Is the Qu'ran self-evidently true?paarsurrey wrote:Quran is self-evident, yes very truly.
Is the Qu'ran self-evidently true?
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McCulloch
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Is the Qu'ran self-evidently true?
Post #1Examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good.
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John
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Goat
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Re: Is the Qu'ran self-evidently true?
Post #2McCulloch wrote:Is the Qu'ran self-evidently true?paarsurrey wrote:Quran is self-evident, yes very truly.
Only if you believe it first.
I would love to see evidence of Djinn, as described in the Quran.
“What do you think science is? There is nothing magical about science. It is simply a systematic way for carefully and thoroughly observing nature and using consistent logic to evaluate results. So which part of that exactly do you disagree with? Do you disagree with being thorough? Using careful observation? Being systematic? Or using consistent logic?�
Steven Novella
Steven Novella
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Re: Is the Qu'ran self-evidently true?
Post #3Sûrat Al-Jinn
(The Jinn) LXXII
In the Name of Allâh,
the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful
1. Say (O Muhammad peace be ubon him): "It has been revealed to me that a group (from three to ten in number) of jinn[1] listened (to this Qur’ân). They said: ‘Verily, we have heard a wonderful Recitation (this Qur’ân)!
2. ‘It guides to the Right Path, and we have believed therein, and we shall never join (in worship) anything with our Lord (Allâh).
3. ‘And He, exalted be the Majesty of our Lord, has taken neither a wife nor a son (or offspring or children).[2]
4. ‘And that the foolish among us [i.e. Iblîs (Satan) or the polytheists amongst the jinn] used to utter against Allâh that which was an enormity in falsehood.
5. ‘And verily, we thought that men and jinn would not utter a lie against Allâh.
6. ‘And verily, there were men among mankind who took shelter with the males among the jinn, but they (jinn) increased them (mankind) in sin and transgression.
7. ‘And they thought as you thought, that Allâh will not send any Messenger (to mankind or jinn).
8. ‘And we have sought to reach the heaven; but found it filled with stern guards and flaming fires.
9. ‘And verily, we used to sit there in stations, to (steal) a hearing, but any who listens now will find a flaming fire watching him in ambush.
10. ‘And we know not whether evil is intended for those on earth, or whether their Lord intends for them a Right Path.
11. ‘There are among us some that are righteous, and some the contrary; we are groups having different ways (religious sects).
12. ‘And we think that we cannot escape (the punishment of) Allâh in the earth, nor can we escape Him by flight.
13. ‘And indeed when we heard the Guidance (this Qur’ân), we believed therein (Islâmic Monotheism), and whosoever believes in his Lord shall have no fear, either of a decrease in the reward of his good deeds or an increase in the punishment for his sins.
14. ‘And of us some are Muslims (who have submitted to Allâh, after listening to this Qur’ân), and of us some are Al-Qâsitûn (disbelievers - those who have deviated from the Right Path)’. And whosoever has embraced Islâm (i.e. has become a Muslim by submitting to Allâh), then such have sought the Right Path."
15. And as for the Qâsitûn (disbelievers who deviated from the Right Path), they shall be firewood for Hell,
16. If they (non-Muslims) had believed in Allâh, and went on the Right Way (i.e. Islâm) We would surely have bestowed on them water (rain) in abundance.
17. That We might try them thereby. And whosoever turns away from the Reminder of his Lord (i.e. this Qur’ân, - and practise not its laws and orders), He will cause him to enter in a severe torment (i.e. Hell).
18. And the mosques are for Allâh (Alone): so invoke not anyone along with Allâh.[1]
19. And when the slave of Allâh (Muhammad pbuh) stood up invoking Him (his Lord - Allâh) in prayer they (the jinn) just made round him a dense crowd as if sticking one over the other (in order to listen to the Prophet’s recitation).
20. Say (O Muhammad pbuh): "I invoke only my Lord (Allâh Alone), and I associate none as partners along with Him."
21. Say: "It is not in my power to cause you harm, or to bring you to the Right Path."
22. Say (O Muhammad pbuh): "None can protect me from Allâh’s punishment (if I were to disobey Him), nor can I find refuge except in Him.
23. "(Mine is) but conveyance (of the truth) from Allâh and His Messages (of Islâmic Monotheism), and whosoever disobeys Allâh and His Messenger, then Verily, for him is the Fire of Hell, he shall dwell therein forever."[2]
24. Till, when they see that which they are promised, then they will know who it is that is weaker concerning helpers and less important concerning numbers.
25. Say (O Muhammad pubh): "I know not whether (the punishment) which you are promised is near or whether my Lord will appoint for it a distant term.
