https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marcionism
https://jesuswordsonly.com/recommendedr ... onism.html
Marcion 144 AD Heretic or Christian?
Moderator: Moderators
-
Yahwehismywitness
- Scholar
- Posts: 332
- Joined: Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:26 am
- Been thanked: 1 time
-
Yahwehismywitness
- Scholar
- Posts: 332
- Joined: Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:26 am
- Been thanked: 1 time
Post #11
Jesus said follow him Matthew 16:24-26
Jesus was water baptized - Matthew Matthew 3:13-17
Tertullian, an orthodox church member in Carthage, Africa, wrote in 207 A.D. his famous rebuttal to Marcion. In it, Tertullian raised every ground possible to dispute whether Paul was truly an apostle of Jesus. Tertullian even sugÂgested Paul was a false prophet as warned of by Jesus. Tertullian. says that Paul’s claim to apostleship is totally self-serving, and by Jesus’ standards is invalid. Scholars generally now recognize this is a valid criticism of Paul’s claims. In the end, Tertullian even suggested “[Paul] is the apostle of the heretics.â€� (TertulÂlian, Adversus Marcion 3:5, “haereticorum apostolusâ€�.)
https://books.google.com/books?id=3VFns ... us&f=false
Jesus was water baptized - Matthew Matthew 3:13-17
Tertullian, an orthodox church member in Carthage, Africa, wrote in 207 A.D. his famous rebuttal to Marcion. In it, Tertullian raised every ground possible to dispute whether Paul was truly an apostle of Jesus. Tertullian even sugÂgested Paul was a false prophet as warned of by Jesus. Tertullian. says that Paul’s claim to apostleship is totally self-serving, and by Jesus’ standards is invalid. Scholars generally now recognize this is a valid criticism of Paul’s claims. In the end, Tertullian even suggested “[Paul] is the apostle of the heretics.â€� (TertulÂlian, Adversus Marcion 3:5, “haereticorum apostolusâ€�.)
https://books.google.com/books?id=3VFns ... us&f=false
-
Yahwehismywitness
- Scholar
- Posts: 332
- Joined: Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:26 am
- Been thanked: 1 time
Post #12
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irenaeus
Irenaeus asserted that four Gospels, Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John, were canonical scripture.[40] Thus Irenaeus provides the earliest witness to the assertion of the four canonical Gospels, possibly in reaction to Marcion's edited version of the Gospel of Luke, which Marcion asserted was the one and only true gospel.[8][26]
Based on the arguments Irenaeus made in support of only four authentic gospels, some interpreters deduce that the fourfold Gospel must have still been a novelty in Irenaeus' time.[41] Against Heresies 3.11.7 acknowledges that many heterodox Christians use only one gospel while 3.11.9 acknowledges that some use more than four.
Irenaeus asserted that four Gospels, Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John, were canonical scripture.[40] Thus Irenaeus provides the earliest witness to the assertion of the four canonical Gospels, possibly in reaction to Marcion's edited version of the Gospel of Luke, which Marcion asserted was the one and only true gospel.[8][26]
Based on the arguments Irenaeus made in support of only four authentic gospels, some interpreters deduce that the fourfold Gospel must have still been a novelty in Irenaeus' time.[41] Against Heresies 3.11.7 acknowledges that many heterodox Christians use only one gospel while 3.11.9 acknowledges that some use more than four.
-
Yahwehismywitness
- Scholar
- Posts: 332
- Joined: Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:26 am
- Been thanked: 1 time
Post #13
James and the Ebionites
Eusebius records that Clement of Alexandria wrote that Peter, James and John chose James, the brother of Jesus, as bishop of Jerusalem, but Eusebius also subjects James to the authority of all the apostles.
They regarded Jesus of Nazareth as the Messiah while rejecting his divinity and his virgin birth[2] and insisted on the necessity of following Jewish law and rites.[3] They used only one of the Jewish–Christian gospels, the Hebrew Book of Matthew starting at chapter three; revered James, the brother of Jesus (James the Just); and rejected Paul the Apostle as an apostate from the Law.[4] Their name suggests that they placed a special value on voluntary poverty. Ebionim was one of the terms used by the sect at Qumran who sought to separate themselves from the corruption of the Temple. Many believe that the Qumran sectarians were Essenes.[5]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ebionites
Eusebius records that Clement of Alexandria wrote that Peter, James and John chose James, the brother of Jesus, as bishop of Jerusalem, but Eusebius also subjects James to the authority of all the apostles.
They regarded Jesus of Nazareth as the Messiah while rejecting his divinity and his virgin birth[2] and insisted on the necessity of following Jewish law and rites.[3] They used only one of the Jewish–Christian gospels, the Hebrew Book of Matthew starting at chapter three; revered James, the brother of Jesus (James the Just); and rejected Paul the Apostle as an apostate from the Law.[4] Their name suggests that they placed a special value on voluntary poverty. Ebionim was one of the terms used by the sect at Qumran who sought to separate themselves from the corruption of the Temple. Many believe that the Qumran sectarians were Essenes.[5]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ebionites
-
Yahwehismywitness
- Scholar
- Posts: 332
- Joined: Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:26 am
- Been thanked: 1 time
Post #14
Paul said James, Cephas and John to remember the poor (Ebion) in Jerusalem
Galatians 2:9-10.
