Hell's Immigrants

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WebersHome
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Re: Hell's Immigrants

Post #141

Post by WebersHome »

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I didn't set this thread up intending for it to be a venue for testimonies, they're off-topic; but what the hay; maybe it's time for an intermission.

I was christened an infant into the Roman Catholic Church in 1944, and eventually attended catechism to complete First Holy Communion and Confirmation.

My siblings are Catholic, my mother was Catholic, my eldest brother entered the priesthood and made it to the rank of Friar before passing away in May 2018 of cancer. (Though he was a Friar, my brother was no saint. He had a problem with alcohol till AA helped straighten him out). My wife is a former Catholic, her dad was Catholic, his wife was Catholic, my aunt and uncle were Catholics, and my wife's cousins are Catholic; one of them is qualified to teach Catechism.

I was loyal to Rome up until I was 24, then one day I was approached by a Conservative Baptist minister who asked me if I was prepared for Christ's return.

Well; I must've been either asleep or absent the day that the nuns talked about Jesus coming back because that man's question was the very first time in my whole life that I can remember somebody telling me.

My initial reaction was alarm because I instinctively knew that were I called on the carpet for a face-to-face with Jesus, it would not go well for me because I had a lot to answer for. Well; I don't like being made to feel afraid so I became indignant and demanded to know why Jesus would come back. That's when I found out for the very first time that it was in the plan for Christ to take over the world. (I had somehow missed that in catechism too.)

Then the minister asked me if I was going to heaven. Well; of course I had no clue because Catholics honestly don't know what to expect when they pass away. I was crossing my fingers while in the back of my mind dreading the worst.

Then the man said; "Don't you know that Jesus died for your sins?"

Well; I had been taught in catechism that Jesus died for the sins of the world; that much I knew; but honestly believed all along that he had been a victim of unfortunate circumstances. It was a shock to discover that Jesus' trip to the cross was deliberate, and that his Father was thinking of me when His son passed away, viz: my sins were among the sins of the world that Jesus took to the cross with him.

At that very instant-- scarcely a nanosecond --something took over in my mind as I fully realized, to my great relief, that heaven was no longer out of reach, rather, well within my grasp!

That was an amazing experience. In just the two or three minutes of conversation with that Baptist minister, I obtained an understanding of Jesus' crucifixion that many tedious years of catechism classes had somehow failed to get across. Consequently, my confidence in the Roman Catholic Church was shattered like a bar of peanut brittle candy dropped on the sidewalk from the tippy top of the Chrysler building.

Long story short; I eventually went with that man to his church and, side by side with him and a couple of elders, knelt at the rail down front and prayed a really simple, naive prayer that went something like this;

"God, I know I'm a sinner. I would like to take advantage of your son's death"

My prayer wasn't much to brag about; but it was the smartest sixteen words I'd ever spoken up to that time.

†. Matt 10:32 . .Whoever acknowledges me before men, I will also acknowledge him before my Father in heaven.

Immigration Update: 1,036 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 62,995,016 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 18, 2017.
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Last edited by WebersHome on Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Hell's Immigrants

Post #142

Post by WebersHome »

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†. Matt 19:17 . . And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments

Seeing as none but God are good, then it's obvious that none but God can enter into life by means of goodness. However, if someone would like to give it a try anyway in spite of the fact that failure is a foregone conclusion; then Jesus suggests they begin their quest with the commandments.

Immigration Update: 1,057 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 64,271,942 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 18, 2017.
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Last edited by WebersHome on Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Hell's Immigrants

Post #143

Post by WebersHome »

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It's not unlikely that all new arrivals in heaven are immediately shuttled off to quarantine in a sort of boot camp where they're indoctrinated with the 100% correct interpretation of the Bible so there'll be no debating with the general population when they get out.

Also, in boot camp, they're schooled in etiquette because people just in from the world can't expect they'll fit right into heaven's peaceful society upon arrival. I'd imagine that those of us who make it to heaven will need some pretty large adjustments made to our manners; most of all, how to keep a genuinely civil tongue in our heads.

"Let your conversation be always full of grace, seasoned with salt." (Col 4:6)

Grace can be defined as kind, courteous, gentle, patient, lenient, inclined to good will, generous, charitable, altruistic, compassionate, sympathetic, thoughtful, cordial, affable, genial, sociable, cheerful, warm, sensitive, hospitable, considerate, and tactful.

I gather from the language and grammar of Matt 5:13, Mark 9:50, and Luke 14:34 that the primary purpose of salt is to enhance flavor and make otherwise naturally insipid and/or bad-tasting things palatable, viz: salt can be thought of as diplomacy; roughly defined as conversation that makes an effort to maintain peace rather than provoke conflict and/or annoy people and make them uncomfortable.

I doubt there's need of a boot camp for new arrivals in Hell as I suspect everyone destined for that place will fit right in down there just as naturally as a bug in a rug.

Immigration Update: 1,066 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 64,819,196 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since Sept 18, 2017.
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Re: Hell's Immigrants

Post #144

Post by WebersHome »

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Rom 8:9-11 . . If anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. But if Christ is in you, your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness. And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit, who lives in you.