26. "(He Alone is) the All-Knower of the Ghaib (Unseen), and He reveals to none His Ghaib (Unseen)."
27. Except to a Messenger (from mankind) whom He has chosen (He informs him of unseen as much as He likes), and then He makes a band of watching guards (angels) to march before him and behind him.
28. [He (Allâh) protects them (the Messengers)], till He sees that they (the Messengers) have conveyed the Messages of their Lord (Allâh). And He (Allâh) surrounds all that which is with them, and He (Allâh) keeps count of all things (i.e. He knows the exact number of everything).
(The Jinn) LXXII
In the Name of Allâh,
the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful
1. Say (O Muhammad peace be ubon him): "It has been revealed to me that a group (from three to ten in number) of jinn[1] listened (to this Qur’ân). They said: ‘Verily, we have heard a wonderful Recitation (this Qur’ân)!
2. ‘It guides to the Right Path, and we have believed therein, and we shall never join (in worship) anything with our Lord (Allâh).
3. ‘And He, exalted be the Majesty of our Lord, has taken neither a wife nor a son (or offspring or children).[2]
4. ‘And that the foolish among us [i.e. Iblîs (Satan) or the polytheists amongst the jinn] used to utter against Allâh that which was an enormity in falsehood.
5. ‘And verily, we thought that men and jinn would not utter a lie against Allâh.
6. ‘And verily, there were men among mankind who took shelter with the males among the jinn, but they (jinn) increased them (mankind) in sin and transgression.
7. ‘And they thought as you thought, that Allâh will not send any Messenger (to mankind or jinn).
8. ‘And we have sought to reach the heaven; but found it filled with stern guards and flaming fires.
9. ‘And verily, we used to sit there in stations, to (steal) a hearing, but any who listens now will find a flaming fire watching him in ambush.
10. ‘And we know not whether evil is intended for those on earth, or whether their Lord intends for them a Right Path.
11. ‘There are among us some that are righteous, and some the contrary; we are groups having different ways (religious sects).
12. ‘And we think that we cannot escape (the punishment of) Allâh in the earth, nor can we escape Him by flight.
13. ‘And indeed when we heard the Guidance (this Qur’ân), we believed therein (Islâmic Monotheism), and whosoever believes in his Lord shall have no fear, either of a decrease in the reward of his good deeds or an increase in the punishment for his sins.
14. ‘And of us some are Muslims (who have submitted to Allâh, after listening to this Qur’ân), and of us some are Al-Qâsitûn (disbelievers - those who have deviated from the Right Path)’. And whosoever has embraced Islâm (i.e. has become a Muslim by submitting to Allâh), then such have sought the Right Path."
15. And as for the Qâsitûn (disbelievers who deviated from the Right Path), they shall be firewood for Hell,
16. If they (non-Muslims) had believed in Allâh, and went on the Right Way (i.e. Islâm) We would surely have bestowed on them water (rain) in abundance.
17. That We might try them thereby. And whosoever turns away from the Reminder of his Lord (i.e. this Qur’ân, - and practise not its laws and orders), He will cause him to enter in a severe torment (i.e. Hell).
18. And the mosques are for Allâh (Alone): so invoke not anyone along with Allâh.[1]
19. And when the slave of Allâh (Muhammad pbuh) stood up invoking Him (his Lord - Allâh) in prayer they (the jinn) just made round him a dense crowd as if sticking one over the other (in order to listen to the Prophet’s recitation).
20. Say (O Muhammad pbuh): "I invoke only my Lord (Allâh Alone), and I associate none as partners along with Him."
21. Say: "It is not in my power to cause you harm, or to bring you to the Right Path."
22. Say (O Muhammad pbuh): "None can protect me from Allâh’s punishment (if I were to disobey Him), nor can I find refuge except in Him.
23. "(Mine is) but conveyance (of the truth) from Allâh and His Messages (of Islâmic Monotheism), and whosoever disobeys Allâh and His Messenger, then Verily, for him is the Fire of Hell, he shall dwell therein forever."[2]
24. Till, when they see that which they are promised, then they will know who it is that is weaker concerning helpers and less important concerning numbers.
25. Say (O Muhammad pubh): "I know not whether (the punishment) which you are promised is near or whether my Lord will appoint for it a distant term.
26. "(He Alone is) the All-Knower of the Ghaib (Unseen), and He reveals to none His Ghaib (Unseen)."
27. Except to a Messenger (from mankind) whom He has chosen (He informs him of unseen as much as He likes), and then He makes a band of watching guards (angels) to march before him and behind him.
