deceive anyone. He loves even His enemies and commands us to do the same. Love tells the truth even to its enemy. God operates in love and not deception. Satan is the father of lies and the author of confusion. Jesus is the word of G-d. Jesus is the word G-d used to speak all things into existence!

[Jacob Simonsky]

Can anybody claim to think it would be heaven to be "given" 72 purpose built automaton virgins who revert to virginhood after sex? Can any sane person possibly consider that heaven?
(I hope I haven't broken rules)

All religions reflect, more or less, the societies in which they appear. Islam is no exception. At the time of Mohammad the prophet the Arabic, Semitic people had existed in societies dating from the Acadians, Babylonians and back to ancient Sumer. These thousands of years are the sources of many things that seem strange to us. It takes time for nations to update their thinking and the parts of the world where these people are have always been very isolated. The business about 72 virgins is one such story/belief/idea that long predates Islam. We should be educated enough to know that things like these are nothing to do with religion, mono-theistic religion anyway. This particular belief might be a left-over from their pagan days. It's too bad really. One thing that Islam and Christianity do have in common is that both of them have members who are just plain crazy. A shame that these people do not understand the effect such out of date ideas have on we Westerners.

No. No sane person would think that something to do with heaven.

[Iam]

Can anybody claim to think it would be heaven to be "given" 72 purpose built automaton virgins who revert to virginhood after sex? Can any sane person possibly consider that heaven?
(I hope I haven't broken rules)

All religions reflect, more or less, the societies in which they appear. Islam is no exception. At the time of Mohammad the prophet the Arabic, Semitic people had existed in societies dating from the Acadians, Babylonians and back to ancient Sumer. These thousands of years are the sources of many things that seem strange to us. It takes time for nations to update their thinking and the parts of the world where these people are have always been very isolated. The business about 72 virgins is one such story/belief/idea that long predates Islam. We should be educated enough to know that things like these are nothing to do with religion, mono-theistic religion anyway. This particular belief might be a left-over from their pagan days. It's too bad really. One thing that Islam and Christianity do have in common is that both of them have members who are just plain crazy. A shame that these people do not understand the effect such out of date ideas have on we Westerners.

No. No sane person would think that something to do with heaven.

Islams paradise is for men. Just as their earth is. Everything that is haraam on earth is allowed in paradise for men. The religion of muhammad is a religion for men only as is their paradise.