Matthew 5:42 Give to everyone who asks you for something. Don’t turn anyone away who wants to borrow something from you.
27. Deuteronomy 15:7-8 If there should be a poor Ebion) man among your relatives in one of the cities of the land that the Lord your God is about to give you, don’t be hard-hearted or tight-fisted toward your poor relative. Instead, be sure to open your hand to him and lend him enough to lessen his need.
Matthew 19:21 Jesus said to him, “If you would be perfect, go, sell what you possess and give to the poor, (Ebion) and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow me.�
Galatians 2:9-10.
Matthew 5:42 Give to everyone who asks you for something. Don’t turn anyone away who wants to borrow something from you.
27. Deuteronomy 15:7-8 If there should be a poor Ebion) man among your relatives in one of the cities of the land that the Lord your God is about to give you, don’t be hard-hearted or tight-fisted toward your poor relative. Instead, be sure to open your hand to him and lend him enough to lessen his need.
Matthew 19:21 Jesus said to him, “If you would be perfect, go, sell what you possess and give to the poor, (Ebion) and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow me.�
-
Yahwehismywitness
- Scholar
- Posts: 332
- Joined: Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:26 am
- Been thanked: 1 time
Post #15
THE EBIONITES AND NAZARENES...& RESISTANCE TO Saul/PAUL
The "Jerusalem Church" itself has a sad history. This has been obscured by the Church legend, found in Eusebius and later in Epiphanius, that before the Jewish War against Rome broke out in AD 66 the whole Nazarene community, warned by an oracle, left Jerusalem and went to Pella in Transjordania. "The flight to Pella" is merely a legend has been well demonstrated by S. F. G. Brandon, and confirmed by later research. The Jerusalem Nazarenes never left the city at the time of the Jewish War; they stayed there and played their part, as loyal Jews, in the fight against Rome. When the Jews were broken by the Romans and their Temple destroyed in AD 70, the Jewish Christians shared in the horrors of the defeat, and the Jerusalem Nazarenes were dispersed to Caesarea and other cities, even as far as Alexandria in Egypt. Its power and influence as the Mother Church and centre of the Jesus movement was ended; and the Pauline Christian movement, which up to AD 66 had been struggling to survive against the strong disapproval of Jerusalem, now began to make great headway. It was not until nearly seventy years later that a Christian Church was reconstituted in Jerusalem, after the city had been devastated by the Romans for the second time (after the Bar Kokhba revolt) and rebuilt as a Gentile city called Aelia Capitolina. This new Gentile Pauline Christian Church in Jerusalem had no continuity with the early "Jerusalem Church" led by James. Its members were Gentiles, as Eusebius testifies, and its doctrines were those of Pauline Christianity. It attempted, however, to claim continuity with the early "Jerusalem Church," in accordance with the Pauline policy (evinced in the New Testament book of Acts) of denying the rift between Paul and the Jerusalem elders. The Pella legend was developed in order to give color to this alleged continuity, since some of the members of the new Church had come from Pella. Jerusalem, however, never regained its former centrality. In the now dominant Pauline Christian Church, the centre was Rome; while the descendants of the former proud "Jerusalem Church," now scattered and poor (for which reason, probably, they acquired the nickname of "Ebionites," from the Hebrew evyonim, meaning "poor men") were despised as heretics, since they refused to accept the doctrines of Paul.
Another name by which these later Jewish Christians were known, according to the Church historians, was "Nazarenes." This name goes back to very early times, for it is found in the New Testament itself, not only applying to Jesus ("Jesus the Nazarene") but also (Acts 24:5) to the members of the "Jerusalem Church," in the denunciation by the High Priest. It seems, then, that "Nazarenes" was the original name for the followers of Jesus; the name "Christians" was a later development, not in Jerusalem but in Antioch (Acts 11:26). In the Jewish rabbinical writings, the name used for Jesusµ followers is similar to "Nazarenes," i.e. notzerim. Whether this name is derived from Jesus' place of birth, Nazareth, or from some other source, is a matter of scholarly debate. But it is clear that the survival of this name in sects of the third and fourth centuries points to continuity between these sects and the original followers of Jesus in Jerusalem. Various theories have been put forward as to why some Jewish Christian sects were called Nazarenes, while others were called Ebionites. The best solution seems to be that the original name was Nazarenes, but at some point they were given the name Ebionites, as a derogatory nickname, which, however, some of them adopted with pride, since its meaning, "poor men," was a reminder of Jesus' saying, "Blessed are the poor," and also of his and James' sayings against the rich.