FAQ: What if someone doesn't have the Spirit of Christ?

A: Then, as the passage says: they do not belong to Christ, i.e. they are not his sheep; ergo: Christ cannot guarantee their safety; they'll have to face the afterlife on their own when they pass on.

Immigration Update: 1,093 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 66,460,958 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 18, 2017.
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Re: Hell's Immigrants

Post #145

Post by WebersHome »

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Is this the real life?
Is this just fantasy?
Caught in a landslide,
No escape from reality.

Bohemian Rhapsody
Freddy Mercury
QUEEN, 1975


Immigration Update: 1,102 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 67,008,212 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 18, 2017.
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Re: Hell's Immigrants

Post #146

Post by WebersHome »

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Matt 8:11-12 . . I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven. But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Outer darkness is again spoken of in Matt 22:13 and Matt 25:30

It appears, from comparison of the available data, that "outer darkness" isn't a location, rather, a state of mind characterized by the deepest possible feelings of anguish and grief associated with loss.

It's akin to the day that God announced to Moses' people they were going to have to stay in that awful Sinai outback until they were dead. They missed their opportunity to enter the land of milk and honey and there was no way to regain it.

The people must've been pretty upset over that; no doubt they had all been joyfully looking forward to a new life over there; and there was no use in praying about it because God had made up His mind.

I've only experienced deep personal grief associated with irreversible loss but one time; that was when my No.1 nephew passed away suddenly of natural causes at the age of 51. I had held him in my arms upon returning home from three years in the Army when he was only a couple of weeks old.

News of his passing has thus far been the only time in my 76 years that I actually clenched my teeth, sobbing out of control, and choking, while clinging to a handrail in the front room to keep from losing my balance and falling to the floor.

Fortunately my wife was out on an errand at the time or she would've been very frightened as she has never seen me in such a state even once during our nearly 41 years of marriage.

Immigration Update: 1,117 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 67,920,302 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 18, 2017.
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Re: Hell's Immigrants

Post #147

Post by WebersHome »

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The criminal records associated with the great white throne event depicted at Rev 20:11-15 likely won't be used only to condemn people's actions, but also to prove that the people themselves are not the kind of folk with whom God prefers to associate.

For example; God isn't comfortable with dishonesty. So if the records show that someone was deceptive and/or told a number lies during their lifetime, then they will be barred from heaven; not only for their dishonesty, but also because they are capable of dishonesty.

Matt 15:19 . . For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, slanders.

Immigration Update: 1,120 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 68,102,720 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 18, 2017.
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Re: Hell's Immigrants

Post #148

Post by WebersHome »

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Eddie Van Halen passed away recently. He was a Roman Catholic. It's not easy to get into heaven via that version of Christianity.

Well; if perchance Eddie didn't make the cut (not saying he didn't; only saying "if perchance") then he will never again be allowed to even so much as see a guitar let alone pick one up with his hands.

Can you imagine a talented, pioneering musician like Eddie never again allowed to do the one thing in life that he enjoyed the most? I mean never again like as in permanently.

Immigration Update: 1,125 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 68,406,750 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 18, 2017.
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Re: Hell's Immigrants

Post #149

Post by WebersHome »

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FAQ: The New Testament says that the lost will be put to death in a lake of brimstone. (Rev 20:11-15.) If that's so, then why is it commonly believed that they will suffer till time without end? Don't people have to be alive in order to experience suffering?

A: People's body and soul are slated for destruction in hell fire (Matt 10:28) but I have yet to encounter a New Testament passage verifying that people's consciousness will be destroyed.

FAQ: How can people be conscious when they're dead? Isn't death eo ipso a state of unconsciousness?

A: I've been under anesthesia a number of times for surgery; and every time I was totally unaware of anything going on around me and/or done to my body with knives, needles, saws, probes, and tubes. But I have never been dead so I cannot speak from experience about consciousness in that condition. All I know about existence after death is what I read about it in the Bible.

Matt 10:28 speaks of a human's body and soul. It says nothing of a human's third component: their spirit (1Thess 5:23). I suspect that the spirit is where a human's consciousness resides when they pass away. If so, then the dead floating around in the lake of brimstone, like apples in a bobbing tub, will be aware of their condition, but of course imprisoned in a corpse; thus in a state of total paralysis head to toe.

You know, at least zombies retain some mobility, but the people slated for that lake of brimstone won't be able to move even so much as a pinky finger; plus their corpse eyes won't work so they'll be blind.

A very disturbing movie scene I watched several years ago showed a man captured by cannibals. The women of the village encased the man alive inside a thick mud cocoon and suspended him over an open fire like a pig on a spit. The poor man slowly baked to death inside that cocoon all alone and in total darkness. You could hear his muffled screams coming out of a hollow reed that the women had put in his mouth to breathe with so he wouldn't pass out from asphyxiation under all that mud.

Immigration Update: 1,128 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 68,589,168 new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of hades since Sept 18, 2017.
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