28. [He (Allâh) protects them (the Messengers)], till He sees that they (the Messengers) have conveyed the Messages of their Lord (Allâh). And He (Allâh) surrounds all that which is with them, and He (Allâh) keeps count of all things (i.e. He knows the exact number of everything).
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Fallibleone
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Post #4
I think that goat meant that the Djinn are described in a certain way in the Qur'an, and that he would like to see evidence of these beings.
I take it you haven't got any EVIDENCE of Djinn.
I take it you haven't got any EVIDENCE of Djinn.
''''What I am is good enough if I can only be it openly.''''
''''The man said "why you think you here?" I said "I got no idea".''''
''''Je viens comme un chat
Par la nuit si noire.
Tu attends, et je tombe
Dans tes ailes blanches,
Et je vole,
Et je coule
Comme une plume.''''
''''The man said "why you think you here?" I said "I got no idea".''''
''''Je viens comme un chat
Par la nuit si noire.
Tu attends, et je tombe
Dans tes ailes blanches,
Et je vole,
Et je coule
Comme une plume.''''
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CONVERTED TO ISLAM
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Post #5
[quote="Fallibleone"]I think that goat meant that the Djinn are described in a certain way in the Qur'an, and that he would like to see evidence of these beings.
I take it you haven't got any EVIDENCE of Djinn.[/quote
what is magic then ?
when somebody fly or walk in the water what will you call that ?
watch ( chris angel ) to make sure
who helped him to make that
it,s the dijinn
I take it you haven't got any EVIDENCE of Djinn.[/quote
what is magic then ?
when somebody fly or walk in the water what will you call that ?
watch ( chris angel ) to make sure
who helped him to make that
it,s the dijinn
Post #6
CONVERTED TO ISLAM wrote:I know it's against the rules but WOW. I guess someone never has seen one of those secrets of the magicians shows. Looks like P.T. Barnum was right.Fallibleone wrote:I think that goat meant that the Djinn are described in a certain way in the Qur'an, and that he would like to see evidence of these beings.
I take it you haven't got any EVIDENCE of Djinn.[/quote
what is magic then ?
when somebody fly or walk in the water what will you call that ?
watch ( chris angel ) to make sure
who helped him to make that
it,s the dijinn
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CONVERTED TO ISLAM
- Scholar
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- Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 10:02 am
Post #7
Wyvern wrote:i do not know what are you talking aboutCONVERTED TO ISLAM wrote:I know it's against the rules but WOW. I guess someone never has seen one of those secrets of the magicians shows. Looks like P.T. Barnum was right.Fallibleone wrote:I think that goat meant that the Djinn are described in a certain way in the Qur'an, and that he would like to see evidence of these beings.
I take it you haven't got any EVIDENCE of Djinn.[/quote
what is magic then ?
when somebody fly or walk in the water what will you call that ?
watch ( chris angel ) to make sure
who helped him to make that
it,s the dijinn
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Fallibleone
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Post #8
Wyvern is talking about some TV shows which go to great lengths to explain how magicians perform their tricks.
I once more note that you have no evidence of Djinn. Thank you.what is magic then ?
when somebody fly or walk in the water what will you call that ?
watch ( chris angel ) to make sure
who helped him to make that
it,s the dijinn
''''What I am is good enough if I can only be it openly.''''
''''The man said "why you think you here?" I said "I got no idea".''''
''''Je viens comme un chat
Par la nuit si noire.
Tu attends, et je tombe
Dans tes ailes blanches,
Et je vole,
Et je coule
Comme une plume.''''
''''The man said "why you think you here?" I said "I got no idea".''''
''''Je viens comme un chat
Par la nuit si noire.
Tu attends, et je tombe
Dans tes ailes blanches,
Et je vole,
Et je coule
Comme une plume.''''
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manofstyle
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- Location: California
Post #9
You must be joking... (he's joking right??)CONVERTED TO ISLAM wrote: what is magic then ?
when somebody fly or walk in the water what will you call that ?
watch ( chris angel ) to make sure
who helped him to make that
it,s the dijinn
Just in case, look here:
or here
Surely if Chris Angel could walk on water or float, he would not need cheap gimmicks to pull off simple tricks like these?? That isn't the Dijinn right? or is it?
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TrueReligion
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Re: Is the Qu'ran self-evidently true?
Post #10Are Jinns only mention in Quran or in other scriptures like hinduism, bible and torait as well?goat wrote:McCulloch wrote:Is the Qu'ran self-evidently true?paarsurrey wrote:Quran is self-evident, yes very truly.
Only if you believe it first.
I would love to see evidence of Djinn, as described in the Quran.