Nevertheless, it does seem from the rather confused accounts given by the Church historians that the Jewish Christians, as time went on, split into various sects, some of which strayed far from the tenets of the original Nazarenes. Thus we read of certain Gnostic Ebionites, of whom the founding father was Cerinthus, who combined belief in the humanity of Jesus and in the validity of the Torah with a Gnostic belief in a Demiurge ("creator") and a High God. We also read of certain Nazarenes who believed in the Torah, but also believed in the virgin birth of Jesus and in his divine nature. These sects, however, arose by attrition of the original beliefs of the Nazarenes; for the isolation of the Nazarenes from both Christianity and Judaism subjected them to pressures which could give rise to some strange mixed or synthetic forms.
The Ebionites did not survive for the simple reason that they were persecuted out of existence by the Gentile Catholic Church
The "Jerusalem Church" itself has a sad history. This has been obscured by the Church legend, found in Eusebius and later in Epiphanius, that before the Jewish War against Rome broke out in AD 66 the whole Nazarene community, warned by an oracle, left Jerusalem and went to Pella in Transjordania. "The flight to Pella" is merely a legend has been well demonstrated by S. F. G. Brandon, and confirmed by later research. The Jerusalem Nazarenes never left the city at the time of the Jewish War; they stayed there and played their part, as loyal Jews, in the fight against Rome. When the Jews were broken by the Romans and their Temple destroyed in AD 70, the Jewish Christians shared in the horrors of the defeat, and the Jerusalem Nazarenes were dispersed to Caesarea and other cities, even as far as Alexandria in Egypt. Its power and influence as the Mother Church and centre of the Jesus movement was ended; and the Pauline Christian movement, which up to AD 66 had been struggling to survive against the strong disapproval of Jerusalem, now began to make great headway. It was not until nearly seventy years later that a Christian Church was reconstituted in Jerusalem, after the city had been devastated by the Romans for the second time (after the Bar Kokhba revolt) and rebuilt as a Gentile city called Aelia Capitolina. This new Gentile Pauline Christian Church in Jerusalem had no continuity with the early "Jerusalem Church" led by James. Its members were Gentiles, as Eusebius testifies, and its doctrines were those of Pauline Christianity. It attempted, however, to claim continuity with the early "Jerusalem Church," in accordance with the Pauline policy (evinced in the New Testament book of Acts) of denying the rift between Paul and the Jerusalem elders. The Pella legend was developed in order to give color to this alleged continuity, since some of the members of the new Church had come from Pella. Jerusalem, however, never regained its former centrality. In the now dominant Pauline Christian Church, the centre was Rome; while the descendants of the former proud "Jerusalem Church," now scattered and poor (for which reason, probably, they acquired the nickname of "Ebionites," from the Hebrew evyonim, meaning "poor men") were despised as heretics, since they refused to accept the doctrines of Paul.
Another name by which these later Jewish Christians were known, according to the Church historians, was "Nazarenes." This name goes back to very early times, for it is found in the New Testament itself, not only applying to Jesus ("Jesus the Nazarene") but also (Acts 24:5) to the members of the "Jerusalem Church," in the denunciation by the High Priest. It seems, then, that "Nazarenes" was the original name for the followers of Jesus; the name "Christians" was a later development, not in Jerusalem but in Antioch (Acts 11:26). In the Jewish rabbinical writings, the name used for Jesusµ followers is similar to "Nazarenes," i.e. notzerim. Whether this name is derived from Jesus' place of birth, Nazareth, or from some other source, is a matter of scholarly debate. But it is clear that the survival of this name in sects of the third and fourth centuries points to continuity between these sects and the original followers of Jesus in Jerusalem. Various theories have been put forward as to why some Jewish Christian sects were called Nazarenes, while others were called Ebionites. The best solution seems to be that the original name was Nazarenes, but at some point they were given the name Ebionites, as a derogatory nickname, which, however, some of them adopted with pride, since its meaning, "poor men," was a reminder of Jesus' saying, "Blessed are the poor," and also of his and James' sayings against the rich.
Nevertheless, it does seem from the rather confused accounts given by the Church historians that the Jewish Christians, as time went on, split into various sects, some of which strayed far from the tenets of the original Nazarenes. Thus we read of certain Gnostic Ebionites, of whom the founding father was Cerinthus, who combined belief in the humanity of Jesus and in the validity of the Torah with a Gnostic belief in a Demiurge ("creator") and a High God. We also read of certain Nazarenes who believed in the Torah, but also believed in the virgin birth of Jesus and in his divine nature. These sects, however, arose by attrition of the original beliefs of the Nazarenes; for the isolation of the Nazarenes from both Christianity and Judaism subjected them to pressures which could give rise to some strange mixed or synthetic forms.
The Ebionites did not survive for the simple reason that they were persecuted out of existence by the Gentile Catholic Church
